I like 3/4 cycling pants, bibs and usual waist style. It seems they are not that easy to find, at least from companies that are known. I one from Chain Reaction Cycles that I like, except the waist rides pretty low on the hips. They have the gel padding variety on sale now for $62 usd, or so. I have not tried the gel. If I did, I would likely try large instead medium. They do not come without the insert.