Originally Posted by
panzerwagon
It seems like too many folks are getting hung up on semantics and nomenclature.
No, apparently the primary person hung up on semantics is
Wildwood , and not "too many" others.
The intent behind the structure and division of any online discussion forum should strive to bring together like-minded folk. The early brifter-era road bikes certainly have a place here in C&V, but I can imagine the deluge of C&V posts tend not to draw in as many folks with interest exclusive to that 'era' (if I may call it that).
One may say the same for high wheelers, or for bone shakers or for 3 or 4 speed pre-war bikes, or pre-war bikes in general, Schwinns, boom bikes, Italian bikes, French bikes, Japanese bikes, bikes with chain stay mounted brakes, Russian bikes, Croatian bikes, bikes with center pulls, Romanian bikes, bikes with toe clips, Indian bikes, English bikes, Harley Davidson bikes, constructeur bikes, single speed bikes, sport touring bikes, or klunkers, or Raleighs or Canadian bikes or Merkx bikes, bikes with cheap tires, or bikes with flat bars, or bikes made by other companies other than what they're branded with, or bikes with clipless pedals, or touring bikes or pretty bikes, bikes with long chainstays racing bikes or bikes with turkey wings, or aluminum bikes, or bikes with cantis, bikes with short chainstays, or bikes with bags, or ugly bikes, or bike with drop bars, or bikes with braze ons, or bikes with stem shifters or bike with reflectors or Takaras, or lugged bikes, or fillet brazed bikes, or bikes with racks or welded bikes or clean bikes, or bikes without bottle cages, or bikes with sidepulls or dirty bikes or... It's ******g nonsense. The premise of this forum is:
This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.
7/8/9/10 speed bikes get just as much traction as any other bikes- more than any high wheeler thread. But apparently,
they're not drama princesses.
I personally agree that the new forum (or sub-forum, wherever it gets placed) is a worthy experiment, whose success might be judged by how much special interest it draws from that crowd.
You can believe that, but in the meantime, that siphons those bikes away from people who would otherwise look at them. Either intentionally or unintentionally. I will tell you that I would NEVER gotten the hair up my ass to upgrade any of my bikes to 10 speed if not for the people here. I would NOT have gone looking specifically for upgraded bikes. I would not have my favorite bike.
Regarding semantics, I've experienced enough of that on classic vintage car forums, where heated discussions occur with disturbing regularity over what should and should not qualify as 'spirit of the original'.
Once again- this is is counter to the interests of a large population of the viewers and posters within this forum- as many, many people have "upgraded" their "vintage" bikes- hence the 'retro roadies.' By the removal of that thread by administrator and moderator staff, that means those bikes are NO LONGER WELCOME HERE. I'd venture to say the VAST majority of the regulars and visitors of this forum are not purists.
I agree with some commenters above that road bikes from the 90s and 00s are somewhat orphaned currently.
No more so than anything else- these bikes and those components are valued and inherently a part of of the C&V forum.
It should not be assumed that qualification for the new forum also disqualifies from the old forum. I enjoy the fluidity of the various sub-forums-- 80s component topics on mechanics forum as well as C&V, vintage touring topics on the touring forum as well as C&V, commuting... you get the gist. In the end, it's all subjective and situational.
It clearly is- if a thread has to do with bikes with 7/8/9 speed drive trains- it is being moved to the "appropriate" forum. Meaning it is no longer here, and therefore no longer welcome here, thus no longer qualified to be in the C&V forum.
A 1983 Univega Specialissima with brifters is C&V, and having brifters does not suddenly transform it into a 1999 Klein. Brifters would be just another component I might upgrade on what is otherwise a C&V bike, big deal. And if I do, I logically expect to continue posting about that bike here.
That is not what is happening- Look at the RetroRoadies thread.
Perhaps we ought to rename the new forum to avoid confusion with what qualifies. How about "early brifter-era road bikes", or something like that?.
For the sake of continuity, with the understanding that the new sub-forum might be experimental, I say leave old threads where they are, unless some compelling reason arises.
The entire premise is... well... stupid. Indexing is a much better dividing line. And that would be about as stupid.