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-   -   Totally Tubular (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=154679)

woodcraft 07-14-20 08:48 PM


Originally Posted by Ferrouscious (Post 21584625)
I'm a pretty aggressive rider, so I want some margin of safety. At the same time, I know how to ride carefully and wish to be able to remove the tire without damaging it (fixing flats). I also live in a pretty flat area with only a few short but steep hills. Basically old school racer dude.


If you want some margin of safety, then use glue. Mastik (prob the most used currently) does not prevent the tire from being removed without damage,

nor do others IME. The idea that one needs to ride carefully so as not to have the tires come off is unfounded and will mess up your results and enjoyment.

You are likely not as aggressive a rider as top pros, and they don't hold back, in spite of arguably skimpier glue jobs that those of the anxious amateurs.

seedsbelize 07-15-20 08:33 AM


Originally Posted by 79pmooney (Post 21567313)
Like smantanaro, I find the hand brush works well except on fendered bikes. That rear wheel, already prone to more flats just being a rear wheel, never gets brushed. Tiresavers are a real plus there, (They always went on my fendered and tubular bikes. Front was not required but I did on my rain bikes to keep my gloves cleaner.

Trick to reducing the noise - ride rib tread tires, those tires with longitudinal parallel ribs. Those were common on training level tubulars 45 years ago and Vittoria has brought it back with their G+ and G2,0 tires. (Aside - also my favorite tread pattern ever, Thank you Vittoria for bringing it back! Best tread ever if you have to leave the paved road surface and climb back on.)

Ben

I found myself wiping my back tire yesterday. I grabbed the seat tube and used the backs of my gloved fingers.

seedsbelize 07-15-20 08:35 AM

And I've decided to go with Yellow Jersey for my remaining two tires. I very much enjoy working with those folks.

smontanaro 07-15-20 01:00 PM

I have a couple Challenge Strada tubulars (25mm) which I liked well, but which "delaminated" a while ago. I decided I would see if I could reattach the tread to the casing and stumbled on this web page

Cross Tubular Tread Repair

The author suggests this tread separation is fairly common with handmade tubulars. These Challenge sew-ups are the only ones which have suffered this way for me. I've not yet tried this repair. I'm still mulling over what sort of glue/contact cement I should use. I have a number of different things to try, Vittoria Mastik One, barge cement and cork renew (which is used for refreshing latex tanwalls). Or I can go find E-6000 at the hardware store.

woodcraft 07-16-20 05:08 PM


Originally Posted by smontanaro (Post 21588903)
I have a couple Challenge Strada tubulars (25mm) which I liked well, but which "delaminated" a while ago. I decided I would see if I could reattach the tread to the casing and stumbled on this web page

Cross Tubular Tread Repair

The author suggests this tread separation is fairly common with handmade tubulars. These Challenge sew-ups are the only ones which have suffered this way for me. I've not yet tried this repair. I'm still mulling over what sort of glue/contact cement I should use. I have a number of different things to try, Vittoria Mastik One, barge cement and cork renew (which is used for refreshing latex tanwalls). Or I can go find E-6000 at the hardware store.


I'd use Barge. Stick some bits in to keep the tread separate from the casing while the glue dries.

No need for all that tape, etc. & you can see the result.

WGB 07-19-20 11:54 AM

Bumping to ask about that CX-10 tape.
Note on the website said the tape is used to fill in over glue to ensure full adhesion. Is that just a cya example or should it only be used with glue??

Asking because can't find an online review anywhere for this tape but like the price as I have 3 sets of wheels to set up.

jonwvara 07-19-20 03:34 PM


Originally Posted by WGB (Post 21595633)
Bumping to ask about that CX-10 tape.
Note on the website said the tape is used to fill in over glue to ensure full adhesion. Is that just a cya example or should it only be used with glue??

Asking because can't find an online review anywhere for this tape but like the price as I have 3 sets of wheels to set up.

