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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

Steve Bauserman 03-03-19 08:05 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Bauserman (Post 20821198)


The bike is one of the few known prewar Hetchins and very, very few unrestored, original bikes as verified by the Hetchins registry. It was ordered in 1936 and delivered in 1937 hence the K7 hub. The frame is built of Reynolds HM tubing which is the precursor to 531 originally finished forest green with a chrome fork. The handlebars are Lauterwasser with an unknown stem type and Brittania reproduction grips as the Constrictor grips were too worn to use. Tires are modern Schwalbe 597-32 that resemble the period Dunlop or Michelin. The bottom bracket is a Brampton. The headset is an integrated Chater Lea. The hubs are fastened with period correct front and rear Sturmey Archer wingnuts. The seatpost is a domed one. Last, the front hub is a Bayliss Wiley.

I have put about 50 miles on the bike over that last few weeks.

BTW, I will be taking it to Eroica California in April.

Steve Bauserman 03-03-19 08:16 PM

This is my other "the speed" Hetchins; a 1945 Super Special Custom. It is a one of a kind ordered within a few weeks after VE Day. The bike was sent back to Hetchins in 1955 to be repainted and have stops added to allow for a hybrid gearing system of a Sturmey Archer AW with a 3 cog Cyclo block and Simplex Rigidex 35 derailleur. The derailleur is controlled via period correct Cyclo indexed bar end shifter.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...936be2028.jpeg

BigChief 03-03-19 09:19 PM

Such magnificent bikes. What a treat to see.

oldveloman 03-04-19 07:24 AM

I probably missed it somewhere in this ever growing thread, but what is the purpose of the 163mm spindle in this 1988 AW hub ( left ), while all other hubs seem to be 147mm long ?

Peter
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f47d53b985.jpg

Dan Burkhart 03-04-19 07:55 AM


Originally Posted by oldveloman (Post 20821622)
I probably missed it somewhere in this ever growing thread, but what is the purpose of the 163mm spindle in this 1988 AW hub ( left ), while all other hubs seem to be 147mm long ?

Peter
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f47d53b985.jpg

Different widths to accommodate different frame spacing.

Fat Tire Trader 03-04-19 09:09 AM

Hello,
My friend john came by yesterday. I traded him my too tall for me Ed Litton frame for his too small for him Golden Arrow. I'm pretty excited to have this in my collection.
I need to look through my spares to see if I have the headset lock nut that it is missing. How do I determine the year, 38? Where is the best place to buy, sell and trade British 3 speeds?
Thanks,
Chris
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...01d44cca40.jpg

Raleigh Golden Arrow

clubman 03-04-19 09:22 AM


Originally Posted by Fat Tire Trader (Post 20821777)
Hello,
How do I determine the year, 38? Where is the best place to buy, sell and trade British 3 speeds?
Thanks,
Chris
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...01d44cca40.jpg

Raleigh Golden Arrow

Wow, another gem from the 30's. What markings are on the rear Sturmey hub?

One of the best sources for parts is Hilary Stone The site for Classic and Vintage bicycles and their parts

He doesn't really buy bikes but he might have your headset nut.

BigChief 03-04-19 09:34 AM


Originally Posted by oldveloman (Post 20821622)
I probably missed it somewhere in this ever growing thread, but what is the purpose of the 163mm spindle in this 1988 AW hub ( left ), while all other hubs seem to be 147mm long ?

Peter
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f47d53b985.jpg

The 6 1/4" axles were also used on models like the DL-1 to leave room for the wire mudguard stays that were attached to the axle instead of the frame. They came with longer indicator pins.

oldveloman 03-04-19 10:26 AM


Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart (Post 20821668)
Different widths to accommodate different frame spacing.

Thanks, Dan. The only bike in my possession with a wider frame, is my tandem that has balloon tires, drum brakes and 3speed derailleur, so I was wondering if the longer spindle could have another purpose than just to fit a wider frame... :)


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20821820)
The 6 1/4" axles were also used on models like the DL-1 to leave room for the wire mudguard stays that were attached to the axle instead of the frame. They came with longer indicator pins.

Thanks, BigChief.
I don' t know what frame this hub was fitted into, but I don' t think it was a Raleigh. Out of the 7 SA 3Speed hubs I have, this is the only one with the longer spindle.
I got that wheel from a friend who was cleaning his garage. Last weekend, I started to dismantle several wheels that I would never use on my bikes, but take up a lot of space.
Hubs and rims apart are easier to stock...

Fat Tire Trader 03-04-19 01:14 PM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20821793)
Wow, another gem from the 30's. What markings are on the rear Sturmey hub?

One of the best sources for parts is Hilary Stone The site for Classic and Vintage bicycles and their parts

He doesn't really buy bikes but he might have your headset nut.

