Shogun Katana
 

I've got a new project that I'm really excited about, but also kind of nervous. My wife's best friend texted me yesterday and said she's looking for a bike for her daughter, Merry. Merry is 13 years old and 5'1". They've got a small budget, but of course Merry wanted something nice. After checking out Craigslist, I recommended this Shogun Katana. The asking price was $85, and I said I'd supply whatever additional parts were needed to make it the kind of bike they want.

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Right now we're talking about some kind of Shimano STI build, maybe 3x10, but I think once she tries it out she may prefer flat bars or possibly even something like north roads bars. This could be a really cool bike. My biggest concern is whether it's too big for her. At 13, she may or may not be done growing. The bike was listed as a 51 cm, but now that I have it in the garage, I measure it as 52 cm center-to-center with a 54 cm top tube. I'm going to have her come over next week for a fit evaluation. I'm hoping I can make it work.

I hope so as well. If it was a 13 year old boy, we'd probably be confident that some growing potential was still on the table, given what we know. Also given what we know about cyclists vs. people that ride bikes on occasion, cross-chaining in the small-small is an incredibly common occurrence (or at least, a lack of education and/or application). You or I don't mind hacking a triple, especially in hilly terrain (I was out on my 720 tonight and it was wonderful!), but for the less-enthusiastic and/or beginners, a 1x system makes a lot of sense as it decreases variables. That helps. Not that we wish to relegate her or anyone else to the bin of "you'll never master anything more than minimal gearing options", but there's some reality that must be considered here.

Your idea of flat bar or North Roads is a good one. Keep it upright and fun/less Super Serious Cyclist (unless she's looking for that, of course). Man, I wish there were more 650B options as there would invariably be cheaper used components to choose from. Looking at the brake pad position/"elevation" in their slots, you should be able to sneak 28s in there, IMO.

For $85 and a family friend's help in refurbishing plus component supplying, that's a heck of a deal and if she wants something nicer, hopefully that's motivating across a few fronts to get there. :)

She's trying out cycling as a replacement for jogging, which has been too stressful for her joints, so I think this will be more than just the typical roaming the neighborhood that I did at that age. Still, 1x isn't a bad idea.

The tires that are on there now are labeled as 25s but measure 23. I might need to dimple the chainstays to make 28s fit. 650B with 28s would make a lot of sense for this bike. If I could find a reasonable set of used wheels, I might splurge for 650x28 Conti GP 50000s.

I have that exact Katana in a 58 size frame. It really surprised me how responsive and comfortable it is to ride.

As to tires I have some info. Mine came with 25s also but they were to aged to use so I put a set of 28 Continental Top Contacts on it and ran into a brake scraping issue in the rear as there was less than 1mm of clearance but the TCs have thick tread. I solved the problem with a brake caliper upgrade to some 6208 brake calipers and got marginally better clearance. After a few rides I threw on a set of GP 4 Seasons 28s and they fit great. I might be able to squeeze a set of 30mm tires in if they were true 30mm but I'm happy with the 28s. I did not try the GP 4 Seasons with the original calipers in place but I think it would have been a tight fit.

Start simple and see if she likes riding it in its close-to-stock configuration. Heck- see if she can even straddle the TT.

You got this Shogun for a good price, but trying to turn it from skinny-tired road bike into a hybrid is going to be more expensive than just buying a nice hybrid that already has room for 38s, a triple, flat bars, sloping top tube, etc.

I agree with Clang. See what she wants out of a bike. Don't try to foist what you believe is comfortable or trendy onto her, but explain to her what the options are, and the benefits/drawbacks of each. She may actually like drop bars, 2X and skinny tires.

52 cm, if long legged will be a really good fit. If torso long then it is a bit more difficult.

I will also say build it up as a road bike with brifters on hand. And I would possibly use some slightly Randonneur bars you can find, and the shortest stem you have on hand (60/70). Try the 30s on the wheels. If they fit, those are plenty wide.

She can learn spots on the bar that are most comfortable.

And you can always call @gugie to have him modify it for cyclocross!

That would have to be a very long legged 5'1" person to go on a 52cm frame. I bought 650c wheeled bikes for my sons who were around that height. I think a 650c wheel bike is best for people that height. This is the Cannondale I got for one son:
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7571249b11.jpg

Nice thing for you to do Andy. The frame may be a bit large but you’ll get it figured out. If is too large I have a Voyageur frameset, 49cm IIRC, that would need paint but you get the bonus of cantilevers. Price would be VERY reasonable.

I would keep the Hybrid suggestion others have offered as plan B.

Katana tubing is Tange Infinity?

Working in a bike store back in the '70s and '80s, I used to dread having conversations with parents who were determined to buy bikes for their kid to "grow into."