I used some Jantex tape recently--being a cheap New Englander I was drawn to it like a moth to a flame because you get enough for two wheels for less than ten bucks. I haven't removed a tire yet, so have no idea how that will go, but the adhesion seems very strong.

Steve Whitlatch 07-20-20 09:18 AM

I purchased a set of used carbon tubulars from a local wheel builder for ny Cannondale. The set came with like new Vittoria Corsa tires already glued by the builder. They were team wheels but everyone switched to tubeless.

I got a blow out on the rear, sidewall from debris, had a spare, could not for the life of me get that tire off of the rim on the side of the road. I had to call the wife.

At home, it took me about 25 minutes of prying with a plastic lever to get enough tire off of the wheel to pull the rest. He glued them like you need to glue cross tires. A three day process he told me.
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2b33818313.jpg
Glue overkill! I never had such a hard time getting a tire off.

Decided to replace both tires with a more moderate glue job.

tcpasley 07-20-20 03:01 PM

How many tires to buy?
 
Wondering how many tires y'all experienced tub riders purchase when you find a good deal. I guess the short answer is "more than 2". Is it 3 or 4 or multiples of 2?

Being of thrifty Scots descent, I usually try to rotate clinchers to get the most miles possible out of a pair, which may not be practical with tubs. Any advice on that?

woodcraft 07-21-20 12:32 AM


Originally Posted by tcpasley (Post 21597844)
Wondering how many tires y'all experienced tub riders purchase when you find a good deal. I guess the short answer is "more than 2". Is it 3 or 4 or multiples of 2?

Being of thrifty Scots descent, I usually try to rotate clinchers to get the most miles possible out of a pair, which may not be practical with tubs. Any advice on that?


Not more than two. Have to resist buying when the sales come by as it would take ten years to wear out what I have mounted or on hand.

Mostly it's just replacing the back tire- the front doesn't wear much.

woodcraft 07-21-20 12:39 AM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 21597128)
I purchased a set of used carbon tubulars from a local wheel builder for ny Cannondale. The set came with like new Vittoria Corsa tires already glued by the builder. They were team wheels but everyone switched to tubeless.

I got a blow out on the rear, sidewall from debris, had a spare, could not for the life of me get that tire off of the rim on the side of the road. I had to call the wife.

At home, it took me about 25 minutes of prying with a plastic lever to get enough tire off of the wheel to pull the rest. He glued them like you need to glue cross tires. A three day process he told me.
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2b33818313.jpg
Glue overkill! I never had such a hard time getting a tire off.

Decided to replace both tires with a more moderate glue job.



That sucks. Maybe needed a knife in the kit to cut the tire off.

CV-6 07-21-20 08:27 AM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 21597128)
I purchased a set of used carbon tubulars from a local wheel builder for ny Cannondale. The set came with like new Vittoria Corsa tires already glued by the builder. They were team wheels but everyone switched to tubeless.

I got a blow out on the rear, sidewall from debris, had a spare, could not for the life of me get that tire off of the rim on the side of the road. I had to call the wife.

At home, it took me about 25 minutes of prying with a plastic lever to get enough tire off of the wheel to pull the rest. He glued them like you need to glue cross tires. A three day process he told me.

Glue overkill! I never had such a hard time getting a tire off.

Decided to replace both tires with a more moderate glue job.

I experienced similar when I had to change my first tape job. Arthritis in my thumbs. I now carry Mafac tire levers.

squirtdad 07-21-20 09:23 AM


Originally Posted by tcpasley (Post 21597844)
Wondering how many tires y'all experienced tub riders purchase when you find a good deal. I guess the short answer is "more than 2". Is it 3 or 4 or multiples of 2?

Being of thrifty Scots descent, I usually try to rotate clinchers to get the most miles possible out of a pair, which may not be practical with tubs. Any advice on that?

i have 3 one for a spare and the plan is to rotate the rear to space duty when it is worn ymmv

DiabloScott 07-21-20 09:57 AM


Originally Posted by tcpasley (Post 21597844)
Wondering how many tires y'all experienced tub riders purchase when you find a good deal. I guess the short answer is "more than 2". Is it 3 or 4 or multiples of 2?

