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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

BigChief 11-06-16 02:25 PM


Originally Posted by dweenk (Post 19173014)
Wow. My friend bought the bike for less than the asking price. He said that the paint is in very good shape except for the head tube (maybe a basket brace abraded it there). He will bring it to me in December when he visits his parents if I am unable to get to Richmond before then.

I am looking forward to working with an S5 hub, and I have a Velo Orange Model 5 sprung saddle and original Raleigh black grips waiting for it.

Excellent! Congrats. You got a super deal there. Now, this is just me. I see others here use the original top tube shifters, but I couldn't get reliable or easy shifting from them. I found that a regular 3 speed handlebar shifter works perfectly for the right side. I used the normal short cable casing to the front of the top tube fulcrum clip and bare cable over a pulley to the indicator chain. For the left side, I used a handlebar mounted SunTour power shifter and long cable casing all the way to a chainstay mounted cable stop that the bike had originally to the bell crank. The only shift that's tricky and needs some finesse is going from medium ratio mode (bell crank disengaged) to extra wide ratio mode ( bell crank engaged). all the other shifts are smooth and easy.

3speedslow 11-06-16 04:54 PM

My lucky day!

Thumpism was able to swing by the co-op and pick up the brown 23"Raleigh frame for me. Also found the rear fender in the shop as well. That leaves a front fender to locate. Should be able to move everything over from my 21" Sport.

Big Thanks go out to BF Thumpism for helping me. Good bikey karma coming his way.

Could trade a front/ rear set in blue for a brown front fender.

thumpism 11-06-16 05:19 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Sportses!

Here's my brown 23" Sports bike and the brown 23" Sports frame I got for 3speedslow. Interesting to see the differences. His has DT-mounted pump pegs and mine does not. Decals are different on frames and chainguards. Mine has the serial number stamped on the back of the seat tube just below the seat cluster and his has it stamped on top of the seat lug; you could read it while sitting on the seat. And his has the tape bands, of course. His paint is in better shape than mine. I think he'll be happy with it.
Attachment 542375

thumpism 11-06-16 05:39 PM

4 Attachment(s)
And, of course, while digging around in the co-op's dark and dusty back room while getting the Sports frame I spotted something I might have to go back and get for myself. What got my attention was the glimpse of an indicator chain and the glint of a Sturmey rear hub shell. Time for a closer look.

The decals for Garage Meier AG on the rear and front fenders indicate that it sold in a Euro shop; the name of the town on the sticker is Nussbaumen, which is in Switzerland. Bike looks German, like the old Jaguars with green-white fade paint jobs that turned up occasionally in the '70s, but the thing was buried and I did not have time to dig it out. Hub date 78, really nice alloy full chainguard, probably stainless full fenders perforated for skirtguard lacing and, this is the clincher for me, alloy 700C wheels. It's missing the handlebars and grips that are probably serving duty on some hipster's fixie.

Too bad it's not a men's 23" frame but it would make a killer 'hood ride for my wife or just something nice to hang up. If this is the "bikey karma" mentioned by 3speedslow that's okay, but it'll help if the frame tubes are full of gold dust or something.

Velo Meier is still in business: http://www.velo-meier.ch/

Attachment 542376

Attachment 542377

Attachment 542378

Attachment 542379

erileykc 11-06-16 05:50 PM

Visited a friend, who makes a bit of his income on estate sales, riding my 79 Tourist today and he was surprised to see my Raleigh. "Is that a 27 inch he asked, wish I'd known you were a fan" He had just bought and resold an assortment of 1960s roadsters in mint condition. Teeth grinding moment.

wahoonc 11-06-16 06:08 PM


Originally Posted by thumpism (Post 19173551)
Sportses!