The is a number next to the AW, it is hard to read, an 8 or a 9?
There are numbers on both sides of the seat cluster, but they don't seem to fit into a possible year on the charts that I have found.. I might have the headset locknut in my spare headset parts. I need to search through them.
Thanks,
Chrishttps://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2b18deba35.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1937555e3c.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...3b72b63bdb.jpg

squirtdad 03-04-19 01:30 PM

oK, this is not precisely Engish 3 speed, but in the neighborhood. It would be a cool bike for a tall miyata/3 speed/dutch/city bike fan
Not me selling and I would have grabbed one at 23"

https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...5-new-box.html

I have three of these in unopened boxes. They’re all tall (25”/62cm). Came out of the basement of a bike shop that shut down. Sort of like Miyata’s take on a Dutch style bike. If you have any questions please ask. I can do 600 a piece plus actual shipping. Rare, not very common, you all know that. Own something unique.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...85afede24.jpeg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...da267b8ba.jpeg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2e16731da.jpeg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1c2a7c589.jpeg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e31630f3f.jpegLast edited by krems81; 03-02-19 at 06:53 PM.

clubman 03-04-19 01:53 PM


Originally Posted by Fat Tire Trader (Post 20822260)
The is a number next to the AW, it is hard to read, an 8 or a 9?

Appears to be a '39 Golden Arrow, Model 41. Congrats. Raleigh serial numbers were pretty much lost in a big fire so ID's are almost impossible that way.
If that's a standard 26 tpi Raleigh locknut, there's lot's around, although I think yours is different from the norm.

Salubrious 03-04-19 02:30 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Bauserman (Post 20821198)


The bike is one of the few known prewar Hetchins and very, very few unrestored, original bikes as verified by the Hetchins registry. It was ordered in 1936 and delivered in 1937 hence the K7 hub. The frame is built of Reynolds HM tubing which is the precursor to 531 originally finished forest green with a chrome fork. The handlebars are Lauterwasser with an unknown stem type and Brittania reproduction grips as the Constrictor grips were too worn to use. Tires are modern Schwalbe 597-32 that resemble the period Dunlop or Michelin. The bottom bracket is a Brampton. The headset is an integrated Chater Lea. The hubs are fastened with period correct front and rear Sturmey Archer wingnuts. The seatpost is a domed one. Last, the front hub is a Bayliss Wiley.

I have put about 50 miles on the bike over that last few weeks.

Very nice! Could it be a Reynolds stem? They look very much like Raleigh pre-war stems but more refined. Pre-war Reynolds stems often employed dual bolts to secure the handlebars and might be steel or alloy.

BigChief 03-04-19 02:40 PM


Originally Posted by Fat Tire Trader (Post 20822260)
The is a number next to the AW, it is hard to read, an 8 or a 9?
There are numbers on both sides of the seat cluster, but they don't seem to fit into a possible year on the charts that I have found.. I might have the headset locknut in my spare headset parts. I need to search through them.
Thanks,
Chrishttps://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2b18deba35.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1937555e3c.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...3b72b63bdb.jpg

This is great. Super bikes showing up lately!! Love it. This one has the optional black paint with chromed fork like the RRA. Very cool. From the 1939 catalog (VCC Library)

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...757b089311.jpg

Steve Bauserman 03-04-19 03:29 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20822430)
This is great. Super bikes showing up lately!! Love it. This one has chromed forks like the RRA. Very cool. From the 1939 catalog (VCC Library)

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...757b089311.jpg

In the case of the RRA (I own a 37 & 48) the SN is on the underside of the bottom bracket shell.

BigChief 03-04-19 04:39 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Bauserman (Post 20822505)


In the case of the RRA (I own a 37 & 48) the SN is on the underside of the bottom bracket shell.

Interesting that the chrome fork came with the black finish at the base price, but they charged extra for it on the standard gold finish.

Steve Bauserman 03-04-19 04:58 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20822640)
Interesting that the chrome fork came with the black finish at the base price, but they charged extra for it on the standard gold finish.

You expected logic? Each model had suttle differences. I at one piont had a 48 Clubman and the 48 RRA. Both forks from a distance looked the same, but if you tried to move the fork light bracket from one to the other, you found that one for was “D” shaped and the other was “0” shaped. My guess is the charge was to do something that differed from the norm.

Fat Tire Trader 03-04-19 07:54 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Bauserman (Post 20822668)


You expected logic? Each model had suttle differences. I one one piont had a 48 Clubman and the 48 RRA. Both forks from a distance looked the same, but if you tried to move the fork light bracket from one to the other, you found that one for was D shaped and the other was 0 shaped. My guess is the charge was to do something that differed from the norm.

Yes, there is logic. Some people prefer round fork blades especially for track and sprinting out of the saddle.

Steve Bauserman 03-04-19 08:24 PM

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...cd45a250a.jpeg
Since I mentioned the two RRAs, here is a photo of the 37 with an AW-8 hub.