Being of thrifty Scots descent, I usually try to rotate clinchers to get the most miles possible out of a pair, which may not be practical with tubs. Any advice on that?

Most recently I bought 5, because the ones I *really* liked were being discontinued. I don't rotate them, and I don't get many flats, so when the rear is worn out I replace front and rear both, and if I do get a flat before then, I'll have some used front ones to put on.


Glue overkill! I never had such a hard time getting a tire off.
Decided to replace both tires with a more moderate glue job.
I think most sensible people start off by over-doing it. I re-evaluate my glue jobs every time I need to take a tire off and I still over-do it but not by nearly so much. Damn hard to get off, but not damn near impossible.

Ferrouscious 07-21-20 11:59 AM


Originally Posted by DiabloScott (Post 21599221)
I think most sensible people start off by over-doing it. I re-evaluate my glue jobs every time I need to take a tire off and I still over-do it but not by nearly so much. Damn hard to get off, but not damn near impossible.

I did my first glue job this past weekend with Tubasti and a hard anodised rim. Way too skimpy! The glue didn't properly bond with the rim and left a couple 3" chunks completely de-bonded. Sanded the rims a bit today; will glue tomorrow. TubAsTI!!!:rolleyes:

79pmooney 07-21-20 12:23 PM


Originally Posted by Ferrouscious (Post 21599460)
I did my first glue job this past weekend with Tubasti and a hard anodised rim. Way too skimpy! The glue didn't properly bond with the rim and left a couple 3" chunks completely de-bonded. Sanded the rims a bit today; will glue tomorrow. TubAsTI!!!:rolleyes:

Did you clean the rim with solvent or powerful cleanser and get ALL of the oil and manufacturing stuff off?

I never trust new rims. Wouldn't race them until I'd pulled off a tire and the glue stayed on the rim. Sanding isn't necessary but I doubt it hurts. But sanding the surface oil into the scratches means its still on. Clean all those bare spots. Then you can fill them and let that harden. Then you can re-glue and mount the tires.

Once you have a good base and little glue pulls up with a pull-off, you will have what I loved - a good reliable, secure system where pulling the tires isn't impossible and can be done on the road and spare tires mount and stick plenty well enough to get you home. (Some glue pulling up happens. Not a big deal. This isn't like clinchers with their wire beads that MUST be very close to exactly the right diameter or mounting is completely impossible or the tire slips off and blows. Glue is VERY forgiving of discrepancies and once you've forgotten, it doesn't matter.

Ben

Sb23539 07-23-20 11:31 PM

New rims with issues

bikemig 07-25-20 10:32 AM


Originally Posted by jonwvara (Post 21595992)
I used some Jantex tape recently--being a cheap New Englander I was drawn to it like a moth to a flame because you get enough for two wheels for less than ten bucks. I haven't removed a tire yet, so have no idea how that will go, but the adhesion seems very strong.

Somehow I ended up with more sets of tubular wheels (and rims) than I've ever wanted to own, :). I keep thinking it's time to start riding them again because I love the way they ride but gluing them is no fun. Tape is the way to go. $10 for 2 wheels which is what Jantex runs isn't bad. The Effeto Mariposa Carogna gets good reviews but it's $20 for 2 wheels.

Have you been using those taped on tubulars going down the mountains near you?

jonwvara 07-25-20 12:02 PM


Originally Posted by bikemig (Post 21606282)
Somehow I ended up with more sets of tubular wheels (and rims) than I've ever wanted to own, :). I keep thinking it's time to start riding them again because I love the way they ride but gluing them is no fun. Tape is the way to go. $10 for 2 wheels which is what Jantex runs isn't bad. The Effeto Mariposa Carogna gets good reviews but it's $20 for 2 wheels.

