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-   -   Ouch, the price went up (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=1242824)

late 11-25-21 03:51 AM

Ouch, the price went up
 
I went to my bike shop to get a new tire, and the price of the Verve 2+ has gone up to $2849. I think it was $2400 when my wife got hers. The tire also cost more.

I watched a Youtube video yesterday where this guy was saying he was an insider and that the supply mess was going to continue for at least a couple more years. If that's true, I would guess that the European bike craze has a lot to do with it, they are buying a lot of bikes, and a lot of those are ebikes.

Leisesturm 11-26-21 12:50 AM

Your logic defies me. What does the European Bike Craze (WTF) have to do with American retailers selling every bike they had on the racks and no more to be had for the forseeable? The European bike community was saturated. It is an established and mature organism. Everyone who wanted a bike over there had one. America had the lowest bike ownership per capita prior to the Pandemic and the explosion of interest in cycling OVER HERE resulted in the meltdown of the supply chains. And, no, Europeans do not buy more e-bikes than us. Their commutes are short, the terrain (mostly) flat, and very restrictive legislation makes owning them not as exciting as it seems. The supply chain mess OVER HERE is because AMERICA only has one port built to 20th Century standards and it is swamped for ... a very long time, like the man said. That isn't anyone else's fault.

late 11-26-21 08:11 AM


Originally Posted by Leisesturm (Post 22320572)

Your logic defies me. What does the European Bike Craze (WTF) have to do with American retailers selling every bike they had on the racks and no more to be had for the forseeable?

The European bike community was saturated.

It is an established and mature organism. Everyone who wanted a bike over there had one. America had the lowest bike ownership per capita prior to the Pandemic and the explosion of interest in cycling OVER HERE resulted in the meltdown of the supply chains.

And, no, Europeans do not buy more e-bikes than us. Their commutes are short, the terrain (mostly) flat, and very restrictive legislation makes owning them not as exciting as it seems. The supply chain mess OVER HERE is because AMERICA only has one port built to 20th Century standards and it is swamped for ... a very long time, like the man said. That isn't anyone else's fault.


https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1c4ac39a77.png

https://ecf.com/news-and-events/news...cle-sales-2030

"The report collates the sales data of all 27 European Union countries, plus the UK (which left the EU pm 1st Feb 2020 as a result of their ‘Brexit’ decision).For calendar year 2020 sales of bikes including e-bikes grew by 40% over 2019 to a total market value of €18.3 billion (A$29 billion)

Manuel Marsilio, CONEBI general manager, added, “European citizens are selecting greener e-mobility options over buying cars or using public transport, which resulted in e-bikes enjoying a staggering 52% increase in sales. E-bike sales leapt to €10.6 billion (A$16.7 billion) in 2020.”
https://thelatzreport.com.au/news/wo...ale-in-europe/


https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...15432a3575.png

https://www.eco-counter.com/blog/loo...ke-count-data/

“People say it took the Dutch or the Danish cities 30 or 50 years to build their cycle infrastructure, but we don’t have this kind of time,” said Buczyński. “We have the climate emergency, which we cannot deal with in 50 years. We need to change the transport system pretty quickly, and it will be very difficult without making cycling a viable option for everyone.

“We need to do it fast, maybe not in two months but in a few years.”
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeands...recovery-plans

willibrord 11-26-21 10:11 AM

We need to bring bike manufacturing back to America.
Maybe the new incentives for evs will help to do that.

Leisesturm 11-26-21 02:35 PM


Originally Posted by late (Post 22320720)
twaffle redacted

Not at all sure what all that has to do with what I said. I don't care what the European sales figures are. What are the U.S. figures? The entirety of the E.U. population that rides bikes is probably half the population of Texas alone! The high net worth economies that are highly visible from over here represent a fraction of the overall E.U. population. We all know about the outlier participation of The Netherlands (Holland), Germany, and France in cycling. What about Poland? Serbia? The combined populations of Germany, France, The UK, The Netherlands ... I don't think those COUNTRIES populations combined exceeds that of ... Texas. Whatever 'increases' are being noticed in Europe have jack all to do with America's lack of inventory supply. E.U. brands are NEVER sold in U.S. bike stores. It isn't allowed. There are maybe three U.S. registered importers that can get their hands on Gazelles, Bakfiets or other special E.U. manufactured bikes. French, Swiss or other bikes? Nope. Not seen here in any numbers and deffo not SOLD here by U.S. retailers. Also, it must be said, Dutch bikes are made in Dutch. They do not import nearly as much bicycles for their domestic market, if any at all, as the U.S.! You are going to pay $1500 to $2000 USD for a run of the mill Dutch bicycle because it is manufactured in a First World Country. The American bicycle industry lives and dies on BSO's (bicycle shaped objects) imported from China. Even the ubiquitous Trek's and Giant's that dominate the middle of the market are essentially Chinese. There is your problem. Fix that. Stop blaming Europe.

