Bike Forums

Bike Forums (https://www.bikeforums.net/forum.php)
-   Classic & Vintage (https://www.bikeforums.net/forumdisplay.php?f=181)
-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

w1gfh 05-14-16 06:53 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 18766650)
Probably because I spent 30 years as a tool and die maker I appreciate the craftsmanship that went into these shifters. I like the embossed design on yours even better than these shifters from the 50s. Unfortunately, by the 60s they stopped using the embossed faceplates and simply silk screened the logo onto a plain plate and did away with the classy 2 piece pulley clip.

Love the older shifters. The ones that were made to be mounted on handlebars facing up have their own distinctive method of operation using the index finger to "pull" down from gear 3-2-1 and "flick" up from 1-2-3.

I got a steel pulley repro from Gentleman Cyclist to replace the plastic one, which tended to get melty in warm weather.

Loose Chain 05-14-16 09:20 AM

Are there any replacement bottom bracket sets for these bikes that can use the original cottered cranks? I do not need one, just asking?

Headsets?

How loose/tight do y'all set these BB up? I have a tiny amount of wiggle in both, set too tight until I tighten the locking ring and then that makes a little wiggle?

I now have five E3Ss! One for me, one for my wife, one for my nieces, one each for the twins and one for their mommy. Now I need one more for their dad! And a few extra ;).

slowtostart 05-14-16 10:16 AM


Originally Posted by w1gfh (Post 18766799)
Love the older shifters. The ones that were made to be mounted on handlebars facing up have their own distinctive method of operation using the index finger to "pull" down from gear 3-2-1 and "flick" up from 1-2-3.

I got a steel pulley repro from Gentleman Cyclist to replace the plastic one, which tended to get melty in warm weather.

Thanks for the info. I need a pulley and fulcrum sleeve. Both are plastic on the '71 Dunelt. The fulcrum sleeve is disintegrating.

As for my shifter cable conundrum, I purchased "Sunlite Three-Speed Cables" with a 60" housing X 65" inner wire. The package includes "Adjusting hardware". "Fits Sturmey Archer". Nothing ventured, nothing learned. I'll be very happy if it functions. This was a very LBS experience. They were quite sure I should replace the shifter as well. I've paid less for Craigslist bicycles and happy to explore that solution.

I have a shifter archive dating from 1956 to 1974. Anyone know why "Sturmey Archer" appears upside down on the shifters? Fits the shape of the face plate?

Is it blasphemy to replace a more modern shifter with a better quality one of an earlier vintage?

I am ever thankful for the guidance you continue to offer. Time to plant tomatoes.

STS

w1gfh 05-14-16 10:27 AM


Originally Posted by slowtostart (Post 18767085)
Anyone know why "Sturmey Archer" appears upside down on the shifters? Fits the shape of the face plate?

Those are the ones that are meant to be mounted facing down and operated with the thumb.

These are the ones that are meant to be mounted facing up and operated with the index finger.
http://www.sturmey-archerheritage.co...os/pic-647.jpg


Is it blasphemy to replace a more modern shifter with a better quality one of an earlier vintage?
Nope. I installed the early 1960s one on the far left (photo above) on a 1970 bike because I prefer its looks!

michaelz28 05-14-16 10:39 AM


Originally Posted by w1gfh (Post 18767107)
Those are the ones that are meant to be mounted facing down and operated with the thumb.

These are the ones that are meant to be mounted facing up and operated with the index finger.
http://www.sturmey-archerheritage.co...os/pic-647.jpg



Nope. I installed the early 1960s one on the far left (photo above) on a 1970 bike because I prefer its looks!

my 74 has the one on the left .

w1gfh 05-14-16 10:49 AM

Not sure of the chronology, but Raleighs after 68 or so went to this "metal body with plastic faceplate" trigger:
https://urbanadventureleague.files.w...ggerdetail.jpg

Then, when the plastic eventually cracked and fell off, you were left with this:
http://memberfiles.freewebs.com/63/7...%20Shifter.jpg

michaelz28 05-14-16 11:47 AM


Originally Posted by w1gfh (Post 18767144)
Not sure of the chronology, but Raleighs after 68 or so went to this "metal body with plastic faceplate" trigger:
https://urbanadventureleague.files.w...ggerdetail.jpg

Then, when the plastic eventually cracked and fell off, you were left with this:
http://memberfiles.freewebs.com/63/7...%20Shifter.jpg

sorry actually thats the one ... but it is uncracked http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/h...psbecxbycf.jpg

San Rensho 05-14-16 12:32 PM


Originally Posted by noglider (Post 18749514)
And oil ports really are a good thing if you use them right. Oil frequently, and DON'T FORGET! I did my three-month European trip oiling my hubs frequently. After my trip, I disassembled the bearings, and man, were they clean. The trouble is, if you forget, you're in trouble, so we use grease, because that tolerates less regular maintenance.