Have you been using those taped on tubulars going down the mountains near you?

Well, they're not exactly mountains, but I'm on the height of land between the St. Lawrence and Connecticut Rivers. There are a lot of long steep climbs. I don't have many miles on the new wheels, in part because I'm recovering from a shovel wound on my shin several weeks ago (don't ask.) I'm also not an aggressive cornerer on steep descents. But I have a lot of confidence in the tape just from trying to shift the tires with my fingers--they seem to be really stuck on there. And as you say, the price is right.

Eugene Sloane mentions Jantex tape as an alternative to cement in my 1969 copy of The Complete Book of Bicycling. So the stuff has apparently been around for awhile.

bikemig 07-25-20 12:20 PM


Originally Posted by jonwvara (Post 21606436)
Well, they're not exactly mountains, but I'm on the height of land between the St. Lawrence and Connecticut Rivers. There are a lot of long steep climbs. I don't have many miles on the new wheels, in part because I'm recovering from a shovel wound on my shin several weeks ago (don't ask.) I'm also not an aggressive cornerer on steep descents. But I have a lot of confidence in the tape just from trying to shift the tires with my fingers--they seem to be really stuck on there. And as you say, the price is right.

Eugene Sloane mentions Jantex tape as an alternative to cement in my 1969 copy of The Complete Book of Bicycling. So the stuff has apparently been around for awhile.

its all a matter of perspective. If you live in the middle of Iowa those hills near you look like mountains. I managed to end up with 6 tubular wheelsets which are right around 6 more than I need. Old bikes just seem to grow tubulars.

Wileyone 07-30-20 06:36 AM

Tufo Hi-Composite Carbon Tubular Road Tyre

From Wiggle...
I've run a set of these for awhile. Didn't really like them at first but once you get the pressures right they are excellent. So I just ordered a second set at $55 Cad each. But when I check the price in US funds they are $62.21 odd but still a good deal. If you don't mind black walls.

https://www.wiggle.com/tufo-hi-compo...rr=USD&dest=18

pastorbobnlnh 08-02-20 12:14 PM

Speaking of Tufos, I got a great deal on Tufo Tubular Clincher C S33 PRO 24 tires from BikeInn back in June, and they arrived last week. Yesterday I had time to mount them on my mid-90s Mavic Cosmic Expert wheels. My thumbs still hurt from stretching them onto the rims. Took a good 15-20 minutes each, plus time to adjust the ribs on the tires into the lock edge on the clincher rim. They look great. It might be a few weeks before I have a chance to ride them. I'm in the middle of a house sale and have no time for riding. :notamused:

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c8955917cc.jpg
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...9e1d095b8e.jpg
For those who are curious, these really are tubular tires which fit on clincher rims.
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1ba47f6c6c.jpg

bikerosity57 08-03-20 06:24 AM


Originally Posted by Wileyone (Post 21614735)

Tufo Hi-Composite Carbon Tubular Road Tyre

From Wiggle...
I've run a set of these for awhile. Didn't really like them at first but once you get the pressures right they are excellent. So I just ordered a second set at $55 Cad each. But when I check the price in US funds they are $62.21 odd but still a good deal. If you don't mind black walls.

https://www.wiggle.com/tufo-hi-compo...rr=USD&dest=18

so these tires have none of the advantages of ease of mounting /maintaining/repair ability of a clincher tire, nor the lightness of a tubular tire? I know for a fact they cost as much as two or three regular tires. Why would anyone want them?

Wileyone 08-03-20 07:16 AM


Originally Posted by bikerosity57 (Post 21621152)
so these tires have none of the advantages of ease of mounting /maintaining/repair ability of a clincher tire, nor the lightness of a tubular tire? I know for a fact they cost as much as two or three regular tires. Why would anyone want them?

I think you quoted the wrong person.

