masi gran criterium id help
 

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=320239http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=320240

i can hardly read the series 857
from what i read it's a '74 or '75 masi made in usa
anyone can help me put the infos together correct?
i want to find the catalog and maybe find out exact information about the colour(the actual one has rust and the decals seam to be water decals, added in a negligent restoration)
the fork is twin plated, it has the crank set you see in the image
thanks alot

mircea

from the hearts in the lugs and the fork it only can be masi gran criterium 1974, made in italy
i still can't find the catalog to check the group and colours

I think the twin plate fork was only a year or two, ca '74.

More pictures needed. Also what is any stamping on the BB of the size code and/or serial number. The twin plate fork was only for a year or two but I don't think any GCs were made in Italy in '74, only in California. That doesn't appear to be a Campy chain ring and I have never seen those chainring cutouts before.

Bob Hovey's website is an excellent place to find info on Masi's.
http://bhovey.com/Masi/

You might ask Jim "CyclArt" Cunningham, since he worked at Masi California.

I wouldn't rule out that those are nuovo record rings heavily modified... can't contribute anything on the masi.. more photos are needed.

here is the logics behind
http://www.flickr.com/photos/8704761...7633834069271/
from bob hovey's bits and details
italy 1974, but i am curious if they were built by alberto masi or his father faliero. alberto started in 73 building frames, while faliero went to california, if what i read was correct
the paint seams to be a later and bad work, i rather think it was sly blue
but i need confirmations from guys who know better, and to get to some official photos, i only found masi's made in usa as a catalog artwork

That'll be a nice bike, and a great rescue! They are amongst the finest riding bikes ever made.

A california masi has the serial number on the bottom bracket where the down tube goes in. The serial number itself is just a number, and is in front of the bottom bracket lug cutout for the downtube. There is a number behind this cutout; if it is a Carlsbad bike the number starts with a "C" and the size in centimeters follows that.

I think that the same format was used for the Italian frames...but remember that each one was hand built and serialized, so mistakes (or magic) could have happened in the frame shop. Someone went to the trouble to reproduce the signature on the top tube, "Alberto", and I don't see the advantage or disadvantage of changing that from the original.

Frame looks Italian GC to me, 1974 is a pretty good guess without removing the fork.
Alberto may not have built the bike. He was running the business though for the most part it appears in 1974.
The Milano operation had relied on subcontractors to expand production for it appears quite some time.
Dad was in the USA for approx. 6 months to set up and get the Carlsbad operation running, he left in early 1974. In the USA Faliero was not building, two from Italy were brought over to help get that going. One, Mario Confente stayed on and ran the shop there with local help.

It does indeed look like you have identified the frame correctly as a 74 Italian GC. I hadn't realized Alberto was building GCs in Italy at that time.

Alberto was NOT building GC's in Italy. He was overseeing the building of GC's by subcontractors in Italy. Indeed there is some debate as to how much framebuilding Alberto ever did. He knows how to use a torch quite well but I tend to believe that his actual implication in actual framebuilding was actually very limited.

anyone can help me finding the italian 74 masi gc catalog? from what i found they were sky blue, but i don't know if they had red and blue as an option. i want to find out as much as possible the exact colour.

From comments of those who have visited, I think he most often added braze ons for frames that came back in for a refinish. But this was in the 80's, early 90's.

There may not be one to locate. Maybe a single sheet, for colors from 1974 I would look to the colors that Masi USA presented during the early Carlsbad period as they were at the beginning the same, save white which Milano used but only found itself on a few American bikes in 1975. Having said that, a custom color could be had in Italy.

There was a light metallic blue and a medium metallic blue produced by Carlsbad. The light blue was pretty handsome and popular, the medium blue was in my view kind of dreary. Masi colors in Italy evolved with the introduction of the Prestige, that selection I think presents Albertos color view, either by plan or acceptance of the recommendations of others, (who knows, maybe the graphic designer who worked on the new transfers?)

that would be a really interesting talk, with graphic designers of the time.
from what i read, red was preffered in usa, with a thicker layer of laquer on the paint.
i will probably go for the pearl light blue. i also saw on ray dobbins and another website a champagne italian 74

For me, I would not use a pearl color for that year. The pearl finish shows up later during the Prestige and 3V production, I would place it as 1983 onwards. I would use a fine grained metallic. Faliero was said to like the champagne color most. The champagne bike on the Ray Dobbins site is a respray, but pretty well done. There is a Masi Special on American ebay right now that looks pretty original as to color rendition, almost all now that get painted are too glossy. Too small for me and not cheap.

The "thicker" paint shows up on the American built bikes in 1981, save a color that was introduced in late 1976, California Burgundy. The color palette shifted in 1981 too, the opaque colors got darker and the graphics were buried in the clear coat. Part of this was fashion, and part was that the graphics were not all of the same type, some were waterslide or pressure sensitive adhesive and needed protection. The varnish fix transfers were much more effort to install.

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=333575http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=333576soon i will present my fresh masi
till the fork is home, some preview

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=336391http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=336392
this is the new old masi

Nice bike. Those forks are just too sexy.

Champagne Edition. Looks pretty good from here.

Looks great.. the red on the floor seems to be reflected up a fair amount in the photos. Can wait to see it built up.

yes it's just the reflection
i am only missing the brakes and hoods for levers
oh and two rims

Good excuse to go to L'Eroica, too late to ride the event, but there is a vintage bicycle market in conjunction.

http://www.eroicafan.it/en/

Nice bike. Ride it well!