Here's my brown 23" Sports bike and the brown 23" Sports frame I got for 3speedslow. Interesting to see the differences. His has DT-mounted pump pegs and mine does not. Decals are different on frames and chainguards. Mine has the serial number stamped on the back of the seat tube just below the seat cluster and his has it stamped on top of the seat lug; you could read it while sitting on the seat. And his has the tape bands, of course. His paint is in better shape than mine. I think he'll be happy with it.
Attachment 542375

Different years. Yours may be a Sports Standard. Does it happen to have a small sticker at the bottom of the seat tube saying it was made in Malaysia?

Aaron:)

thumpism 11-06-16 06:46 PM


Originally Posted by wahoonc (Post 19173670)
Different years. Yours may be a Sports Standard. Does it happen to have a small sticker at the bottom of the seat tube saying it was made in Malaysia?

Malaysia? MALAYSIA?!? Them's fightin' words, boy. Nope, "Made in England" is what it says on the chipped little decal.

Different years was already discussed on the previous page after the discovery of the frameset was reported.

wahoonc 11-06-16 06:57 PM


Originally Posted by thumpism (Post 19173751)
Malaysia? MALAYSIA?!? Them's fightin' words, boy. Nope, "Made in England" is what it says on the chipped little decal.

Different years was already discussed on the previous page after the discovery of the frameset was reported.

Raleigh bikes were made in a LOT of different countries, sometimes under license other times Raleigh owned the plant. Places like Africa, Ireland, India and Malaysia, as well as the USA.

I have a 1970 Raleigh Sport Standard that was made in Malaysia. The two most notable differences are the lack of pump pegs and the fact it used the Endrick pattern rims rather than the Westricks. Mine has been ridden hard for a lot of years and it is still a good solid bike. Mine has somewhere over 50,000 miles on it.

Aaron:)

https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7441/8...f7c0982f_z.jpg

BigChief 11-06-16 08:02 PM

This bike also has standard forks, not the thimble Raleigh style. Not all Nottingham Raleighs had pump lugs. My 69 Sprite doesn't. Now that I can see the chainwheel, I can say that it was made somewhere near the end of the 69 style transfers since the new chainwheel without brackets was introduced sometime in 73. I'm going to say that it's a Nottingham frame from late 72 or early 73. Lots of good bike karma here recently. A cheap but good 23" frame, a ultra cheap S5 Sprite and I'll count my $35 dollar DL-1. All and all, a good summer.

wahoonc 11-07-16 04:52 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 19173948)
This bike also has standard forks, not the thimble Raleigh style. Not all Nottingham Raleighs had pump lugs. My 69 Sprite doesn't. Now that I can see the chainwheel, I can say that it was made somewhere near the end of the 69 style transfers since the new chainwheel without brackets was introduced sometime in 73. I'm going to say that it's a Nottingham frame from late 72 or early 73. Lots of good bike karma here recently. A cheap but good 23" frame, a ultra cheap S5 Sprite and I'll count my $35 dollar DL-1. All and all, a good summer.


$35 for DL-1?:eek: Unless it was totally trashed that was a good deal. I paid about 5 times that for mine. What year is yours? Got Pics/

Aaron:)

thumpism 11-07-16 07:12 AM

I found a men's DL1 abandoned next to a building in my old 'hood, partially disassembled and missing parts, but had no space for it so walked away.

Sorry, guys.

3speedslow 11-07-16 07:28 AM


Originally Posted by thumpism (Post 19173551)
Sportses!

Here's my brown 23" Sports bike and the brown 23" Sports frame I got for 3speedslow. Interesting to see the differences. His has DT-mounted pump pegs and mine does not. Decals are different on frames and chainguards. Mine has the serial number stamped on the back of the seat tube just below the seat cluster and his has it stamped on top of the seat lug; you could read it while sitting on the seat. And his has the tape bands, of course. His paint is in better shape than mine. I think he'll be happy with it.
Attachment 542375

Hey Thumpism,

Quite so! I am simply thrilled to be getting this frame and I thank you again for making it possible. This Raleigh will be given a steady job of errand and coffee runs down here in coastal Flatlandia. Long casual rides in the country will be it's other occupation.

