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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

clubman 01-17-23 03:48 PM


Originally Posted by markk900 (Post 22770442)
anotherbike : much older models (40s and 50s) were often coaster brake with optional 3 speed, so not surprised you could find a range of coaster brake bikes. I have one bike with a Perry B100 coaster - it’s a crappy brake even with a new brake liner…..What happened to the coaster bikes of my youth that you could lay huge skid marks? 😎

Yeah, those Perry hubs seemed to be popular on Canadian bikes during the late stages of the war and they were definitely crapola. I'm thinking the best quality steel inventory went to arms makers.

You only weighed 70's as a kid! ;)

cudak888 01-17-23 09:05 PM

Did some room refurbishing and dumped the IGH fleet in it:

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...d9b9d1fc21.jpg


https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...8cc2091772.jpg


-Kurt

pastorbobnlnh 01-17-23 09:25 PM


Originally Posted by cudak888 (Post 22772460)
Did some room refurbishing and dumped the IGH fleet in it:

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...8cc2091772.jpg


-Kurt

And why do I not spy a certain 1980 refugee from NH living in climate controlled goodness? :innocent:

I take it the '50s refugee made the cut.

BTW, I took the Voyageur II with the SA AM hub for my first long ride today. I adore the gearing on that hub. Perfect for me!

cudak888 01-17-23 09:30 PM


Originally Posted by pastorbobnlnh (Post 22772471)
And why do I not spy a certain 1980 refugee from NH living in climate controlled goodness? :innocent:

I take it the '50s refugee made the cut.

BTW, I took the Voyageur II with the SA AM hub for my first long ride today. I adore the gearing on that hub. Perfect for me!

It and the '51 are in the shop until that blasted file cabinet gets cleared out and sent to scrap. They're the ones that can go to the shop for a bit and not be the worse for wear.

'50 is third in the row, in front of the Humber.

I've got to try something like that AM sometime. Haven't had a chance to play with any exotic Sturmeys, but I've been able to get a taste of nice narrow gearing thanks to my Nexus 8 hubs. Really a joy.

-Kurt

dirtman 01-18-23 02:07 AM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 22772148)
Yeah, those Perry hubs seemed to be popular on Canadian bikes during the late stages of the war and they were definitely crapola. I'm thinking the best quality steel inventory went to arms makers.

You only weighed 70's as a kid! ;)

Most of the coaster brake models I've found have been newer, mostly in the 62-72 range.
The only one I kept is a 62 Dunelt with the Perry hub.
I've had many bikes with the Perry hub, mostly English lightweights and a few Schwinn balloon tire bikes and none ever gave me any problems in general.
Basic maintenance kept them up and working just fine. They seemed to fair pretty well and all were on adult size bikes.

There's a lot to the thought that we're all a lot heavier these days than we were back when we were just kids locking up tires and marking up the pavement.
Tires are also very different, newer tires are likely made from different compounds than they were 60 years ago. Many tires now don't even leave a mark if they do slide, and certainly not like those old rubber tires did back then. I'd suppose new tires are likely made from more synthetic rubber than back in the day.

The older I get the more likely I am to just hop on one of my old single speed bikes, they tend to be lighter and there's less to go wrong.
As a kid, the name of the game was speed and showing off, that fades as we get older, now its more about just getting out and riding and enjoying the ride.

3speedslow 01-18-23 09:13 AM

Last paragraph… Amen.

Ged117 01-18-23 09:18 AM


Originally Posted by cudak888 (Post 22772460)
Did some room refurbishing and dumped the IGH fleet in it:

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...8cc2091772.jpg


-Kurt

I spy, with my little eye, something that is Raleigh green...

Ready to ride, alongside some pals of the period! Nice to see it - hard to believe it spent 30 odd years in a barn in Hamilton, Ontario, and now its enjoying sunny climes in Florida.