Wildwood 08-03-20 08:21 AM

Have been recently experiencing some slow leaks on tubulars mounted a few years ago. The kind of leak that doesn't interrupt a ride, but the next morning a tire is very low or flat. Only the Specialized Turbo shows a lot of wear. The 30mm Schwalbes (my preferred gravel road tire) have many small tire 'cuts', that might let in grit.

I hate uncertainty. So yesterday I spent a couple of hours (including the check rides) adding liquid latex to 3 sets of wheels. I think it's time well spent. Will do the rest of the tubulars over the next month.

pastorbobnlnh 08-03-20 05:36 PM


Originally Posted by bikerosity57 (Post 21621152)
so these tires have none of the advantages of ease of mounting /maintaining/repair ability of a clincher tire, nor the lightness of a tubular tire? I know for a fact they cost as much as two or three regular tires. Why would anyone want them?

Did you mean to quote me and not Wileyone ?

If you meant my decision to try Tufo Tubular Clinchers, the simple reason would be: Because they are available!

If you look back a few pages you might find my post telling the story about when I found the Mavic Cosmic wheels and the original owner assured me they were "tubular" rims before I drove almost two hours to make the purchase. When I arrived and took one look (they had yellow Vittoria tires mounted) I knew they were clinchers--- but the price was really reasonable for a high-end set of wheels which still had plenty of life left.

They are going on my rebuild of a '93 Cannondale R600 and I really had my heart set on tubular tires for this build. So I thought, why not try Tufo's Tubular Clinchers. And that is what I'm doing. BTW, they only cost $31 each shipped from Europe, so a very reasonable price.

DiabloScott 08-03-20 09:25 PM


Originally Posted by bikerosity57 (Post 21621152)
so these tires have none of the advantages of ease of mounting /maintaining/repair ability of a clincher tire, nor the lightness of a tubular tire? I know for a fact they cost as much as two or three regular tires. Why would anyone want them?

My executive summary based on reading several dozen posts about these things.
1. They're tubulars, but they're not sew-ups.
2. They have a little of that tubular ride quality.
3. You can run them with lower pressure than clinchers of the same size and not worry about pinch flats.
4. You can run them on the clincher rims you already have - low economic bar for entry.
5. Lack of gluing skills is not a problem.
6. You can run them with sealant and get a similar thorn resistance to tubeless.

So - it seems like their main fans are people who want certain benefits of tubulars without the cost and hassle, and certain benefits of tubeless without the cost and hassle; and who don't care about the vintage-ness of sew-ups. The tires aren't cheap, but they're cheaper than new wheels needed to go tubular or tubeless, and if you don't like them you're not stuck with wheels you don't want.

I don't think I'll ever have any, but that's why they make chocolate and vanilla.

Wildwood 08-03-20 09:35 PM

I've tried a lot of new things that cost more than $60.
Not that the Tufo is a good idea.


The tandem was a failed experiment.
Mtn biking, under most circumstances, didn't stick.
A flat bar bike flopped.
Fixie nearly killed me, long ago.

Actually, $60 is cheap.

pastorbobnlnh 08-04-20 04:55 AM

Yet as we all know: $60 here, $60 there, and pretty soon we've sunk $1000s into a project we thought was going to be affordable! :innocent:

Wileyone I definitely echo your list with the exception of trying a Fixie. I determined a long time ago one could kill me so I've never tried! I know, I know, MMMV! :p

DiabloScott spoken like an engineer--- but I'm just guessing. ;)

Wileyone 08-04-20 04:59 AM


Originally Posted by pastorbobnlnh (Post 21622910)
Yet as we all know: $60 here, $60 there, and pretty soon we've sunk $1000s into a project we thought was going to be affordable! :innocent:

Wileyone I definitely echo your list with the exception of trying a Fixie. I determined a long time ago one could kill me so I've never tried! I know, I know, MMMV! :p

DiabloScott spoken like an engineer--- but I'm just guessing. ;)

I think you meant to quote @wildone.
This is becoming contagious.


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