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-   -   Durability of matte finish (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=1141079)

dvai 04-12-18 07:46 PM

Durability of matte finish
 
I was looking into a Trek model that comes with matte pain. Looks really nice, but I wonder how will hold over time and if it's more difficult to maintain Vs. the regular coated pain.

Cars with Matte pain are tougher to maintain.

I know there are several products for detailing matte paint, but I wonder how will hold over time.

GeneO 04-12-18 08:55 PM

Yes you have to be careful not to use certain polishing or waxing compounds.
If you use any attached bags or other attached equipment that rubs against the paint (like a top tube bag etc.), the finish will wear smooth and be shiny instead of matte.

kbarch 04-13-18 04:29 AM

Seems to me that any level of sheen will loose its "like new" look at about the same rate. Shiny gets dull and dull gets shiny, but what really makes something look less fresh is the eventual inconsistency of the finish, because every point on the frame is not subject to the same level of wear or exposure.

WhyFi 04-13-18 06:23 AM

I bought a Trek with a matte finish a few months ago and, if I could do it again and I had a choice (I didn't), I'd go with a glossy finish. The matte finish shows off dirt and grease like that's it main priority, particularly around the fork/headtube junction and the BB. That said, my paint job is a lighter color (Domane Gravel), so maybe darker colors are a little less susceptible.

Zaskar 04-13-18 07:24 AM

Matte finishes kinda suck. They will actually get stains more like fabric than painted finishes. One of my bikes has a frame with a black and white matte finish. There are spots of mud on the white (probably the black too) - red clay - that won't come off. I've used several cleaners... still there.

Plain old grease is a problem too - you have be very careful how you clean/wipe the bike. Example: that little bit of crud that forms at the headtube-fork... that must be wiped side to side - not up or down. If the grime is smeared onto the headtube or fork... it takes a few minutes with a degreaser to get the smudges off. So, you can imagine the chainstays.

If you do get a matte finish, look into coating the frame with a paint sealant. I did this with my newer Scott Foil and it makes clean up much easier.

I used an automotive coating - CQuartz on the Foil. It made a very small change to the sheen - like maybe 5% more gloss. But, grease and bugs, etc. wipe off much easier.

[IMG]https://i.imgur.com/UdgRChu.png[/IMG]

Johnny Rad 04-15-18 09:05 AM


Originally Posted by WhyFi (Post 20281811)
I bought a Trek with a matte finish a few months ago and, if I could do it again and I had a choice (I didn't), I'd go with a glossy finish. The matte finish shows off dirt and grease like that's it main priority, particularly around the fork/headtube junction and the BB.


Originally Posted by Zaskar (Post 20281899)
Matte finishes kinda suck. They will actually get stains more like fabric than painted finishes... Plain old grease is a problem too...

Well put. As someone on his second season with a black matte frame (a Scott like Zaskar), you two speak the truth. The best cure -sadly - is to stop worrying and just let it be, which admittedly took more than a little time for me.

WhyFi 04-15-18 09:11 AM


Originally Posted by Johnny Rad (Post 20285292)
Well put. As someone on his second season with a black matte frame (a Scott like Zaskar), you two speak the truth. The best cure -sadly - is to stop worrying and just let it be, which admittedly took more than a little time for me.

My Trek is a "Gravel' model, so I figure that that gives me a little more leeway with the grubbiness. Hell, maybe I should think of the dirt and grime as a badge of honor. :innocent:

GlennR 04-15-18 02:15 PM

I have 3 years and 18,000 miles on my Trek with a matte finish.

It holds just just fine.

https://i.imgur.com/zbrdUem.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/byfaNn4.jpg

WhyFi 04-15-18 02:20 PM

^^^ Your definition of matte finish is different than mine.

GlennR 04-15-18 02:28 PM


Originally Posted by WhyFi (Post 20285914)
^^^ Your definition of matte finish is different than mine.

That's what Trek calls it.

The paint is rather thin and just rubbing it against something can wear the paint off.

Maybe it looks more "matte" from a distance. There certainly isn't a clear coat on it.

http://glenn-ring.com/emonda/preserve.jpg

WhyFi 04-15-18 02:38 PM

You've got a lot more reflecting going on than on mine, regardless of what Trek calls it (it looks more like a satin finish, to me).

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/889/39...8b6f5641_b.jpg

And here's an illustration of the lovely way that dirt and grease rubs right in to the pores of the finish -

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/866/26...629d4fe8_b.jpg

GlennR 04-15-18 02:41 PM

Might be that I clean it every 150 miles or so with a 10:1 mixtures of water to Simple Green.

Yours is much "flat"er than mine.

Might be the sun and there is a almost metallic that sparkles in the sun.

http://glenn-ring.com/emonda/Emonda_SLR.jpg

Kontact 04-15-18 02:46 PM


Originally Posted by kbarch (Post 20281698)
Seems to me that any level of sheen will loose its "like new" look at about the same rate. Shiny gets dull and dull gets shiny, but what really makes something look less fresh is the eventual inconsistency of the finish, because every point on the frame is not subject to the same level of wear or exposure.