Its replacement, a Bitsathis, Bitsathat Triumph, doing yeoman's work on the daily. Much better its this machine facing the snow and salt paths than a nice original Superbe. I have to say though - this bike doesn't ride nearly as 'nicely' as the Superbe, and I am not sure why that would be. Something to do with the frame?

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...2e0593b5_b.jpgPXL_20230112_131500857

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...2d81244a_b.jpgPXL_20221215_131835788.MP

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...41e3d6d4_b.jpgPXL_20221215_132153036

Ged117 01-18-23 09:09 PM

This bike is for sale in Ontario. Anyone know details? Seller claims 1920s Raleigh, looks to have a drum brake in the back, and either fixed or single speed. Pretty neat.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...97f3e04f52.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2990a59958.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2e8c130b30.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...33910ce272.jpg

SirMike1983 01-19-23 08:40 AM

The bike is quite old, but whether it goes all the way back to the 1920s, you'd have to look at the bike more closely to see. On early bikes, there should be nickel rather than chrome plating. Bikes pre-dating the traffic safety acts also may not have the white tipped rear fender or a reflector. Drum brake hubs often have date codes on them, so they may be of help as well. You're more likely to find a very old Raleigh in Canada than the USA though. If in doubt, go have a look.


Originally Posted by Ged117 (Post 22773542)
This bike is for sale in Ontario. Anyone know details? Seller claims 1920s Raleigh, looks to have a drum brake in the back, and either fixed or single speed. Pretty neat.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...97f3e04f52.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2990a59958.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2e8c130b30.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...33910ce272.jpg


Salubrious 01-19-23 11:51 AM


Originally Posted by Ged117 (Post 22773542)
This bike is for sale in Ontario. Anyone know details? Seller claims 1920s Raleigh, looks to have a drum brake in the back, and either fixed or single speed. Pretty neat.




https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...33910ce272.jpg

That is a pre-war saddle FWIW.

Ged117 01-19-23 12:00 PM


Originally Posted by SirMike1983 (Post 22773836)
The bike is quite old, but whether it goes all the way back to the 1920s, you'd have to look at the bike more closely to see. On early bikes, there should be nickel rather than chrome plating. Bikes pre-dating the traffic safety acts also may not have the white tipped rear fender or a reflector. Drum brake hubs often have date codes on them, so they may be of help as well. You're more likely to find a very old Raleigh in Canada than the USA though. If in doubt, go have a look.


Originally Posted by Salubrious (Post 22774085)
That is a pre-war saddle FWIW.


Thanks Salubrious - I am intrigued by this bicycle. Any idea when the white tipped rear fender became a requirement? A quick google of British regulations didn't reveal.

Does this fork look bent, or is it the design? I'll try and find some period advertisements.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...8ca26f954b.jpg

markk900 01-19-23 12:14 PM

The 1939 catalog has a similar model:

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/retrora...9/pages/22.htm

As a "just before the war" model the bright parts are painted black in this version, but the ladies model 6 did come with an optiona drum rear and rim brake front.

I agree though that the picture makes the fork look bent. Won't be sure unless you go see the bike.

Edit: this person claims a very similar bike is a 1921....certainly matches a lot of the details of the one in question...

https://myvintagebicycles.wordpress....es-loop-frame/

Salubrious 01-19-23 12:16 PM


Originally Posted by Ged117 (Post 22774095)
Thanks Salubrious - I am intrigued by this bicycle. Any idea when the white tipped rear fender became a requirement? A quick google of British regulations didn't reveal.

Does this fork look bent, or is it the design? I'll try and find some period advertisements.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...8ca26f954b.jpg

As I understand it the White Tail came in during WW2 when there were blackouts imposed. The white tail made the bike more visible in the dark. Pre-war bikes don't have the white tail. As always, with Raleighs in particular it can be tricky knowing if all the parts on the bike are original.

gna 01-19-23 01:01 PM


Originally Posted by Salubrious (Post 22770704)
The Bay City Hill is 2 1/2 miles long. With a 46/22 usually you do fine as long as the bike isn't fully loaded. If you go on the Tour you can put your gear in the '3-speed Lorry' and pick it up in Wabasha at the end of the day and Red Wing the next day.