And even jf the bike doesnt have an oil port you can squirt oil down the seat post to lubricate the bb. Just pour oil in untill it starts to run out of the bb at the spindle.

noglider 05-14-16 01:49 PM


Originally Posted by San Rensho (Post 18767348)
And even jf the bike doesnt have an oil port you can squirt oil down the seat post to lubricate the bb. Just pour oil in untill it starts to run out of the bb at the spindle.

You know, you just gave me an idea. Until further notice, I'm going to oil my bikes' bearings. I have too many bikes to regrease on an adequate schedule. I'll pour a lot of oil in all of them. If I get around to greasing, fine, but if I don't, I think I can be more reliable with oiling than with greasing.

Velocivixen 05-14-16 02:13 PM

I hope all you bearing "oilers" keep your bikes somewhere where you don't mind getting oil on the floor.

San Rensho 05-14-16 03:10 PM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 18767552)
I hope all you bearing "oilers" keep your bikes somewhere where you don't mind getting oil on the floor.

Please, English three speeds are like English cars and English motorcycles back in the day, they leak oil like a sieve. In fact, if they didn't leak oil, that was a good indicator that there was something going wrong, that you ran out of oil.

noglider 05-14-16 03:14 PM

@slowtostart, I've used the Speedy Switches. They work, but for less time before they need replacement. If you get one, don't pay too much for it. I think I even have a spare, but someone else offered one to you already.

Velocivixen 05-14-16 05:25 PM

@San Renshou - I don't mind oil, but my bikes are in the garage with concrete floors.

dweenk 05-14-16 05:39 PM


Originally Posted by San Rensho (Post 18767645)
Please, English three speeds are like English cars and English motorcycles back in the day, they leak oil like a sieve. In fact, if they didn't leak oil, that was a good indicator that there was something going wrong, that you ran out of oil.

My late father-in-law drove a Triumph Spitfire from Campbell, CA to SLAC every day in the 1970's. He always kept a shop rag in the driver side floor to drape over his shoe so brake fluid would't drip on it.

Loose Chain 05-14-16 06:20 PM

For posterity, I agree the 17/18 tooth cogs are too steep for most uses but the 22, lol, it is a little on the low side. I would recommend a 20 for anyone who is still a strong cyclist as I can wind out now in my driveway and sparrows are passing me. But, 22 it is for now, it will be okay (maybe). Both bikes are rolling fine now, had a gravel road shakedown ride. We live on a gravel road. Kansas is kind of backwards in that unless the area pays "specials" there is no sewage or paved roads and since the special taxes are rather high, well, we all have gravel roads. Imagine, some people have to go look for gravel, I have to look for pavement!

Yeah, 22 is too low, my opinion.

For the cracked plastic shifter covers, I used a Dremal to remove the cracked area in a smooth radius and then adhered it with crystal clear silicone. It can still be removed, in another three decades or so.

w1gfh 05-14-16 07:24 PM


Originally Posted by Loose Chain (Post 18768023)
For posterity, I agree the 17/18 tooth cogs are too steep for most uses but the 22, lol, it is a little on the low side. I would recommend a 20 for anyone who is still a strong cyclist as I can wind out now in my driveway and sparrows are passing me. But, 22 it is for now, it will be okay (maybe). Both bikes are rolling fine now, had a gravel road shakedown ride. We live on a gravel road. Kansas is kind of backwards in that unless the area pays "specials" there is no sewage or paved roads and since the special taxes are rather high, well, we all have gravel roads. Imagine, some people have to go look for gravel, I have to look for pavement! Yeah, 22 is too low, my opinion.

+1
I put a 20T on the Sports and find it's the ideal gearing - at least for me.

BigChief 05-14-16 08:08 PM


Originally Posted by w1gfh (Post 18768182)
+1
I put a 20T on the Sports and find it's the ideal gearing - at least for me.

One of the nice things about the Sturmey Archer system is that you can change the overall gearing to your preference without a lot of effort or expense.

SirMike1983 05-14-16 09:22 PM

An older shifter is fine. They usually look nicer and work a bit better. The question is whether you want the upside down type, or the standard type. An earlier part will look perfectly fine on the bike. It's the later ones with the cheesy black or white covers that will look out of place.


Originally Posted by slowtostart (Post 18767085)
Thanks for the info. I need a pulley and fulcrum sleeve. Both are plastic on the '71 Dunelt. The fulcrum sleeve is disintegrating.

As for my shifter cable conundrum, I purchased "Sunlite Three-Speed Cables" with a 60" housing X 65" inner wire. The package includes "Adjusting hardware". "Fits Sturmey Archer". Nothing ventured, nothing learned. I'll be very happy if it functions. This was a very LBS experience. They were quite sure I should replace the shifter as well. I've paid less for Craigslist bicycles and happy to explore that solution.

I have a shifter archive dating from 1956 to 1974. Anyone know why "Sturmey Archer" appears upside down on the shifters? Fits the shape of the face plate?

Is it blasphemy to replace a more modern shifter with a better quality one of an earlier vintage?