I am in concurrence with the age estimate of 72 or so. Wish I could look at a 70-71 year catalog.

Cheers

thumpism 11-07-16 07:46 AM


Originally Posted by 3speedslow (Post 19174690)
I am in concurrence with the age estimate of 72 or so. Wish I could look at a 70-71 year catalog.

Have a look a this. You should find something helpful.

Raleigh Catalog Database Archive

3speedslow 11-07-16 07:57 AM

Thanks, I checked those but 70 never got placed and 71 was for the lightweights only.

Mystery will be solved in by n' by. Whichever, I like the frame.

thumpism 11-07-16 08:05 AM


Originally Posted by 3speedslow (Post 19174744)
Thanks, I checked those but 70 never got placed and 71 was for the lightweights only.

Mystery will be solved in by n' by. Whichever, I like the frame.

Call Moore's in Rocky Mount, an old timey Raleigh dealer and lock shop. Ask for Dee and mention my name. They might have the catalogs on file but have moved within the last few decades so might have jettisoned what they considered to be old crap.

nlerner 11-07-16 08:19 AM

The Sports page in that 1970 catalog is a great example as to why Raleigh catalogs are of only limited help in pinning down the date of a bike. Note that the men's and lady's models have completed different chainguard and downtube decal schemes!

http://www.kurtkaminer.com/TH_Raleigh_Cat_70_3_LG.jpg

3speedslow 11-07-16 08:37 AM

True, Raleigh being definite with a possible maybe !

BigChief 11-07-16 10:28 AM


Originally Posted by wahoonc (Post 19174479)
$35 for DL-1?:eek: Unless it was totally trashed that was a good deal. I paid about 5 times that for mine. What year is yours? Got Pics/

Aaron:)

Oh yeah, it was trashed by neglect but somehow as badly rusted as it was, the chrome was in ok condition.
Fenders and Brooks saddle were not salvageable.
http://i536.photobucket.com/albums/f...ch/69dl001.jpg
as it is today.
http://i536.photobucket.com/albums/f...ily%20ride.jpg

3speedslow 11-07-16 10:51 AM

Wow, great job on bringing that roadster back! The chaingaurd especially. Too bad about the fenders.

BigChief 11-07-16 12:08 PM

1 Attachment(s)
On the frame, I had to de-rust some areas, so I tried to blend in the touch ups by dulling and distressing. It worked out pretty well. You don't notice the repairs unless you look closely. So overall, the bike has a somewhat scruffy patina. I need a chainguard because I mostly ride in blue jeans. It was pitted so badly that I had to totally strip the rust and use filler and new paint, so it does stand out. I had an extra vinyl Raleigh transfer, so I put it on for kicks. I even moved it back a bit from usual to center it in the triangle just out of fixers prerogative.
Attachment 542451

3speedslow 11-07-16 12:56 PM

Nicely done! Looks like it found a good home.

BigChief 11-07-16 04:28 PM

I'm looking forward to hearing how dweenk does with his S5 Sprite. I wish there were more of them around. Glad he is keeping his original. It's a very rare model. I have never seen, even a picture, of a stepthrough S5 Sprite before. I only know they exist because they are mentioned in the catalog.

dweenk 11-07-16 04:40 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 19176015)
I'm looking forward to hearing how dweenk does with his S5 Sprite. I wish there were more of them around. Glad he is keeping his original. It's a very rare model. I have never seen, even a picture, of a stepthrough S5 Sprite before. I only know they exist because they are mentioned in the catalog.

It may be a while if I can't get to Richmond before Christmas. I'll take some pix when I get it. BTW, I sent you a PM.

wahoonc 11-07-16 06:00 PM


Originally Posted by thumpism (Post 19174654)
I found a men's DL1 abandoned next to a building in my old 'hood, partially disassembled and missing parts, but had no space for it so walked away.