If you go 'off route' such as I do by taking the rustic road just outside of Maiden Rock, you'll encounter more hills. But totally worth in IMO.

People come from all over the US to participate in this event. Jon the Gentleman Cyclist is already taking entrance fees. The even is the weekend of May 20th this year to avoid Mother's Day.

A 21T or 22T helps, but it can be done with an 18T or 19T. There's no shame in pushing.

There is a very short, steep hill leaving Maiden Rock, but it's board flat from Pepin into Nelson.

I'm already registered for 2023. I'm hoping for good weather. Trying to decide which bike to ride. I'm disappointed my daughter doesn't want to ride this year, after I fixed up a nice Raleigh for her, but that's right before finals.

Salubrious 01-19-23 01:46 PM


Originally Posted by gna (Post 22774191)
A 21T or 22T helps, but it can be done with an 18T or 19T. There's no shame in pushing.

There is a very short, steep hill leaving Maiden Rock, but it's board flat from Pepin into Nelson.

I'm already registered for 2023. I'm hoping for good weather. Trying to decide which bike to ride. I'm disappointed my daughter doesn't want to ride this year, after I fixed up a nice Raleigh for her, but that's right before finals.

There's more than one hill after Maiden Rock. The second one I would not want to face with the stock gearing. Its not as steep as the first but its longer and gains more altitude.

If you have a lower gearing, going off route is more attractive. That rustic road I mention is really pretty- it winds through a coulee with lots of wild flowers with 4 creek crossings you have to ride through. At the end of the valley there are more rock formations. You'd be pushing up the grade at the end of that valley but most of its rideable with a 22 on the rear.

gna 01-19-23 03:22 PM


Originally Posted by Salubrious (Post 22774250)
There's more than one hill after Maiden Rock. The second one I would not want to face with the stock gearing. Its not as steep as the first but its longer and gains more altitude.

If you have a lower gearing, going off route is more attractive. That rustic road I mention is really pretty- it winds through a coulee with lots of wild flowers with 4 creek crossings you have to ride through. At the end of the valley there are more rock formations. You'd be pushing up the grade at the end of that valley but most of its rideable with a 22 on the rear.

Do you have a map link? I'm not sure which road that is.

I have a 22T and an S5 hub, so I usually do ok.

thumpism 01-19-23 07:31 PM

Here's a pristine Puch Rugby Sports for $300 in NY. Probably too pretty to be overpriced.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...49843310269925

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...6A&oe=63CF0717

cudak888 01-19-23 08:16 PM


Originally Posted by Salubrious (Post 22774085)
That is a pre-war saddle FWIW.

Is that a 100% for sure? Reason I ask is because the '52 Sports that pastorbobnlnh picked up for me in NH has one, and so does my '50 Superbe from Ged117 . Have no reason to assume either were swapped out, though the badges are slightly different between the two. Can snap a few pictures if you want.


Originally Posted by thumpism (Post 22774748)
Here's a pristine Puch Rugby Sports for $300 in NY. Probably too pretty to be overpriced.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...49843310269925

$300 is over the top, but the Rugby Sports has stainless 27"/ISO 630 rims. Definitely a 3-speed to put on the radar for when one pops up at a better price. A rough one would make for a good winter commuter.