It is relatively easy to re-polish a smooth finish, but pretty much impossible to restore a matte finish, short of a sandblaster or repaint.

MakiNn 04-15-18 07:34 PM

White Lightings makes cleaner for Matte paint, I use it on my Cerveo S5 and still looks like the day I brought it home from the shop, even on the large white letters

dvai 04-16-18 08:21 AM

First, thank you for all the great responses. I really appreciate the expertise of the group.

I have been looking for automotive products and found this
https://www.autogeek.net/dr-beasleys-matte-coating.html

Not sure if would beneficial.

Also, I wonder how difficult is to find a pro to repaint the bike. I wanted to buy it and have it for many years.

wheelreason 04-16-18 09:42 AM

Not a fan of matte finishes, and light colored ones are just a mess waiting to happen.

jitteringjr 04-16-18 09:48 AM


Talks about matte finishes at 1:25

dvai 04-16-18 09:56 AM

Do you know which color is that?

The one Im thinking of buying may be the same. Trek calls it "Matte Dnister Black"



Originally Posted by oldnslow2 (Post 20285961)
Might be that I clean it every 150 miles or so with a 10:1 mixtures of water to Simple Green.

Yours is much "flat"er than mine.

Might be the sun and there is a almost metallic that sparkles in the sun.

http://glenn-ring.com/emonda/Emonda_SLR.jpg


GlennR 04-16-18 10:30 AM


Originally Posted by dvai (Post 20287400)
Do you know which color is that?

The one Im thinking of buying may be the same. Trek calls it "Matte Dnister Black"

Matte Dnister Black/Viper Red

duane041 04-16-18 03:15 PM

I paint bicycles for a living, and believe me, matte is a drag. By nature, it is porous (much like sanding primer). So it will absorb oils and grease, which is why it darkens and stains so easily. Once those oils are absorbed, they are very difficult (if not altogether impossible) to get out.

The matte finish is created by having a film of 'matting agent' deposited on the surface of the clear coat during the drying and curing process. The evaporating solvents in the clear bring the matting agent to the surface s they are escaping and evaporating, giving you that matte effect. Problem is, it's really only on the surface, and what's below is normal clear coat. This is why your matte finish gets incrementally more shiny the more you rub on it. You're removing the thin layer of matting agent and exposing the gloss clear underneath.

Durability of a matte finish isn't the same as a gloss finish, but it's not terrible. Matte finishes need to be sprayed a little thinner than a gloss clear (laying on too heavy a coat traps those carrier solvents in leaving you with a shinier surface than you had planned on), giving you less film build and, therefore, less protection. I'm sure Trek's finish is superior to most refinish materials (I use PPG), and may last longer, but I would never want a matte finish, and I don't like doing them for customers for the reasons outlined above.

Johnny Rad 04-16-18 07:03 PM


Originally Posted by duane041 (Post 20288148)
I paint bicycles for a living, and believe me, matte is a drag... I would never want a matte finish, and I don't like doing them for customers for the reasons outlined above.

Now you bring it up! Ha ha.

Thanks for the validation and underlying science.

Zaskar 04-16-18 07:14 PM

Damn it Duane. I'm going to forget 90% of what you just typed... and then forget where I read it. Will you just randomly slip that in threads every few weeks?

Seriously - this is what I LOVE about this site... great information like that, just dropping into threads. Thanks!

duane041 04-17-18 08:11 PM


Originally Posted by Zaskar (Post 20288570)
Damn it Duane. I'm going to forget 90% of what you just typed... and then forget where I read it. Will you just randomly slip that in threads every few weeks?

Seriously - this is what I LOVE about this site... great information like that, just dropping into threads. Thanks!

I've posted info about matte stuff once or twice before, but always happy to do it again.
I don't know much about bikes in general, but I do know paint, and I do know there is A TON of misinformation out there about it. Just trying to pass along the correct info.

DrIsotope 05-15-18 08:18 AM

It occurred to me recently, after noting how grimy the matte white toptube on my Cervelo has gotten, to ask my buddy who is a professional car detailer about what to buy to maintain a matte paintjob. He immediately said McKee's 37 Matte Finish Cleaner and Protectant. And while it is practically chain lube expensive, holy crap does it work. If your matte finish looks pretty clean, it is not. I turned three brand new microfibers varying shades of gray and brown. Stuff really, really works. And as I'm only using it on a bike frame, that $20 16oz bottle should last for ages.

I now think this is why like 90% of matte bikes are black-- it mostly hides the grime.

Patriot1 05-23-18 10:06 AM

Both of our 920’s have XPEL.com stealth paint protection. No chips, dings, scratches or discoloration. The same PP that
is on our vehicles. The only thing I use to clean the paint protection is Plexus. A quick shot of this on a micro fiber cloth
after a ride, done.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...86efd93fa.jpeg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...a041dbff1.jpeg




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