(I don't think I ever came right out and said what I was always thinking, which was something like, "If you buy a bike that fits correctly now and then buy a new one each time your child is ready for the next one, you'll buy exactly one more bike than you would have otherwise, and your kid will have actually enjoyed each of those bikes.")

In this case, 52 center to center is approximately 53.5 center to top, which is the parameter all of us are more used to using for fitting bikes. If you're a tall rider, that seems tiny, but that's an appropriate size for a rider in the 5' 6" to 5' 10" range.

If I'd come across that Katana and bought it, I too would be tempted to persuade myself that it can be made to fit the girl, but I hope I'd come to my senses before pushing her to accept a bike that would be an awkward fit at best and that might put her off the idea that riding can be fun at worst.

The earlier post suggesting finding an inexpensive used hybrid (with a sloping top tube for a comfortable and safe fit) was right on the money.

13 year old girl is probably not going to grow taller - women mature earlier than men (in many ways!) Women also tend to have longer leg to height ratio. 99% of the BF CVer's that post here are men, so we're used to sizing mentally as if they were men.

I appreciate this input, as well as that from @Clang and @smd4. I fully understand the importance of fit. They looked at several bikes and she took a liking to this one. I told the mom to buy it with confidence and that if it didn't work, I'd buy it from her at cost (because I'm sure this bike is worth more than $85 cleaned up). My comment about growing was more about saying (to myself mostly) that it's not at all certain that she will get taller.

I appreciate the offer. When I last bought a bike for one of my own daughters when she was a teenager, she loved being able to pick a color for a cheap powder coating. If this one is too big, I'll be in touch with you.

This is good info. I happen to have a set of 700x28 GP 4 Seasons on the shelf, so I'd have probably discovered this on my own, but it's nice to get a preview before trying it.

And I have the same in British green that needs paint as well in between the bikes (roughly 51cm) that would also be CHEAP. In case the size would be a better fit than the Katana and @RustyJames Voyager.

I had one of these and really dug it: quick and agile without being at all twitchy, with bonus points for the uncommon and cool triple triangle. It was just plain fun to ride and I think it's a great choice for your plan.
Mine was going to be a speedy commuter until I tried to mount a rear rack. :foo:

Obligatory photo:
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...446f94b6db.png

Yes, it is.

Georgena Terry, who is best known for having been a pioneering designer of women-specific bike frames, researched the notion that women tend to have longer legs than men for a given height and found that the evidence says otherwise (see, for example, this study). Women of average or greater height who are slim usually appear to have longer legs, but that perception is primarily a consequence of their having less muscle mass at the top of the leg than men of the same height.

Nice looking bike. Hopefully after she tries the fit it is good. I think a 13 year old girl may have plenty of growing to do. A young lady I ran a half with less than four years ago when she was 14 and was probably Merry's height is now nearly as tall as I am. Nevertheless, as many have suggested, it is probably more important that the bike fit now. When I was a boy, my parents could afford one pair of shoes a year for me and they were bought with the intention that I "had room to grow". Fortunately all the bikes I had growing up fit me at the time. Now I have a couple of bikes that while they aren't the best fit for me, I can manage. But I don't enjoy riding them as much as my bikes that fit well. So I can see where a good fit may be important for allowing someone exploring getting into cycling to enjoy it the best.

And off topic, but perhaps Merry's parents could take her to a shop that does gait evaluations to see if her joint problems are shoe related. The girl I mentioned in the previous paragraph is now 17 and we are going to run her first full marathon in November. She has discovered that there is a certain make and model of shoe that works best for her. If Merry enjoys jogging, perhaps there is a way to enjoy it and cycling.

That’s exactly why we named ours Kid1 and Kid2.

Huh, learn something every day! Thanks for posting that.

How common are those triple triangle frames? Haven't seen many other than old GTs.

Merry came over earlier in the week for a test fit. I think she's a bit taller than I was told. She was able to stand flat-footed over the top tube and with the saddle low she had the proper knee bend and the bottom of her pedal stroke. I'm not 100% sure it's not too big, but I'm going out of town for a couple of weeks and she's anxious to start riding, so I built it up and let her try it while I'm away. I said if it didn't feel right, I'd find something smaller when I get back.

In any event, I think the bike turned out looking great. I had originally planned to cobble something together with the original Shimano Light Action derailleur and a mismatched set of 10-speed brifters from my parts bin, Unfortunately, the left brifter had a cable broken off in the shift mechanism and the right brifter was missing the brake attachment bit. So, I decided to make this even nicer, taking a matching 3x10 Tiagra 4600 group off of a bike that I haven't ridden in a while.

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This is a whole lot nicer than the bike I had when I was 13. I threw in an old U-lock and a mini-lecture about how staying with the bike is better than using the lock. I'm a bit nervous about that, as she lives in the city and not the suburbs.

Oh man, great job on that, hopefully we hear that its all good and she is off to the races, maybe literally. ;)