Sorry, guys.

oooh... black strike on your English Bike Record! :p

I swear I have a home for wayward bikes on some days, fortunately I have 40 acres and 3 barns.:twitchy:

Aaron:)

thumpism 11-07-16 06:07 PM

1 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by wahoonc (Post 19176177)
oooh... black strike on your English Bike Record!

To be fair, when time, distance and circumstances permit I always try to think who might be able to use a windfall bike and get it to that person. I've dragged home a FREE-signed yard sale leftover girls' 3-speed for neighborhood kids, given away a mint Raleigh Portage that was given to me (my size, and I'm still kicking myself), and driven a bare DL1 frame across state lines to reach someone who'd use it. I purely hate to let one sit there and not try to do something about it but sometimes you just can't save them all. My conscience is clear.

This one I found at the curb in Wake Forest NC on trash day and grabbed it for myself for the (rapidly approaching) time when I might need a stepthrough. I boxed it up and stashed it in the attic for more than a decade and only unboxed after we moved to this house with its garage.
Attachment 542518

PalmettoUpstate 11-07-16 06:45 PM


Originally Posted by 9volt (Post 19167448)
I found a Raleigh Lenton Grand Prix today. It has an SA FM 4 speed. Do these 4 speeds take the same oil as SA 3 speeds?

The hub is dated 1958, but the graphics on this bike don't match other 58s that I've found. Were these graphics available in 58?

Here are some pics:

I went to NJ about this time last year to pick up a '58 Lenton GP that I'd bought earlier in the year. Great trip; the gent I got it from lived - literally - right down the street [King's Hwy] from where Washington and his men came ashore after the Delaware crossing in the famous painting!

Anyway, I'll post pics soon. The bike I got seems to be somewhat more "original" than the one you just got.

Still, it needs some corrections to put it back to original.

BTW, I'd surmise that the OP is pretty much an expert in things Lenton; you might want to PM him.

gster 11-08-16 02:51 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 19175131)
Oh yeah, it was trashed by neglect but somehow as badly rusted as it was, the chrome was in ok condition.
Fenders and Brooks saddle were not salvageable.
http://i536.photobucket.com/albums/f...ch/69dl001.jpg
as it is today.
http://i536.photobucket.com/albums/f...ily%20ride.jpg

That's quite an improvement!

wahoonc 11-08-16 04:36 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 19175131)
Oh yeah, it was trashed by neglect but somehow as badly rusted as it was, the chrome was in ok condition.
Fenders and Brooks saddle were not salvageable.
http://i536.photobucket.com/albums/f...ch/69dl001.jpg
as it is today.
http://i536.photobucket.com/albums/f...ily%20ride.jpg

Nothing a little elbow grease (and dollar a can spray paint) can't fix. :thumb:

Nice job on it. Mine is a 1981 and is excellent shape. I am going to go retro with it and put on a chain case, rack with flip down wheel stand and an older shifter.

Aaron:)

browngw 11-08-16 06:14 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Good day in the parts drawers at the LBS. I found a new 21 tooth cog and a used 20 tooth cog. One of them will replace the 18T on my '71 Robin Hood. Any ideas on how many links i need to add to the chain going from 18T to 21T? I find the current 18T way too high for the type of riding I do with this bike.

BigChief 11-08-16 06:36 PM


Originally Posted by wahoonc (Post 19178654)
Nothing a little elbow grease (and dollar a can spray paint) can't fix. :thumb:

Nice job on it. Mine is a 1981 and is excellent shape. I am going to go retro with it and put on a chain case, rack with flip down wheel stand and an older shifter.

Aaron:)

Roadsters wear those old fashioned accessories well. I have a 1950s 3 or 4 speed window trigger and a steel 2 piece clamp pulley on this one. Any bike I do much riding on will have MKS touring pedals even if they aren't roadster like. Someday, I'd like a Brooks B66 for mine, but to be honest, this Serfas RX saddle is just as comfy for upright riding.


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