-Kurt

thumpism 01-19-23 10:13 PM

Two Sportses in PA, one men's and one ladies' for $80 each.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...54612919925127

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...FQ&oe=63CEE4E7

thumpism 01-19-23 10:16 PM

$50 for a 23" Sports in MA.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...63711888529328

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...Ag&oe=63CEAF2C

thumpism 01-19-23 10:18 PM

$65 for a 23" Sports in PA.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...17483295519829

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...1A&oe=63CF9728

thumpism 01-19-23 10:22 PM

16" Twenty (I know, I couldn't resist) for $50 in PA.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...32226081181720

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...qA&oe=63CFE933

thumpism 01-19-23 10:35 PM

Is it English? Is it Dutch? Who cares? It's a 23" for $100 in VA.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...55068243187902

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net..._w&oe=63CE3690

markk900 01-20-23 07:51 AM

The last few bikes that thumpism posted prove that there’s no excuse for anyone to not have an English 3 speed 😇

cudak888 01-20-23 10:39 AM


Originally Posted by thumpism (Post 22774919)
Two Sportses in PA, one men's and one ladies' for $80 each.

Kickstand is worth the price of admission.

-Kurt

nlerner 01-20-23 11:56 AM


Originally Posted by Salubrious (Post 22770704)
The Bay City Hill is 2 1/2 miles long. With a 46/22 usually you do fine as long as the bike isn't fully loaded. If you go on the Tour you can put your gear in the '3-speed Lorry' and pick it up in Wabasha at the end of the day and Red Wing the next day.

If you go 'off route' such as I do by taking the rustic road just outside of Maiden Rock, you'll encounter more hills. But totally worth in IMO.

People come from all over the US to participate in this event. Jon the Gentleman Cyclist is already taking entrance fees. The even is the weekend of May 20th this year to avoid Mother's Day.

I'nm seriously considering participating this year; would a drop-bar 3-speed seem totally out of place? On the positive side, it's a frame from 1938.

Macguyver909 01-20-23 12:58 PM

Not at all, There are several drop bar bikes on the tour. I upgraded to drops myself for this year!

Ged117 01-20-23 01:10 PM


Originally Posted by cudak888 (Post 22774810)
Is that a 100% for sure? Reason I ask is because the '52 Sports that pastorbobnlnh picked up for me in NH has one, and so does my '50 Superbe from Ged117 . Have no reason to assume either were swapped out, though the badges are slightly different between the two. Can snap a few pictures if you want.

$300 is over the top, but the Rugby Sports has stainless 27"/ISO 630 rims. Definitely a 3-speed to put on the radar for when one pops up at a better price. A rough one would make for a good winter commuter.

-Kurt

The saddle on the early 20th century Raleigh I posted has two springs - one fore, one aft, and seems beefier. In any case I'm not going to go and look at it - I have enough cycle projects to complete. Fixed gear conversion of the Competition for fast rides this season (have wheelset), new FM hub gear and dynohub wheelset to build for the Wasp (thanks clubman !!) and I need a new 27" front Continental Gatorskin tire for the Voyageur to go on some eastern Ontario tours - the Paselas are too fragile, sick of flats on that bike. \

Yet I remain tempted by all of the interesting old English bike offerings...

Salubrious 01-20-23 01:22 PM


Originally Posted by nlerner (Post 22775431)
I'nm seriously considering participating this year; would a drop-bar 3-speed seem totally out of place? On the positive side, it's a frame from 1938.

Whatever you're comfortable on is what you ride. Lauterwassers turn up on occasion too.


Originally Posted by cudak888 (Post 22774810)
Is that a 100% for sure? Reason I ask is because the '52 Sports that pastorbobnlnh picked up for me in NH has one, and so does my '50 Superbe from Ged117 . Have no reason to assume either were swapped out, though the badges are slightly different between the two. Can snap a few pictures if you want.

-Kurt

AFAIK Brooks did away with that curl that goes over the front after the war. I expect that since the bikes you mentioned are both shortly after that Raleigh might have been using up old stock. OTOH I could be completely wrong...

thumpism 01-21-23 10:27 PM

Looks like a shiny modded Raleigh Colt with 3SC for $35 in TN.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...59195734957367

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...jQ&oe=63D1F2F5


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