I am ever thankful for the guidance you continue to offer. Time to plant tomatoes.

STS


agmetal 05-14-16 09:24 PM

Just got home from picking up some bits for my two Tourists: An 8-volt DynoHub, non-reflector pedals, and Lucas tail reflector for the 1937, and a front brake stirrup for the 1975 DL-1 project bike (I'll be returning the one that doesn't fit). Tomorrow or Monday I'm going back to get a pair of rims and maybe a couple other little things.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v8...514_225949.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v8...514_230021.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v8...514_230043.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v8...514_230112.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v8...514_230121.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v8...514_230150.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v8...514_230201.jpg

Loose Chain 05-14-16 10:41 PM


Originally Posted by w1gfh (Post 18768182)
+1
I put a 20T on the Sports and find it's the ideal gearing - at least for me.

My wife seems okay with the 22t cog. I am definitely under geared but since I will mostly be in no hurry, especially with her in tow I do not feel the need to immediately change it. Heck, who knows, in another 10 years I may appreciate it ;).

We did about five miles on our (improved) gravel roads today. I am impressed with how confidently these E3Ss handle the gravel, very smooth. Though, mine is a touch twitchy, it needs a longer stem, they all do if you ask me. But, very smooth. New chains, fresh grease, clean oil in the hubs, new tires, Sun rims and these two E3Ss just ghosted along, a gentle clicking from the AW hub and the swoosh of stainless spokes glistening in the sun, cannot be any better.

I notice something on the step through 21, the seat tube is 21 c/t and the effective TT is 21 c/c. The 21 diamond frame seat tube is 21 c/t and the TT is a skosh over 22 c/c. My 23 diamond frame seat tube is just under 23 c/t and the TT is a skosh UNDER 22 c/c. In my universe the 23 is smaller by a little than my 21!

J

Velocivixen 05-14-16 10:56 PM

Miss Molly's problem was not the clutch spring, but the shifter. Specifically having to do with the pawl and spring. Used a screwdriver to pry it up, not it just hangs there loosey goosey. I had another one exactly the same only with a yellowed plastic face plate. Used that shifter and other clear face plate and all is well with the world.

With th the flick shifter the way to install a cable is to pull the trigger down past "1" and an internal part of the shifter forces open the pawl just enough to guide the cable into place. Well that wasn't happening on the original shifter. So somehow that made it so going from "2" to "3" I had to actively push the lever into place. Now I just flick the lever and it clicks right into place.

agmetal 05-14-16 11:54 PM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 18768546)
Miss Molly's problem was not the clutch spring, but the shifter. Specifically having to do with the pawl and spring. Used a screwdriver to pry it up, not it just hangs there loosey goosey. I had another one exactly the same only with a yellowed plastic face plate. Used that shifter and other clear face plate and all is well with the world.

With th the flick shifter the way to install a cable is to pull the trigger down past "1" and an internal part of the shifter forces open the pawl just enough to guide the cable into place. Well that wasn't happening on the original shifter. So somehow that made it so going from "2" to "3" I had to actively push the lever into place. Now I just flick the lever and it clicks right into place.


Glad you figured it out! On my first adult bike (a Columbia Sports III), I used to have problems all the time with the cable end popping out of the shifter - as a result, I've had a bad taste in my mouth regarding the "classic trigger" shifter ever since.

Narhay 05-15-16 02:02 AM

I had two flat tires on Wednesday. The rim tape wasn't wide enough and poked holes in both my tubes. I repaired them, adjusted the rear hub, replaced the rim tape with some I didn't know I had and tossed the chain in the ultrasonic cleaner. I did add the Zimbale bag to the bike last month. I like the size but it does hang at a funny angle and I can hit it with the back of my legs if I want to. It is fine otherwise and excellent quality.

http://i1037.photobucket.com/albums/...psrryv03qe.jpg

http://i1037.photobucket.com/albums/...psyfnotevu.jpg

http://i1037.photobucket.com/albums/...pseeesftfw.jpg

streets 05-15-16 03:01 AM

@Narhay That Superbe is stunning. I had an Elswick Hopper in a very similar colour and when as clean as yours it really turned heads. Compliments the chrome perfectly.

gster 05-15-16 05:29 AM


Originally Posted by Narhay (Post 18768745)
I had two flat tires on Wednesday. The rim tape wasn't wide enough and poked holes in both my tubes. I repaired them, adjusted the rear hub, replaced the rim tape with some I didn't know I had and tossed the chain in the ultrasonic cleaner. I did add the Zimbale bag to the bike last month. I like the size but it does hang at a funny angle and I can hit it with the back of my legs if I want to. It is fine otherwise and excellent quality.

http://i1037.photobucket.com/albums/...psrryv03qe.jpg

http://i1037.photobucket.com/albums/...psyfnotevu.jpg

http://i1037.photobucket.com/albums/...pseeesftfw.jpg

Your bike looks like it just left the factory.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:44 AM.


Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.