Leisesturm 11-26-21 02:38 PM


Originally Posted by willibrord (Post 22320845)
We need to bring bike manufacturing back to America.
Maybe the new incentives for evs will help to do that.

Nope. The genie does not go back into the bottle. The Beast has acquired the taste of outsourced low wage labor. Look at all the angst over paying skilled labor a fair wage in the face of the most decimated labor market since ... since ever. They just can't do it. Even now a $15/hr. minimum wage law at the Federal level wouldn't make it out of Chambers.

willibrord 11-26-21 03:28 PM


Originally Posted by Leisesturm (Post 22321086)
Nope. The genie does not go back into the bottle. The Beast has acquired the taste of outsourced low wage labor. Look at all the angst over paying skilled labor a fair wage in the face of the most decimated labor market since ... since ever. They just can't do it. Even now a $15/hr. minimum wage law at the Federal level wouldn't make it out of Chambers.

We need tariffs and quotas on cheap Asian derived bicycles .They are talking about incentives for evs manufactured in the US, but not evs manufactured anywhere else. If this applies to ebikes and is supported by the proper import controls and industrial policy, it could mean a resurgence of American made products. We should really hope it happens.

late 11-26-21 03:59 PM


Originally Posted by Leisesturm (Post 22321082)

Not at all sure what all that has to do with what I said. I don't care what the European sales figures are. What are the U.S. figures? The entirety of the E.U. population that rides bikes is probably half the population of Texas alone! The high net worth economies that are highly visible from over here represent a fraction of the overall E.U. population. We all know about the outlier participation of The Netherlands (Holland), Germany, and France in cycling. What about Poland? Serbia? The combined populations of Germany, France, The UK, The Netherlands ... I don't think those COUNTRIES populations combined exceeds that of ... Texas. Whatever 'increases' are being noticed in Europe have jack all to do with America's lack of inventory supply. E.U. brands are NEVER sold in U.S. bike stores. It isn't allowed. There are maybe three U.S. registered importers that can get their hands on Gazelles, Bakfiets or other special E.U. manufactured bikes. French, Swiss or other bikes? Nope. Not seen here in any numbers and deffo not SOLD here by U.S. retailers. Also, it must be said, Dutch bikes are made in Dutch. They do not import nearly as much bicycles for their domestic market, if any at all, as the U.S.! You are going to pay $1500 to $2000 USD for a run of the mill Dutch bicycle because it is manufactured in a First World Country. The American bicycle industry lives and dies on BSO's (bicycle shaped objects) imported from China. Even the ubiquitous Trek's and Giant's that dominate the middle of the market are essentially Chinese. There is your problem. Fix that. Stop blaming Europe.



You said the Euro market was saturated, I proved there was a bike boom. If you watched international news, bikes shops across Europe got sold out, and were having trouble keeping up with demand.

The disruptions in the supply chain, combined with the increase in demand on both sides of the pond, has made a real mess.

As to sales, here is what that looks like:

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e23c6ecf46.jpg
Europe is buying a lot more ebikes than we are.

Now, if you are going to reply, might I ask that you come up with something substantive...

billridesbikes 11-26-21 04:37 PM


Originally Posted by willibrord (Post 22321123)
We need tariffs and quotas on cheap Asian derived bicycles .They are talking about incentives for evs manufactured in the US, but not evs manufactured anywhere else. If this applies to ebikes and is supported by the proper import controls and industrial policy, it could mean a resurgence of American made products. We should really hope it happens.

And why should Americans be forced to pay more for bicycles just because of where they're made? It would be a tax on the consumer with highly dubious benefits to the country as a whole.

The 'Build Back Better' law in it's current form from the house allows a $7500 EV tax credit for any EV car no matter where it is from, and additional $500 tax credit it the battery was made in the US, and another additional $4500 tax credit if it was built in the US by union labor. Only 1 EV currently manufactured qualifies for the entire $12,500 tax credit. Also, there is a $1500 tax credit available for any e-bike with a purchase price of $5000 or less and limited to those with income of less than $150k/year. But all of this will probably change or die in the Senate version.

Leisesturm 11-26-21 10:03 PM


Originally Posted by late (Post 22321159)
You said the Euro market was saturated,

I said a lot more than that. If you are talking about bikes OF COURSE the still evolving e-bike sector of the E.U. market is bigger than ours. We don't buy a comparable amount of bikes of any kind, because we don't use bikes, outside of a limited enthusiast market.. You still haven't (and cannot) explain how that affects our supply of bikes which do not come from, or go to, Europe.

late 11-27-21 03:10 AM


Originally Posted by Leisesturm (Post 22321447)

You still haven't (and cannot) explain how that affects our supply of bikes which do not come from, or go to, Europe.

That's easy, the manufacturers give top priority to their most reliable customers, and a lot of them are in Europe. On top of that, there is the demand aspect of of having a bike boom in Europe. Suppliers simply cannot keep up with demand, and that pushes back delivery dates.


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