Steve Bauserman 03-04-19 08:27 PM

This is the 48 RRA with an alloy 48 FW hub.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...aae597b47.jpeg

BigChief 03-04-19 08:57 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Bauserman (Post 20822668)


You expected logic? Each model had suttle differences. I at one piont had a 48 Clubman and the 48 RRA. Both forks from a distance looked the same, but if you tried to move the fork light bracket from one to the other, you found that one for was “D” shaped and the other was “0” shaped. My guess is the charge was to do something that differed from the norm.

Well...I think I would have been suckered in to paying for the chrome fork with the gold finish. It would look stunning with the white Bluemels. Oh and the AM hub. Wouldn't that be nice today? So come on already. Triumph is back. So is Norton. Why not proper English built Raleighs?

Steve Bauserman 03-04-19 09:07 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20822967)
Well...I think I would have been suckered in to paying for the chrome fork with the gold finish. It would look stunning with the white Bluemels. Oh and the AM hub. Wouldn't that be nice today? So come on already. Triumph is back. So is Norton. Why not proper English built Raleighs?

I can see the fork, not so sure at the AM. I have a 55 Raleigh Sports that was upgraded with an FM hub (yeah another bike with an internal gear hub), but I have not been all that impressed with the range.

DQRider 03-05-19 07:44 AM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20810893)

Oh man... now there's a blast from the past!

Wandering a bit off-topic here...

(It's actually "Song of the Sausage Creature")

That article inspired me to sell my Japanese bikes and buy a Ducati 900SS back in 1995. Did some cafe racing on Wisconsin country roads, and then went legit with Central Roadracing Association.

A crash in turn one at Brainerd Int'l Raceway, going about 140mph at the time, ended that dream.

https://i.imgur.com/wrOATV8.png
Apologies for the poor photo, this was copied from a magazine column I wrote back then.

For awhile there, I too was a Sausage Creature... :eek:

But I mended; first my body, and then the bike:

https://i.imgur.com/Dn4kSdL.png

"After" pic from that same story.

I don't ride motorcycles these days. You might say I outgrew them when I discovered just how fascinating bicycles can be.



Now, back to our regularly scheduled program...


BigChief 03-05-19 08:16 AM


Originally Posted by Steve Bauserman (Post 20822929)
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...cd45a250a.jpeg
Since I mentioned the two RRAs, here is a photo of the 37 with an AW-8 hub.



Ahhh, there's my Grail club bike. I always hoped I'd find one at an estate auction someday. Hasn't happened yet.

BigChief 03-05-19 08:20 AM


Originally Posted by DQRider (Post 20823395)
Oh man... now there's a blast from the past!

Wandering a bit off-topic here...

(It's actually "Song of the Sausage Creature")

That article inspired me to sell my Japanese bikes and buy a Ducati 900SS back in 1995. Did some cafe racing on Wisconsin country roads, and then went legit with Central Roadracing Association.

A crash in turn one at Brainerd Int'l Raceway, going about 140mph at the time, ended that dream.

https://i.imgur.com/wrOATV8.png
Apologies for the poor photo, this was copied from a magazine column I wrote back then.

For awhile there, I too was a Sausage Creature... :eek:

But I mended; first my body, and then the bike:

https://i.imgur.com/Dn4kSdL.png

"After" pic from that same story.

I don't ride motorcycles these days. You might say I outgrew them when I discovered just how fascinating bicycles can be.



Now, back to our regularly scheduled program...


I've never raced anything, but I'm still into motorcycles. Old Brits of course. I still have one left

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...dcac9771d9.jpg

paulb_in_bkln 03-05-19 08:27 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20822430)
This is great. Super bikes showing up lately!! Love it. This one has the optional black paint with chromed fork like the RRA. Very cool. From the 1939 catalog (VCC Library)

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...757b089311.jpg

Are those a different handlebar, or the usual (North Road?) flipped?

3speedslow 03-05-19 08:30 AM

^^ That’s a great one to have “ left “ ! I never could find a Brit bike around my stomp.

Ballenxj 03-05-19 09:27 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20823445)
I've never raced anything, but I'm still into motorcycles. Old Brits of course. I still have one left

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...dcac9771d9.jpg

I once owned one that was very similar to yours shown albeit, not quite as nice. I believe it was a 1967 or 68 Bonneville.
DQRider, That 900SS was legendary when it came out. :thumb:

DQRider 03-05-19 09:27 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20823445)
I've never raced anything, but I'm still into motorcycles. Old Brits of course. I still have one left

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...dcac9771d9.jpg


A drum-braked Bonneville :thumb: Very nice indeed!


Fat Tire Trader 03-05-19 09:52 AM


Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20823456)
Are those a different handlebar, or the usual (North Road?) flipped?

Lauterwasser


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