cyclezen

Originally Posted by 79pmooney View Post
There's another aspect to this I haven't seen mentioned. (Granted, I haven't read every post.) Weight balance between the wheels. I started my adult life at 6'1/2" with long legs and very long arms. I come far forward (if the bike allows) when I stand. I also sit forward on the seat both going hard on the flat and on hairy descents. So, bikes with either short front ends or long rear ends (again, for me) will be light on the rear wheel. Any dirt on the road and I skid the wheel climbing standing. Bumpy corners on descents are scary. But a bike with a long front end and short chainstays solves both these problems for me. (Well, bumpy cornering takes some other things being right also.

So, just getting the fit right does not necessarily get me a "good" bike. I take this seriously. Before buying a bike, I measure up the frame, draw it up on my CAD program overlaid with my other frames, see what I need for stem and seatpost to get the fit AND locate my center of gravity between the wheels. For me, very few frames pass both criteria. For most it is a matter off how much "not quite right" I am willing to accept.

I'd wanted a titanium bike since I did a quick ride on a Merlin in 1990. Early auts I created a program that calculated the needed stem and seatpos plus weight balance from the specs in brochures simply to quickly see what titanium bikes were worth investigating further now that Lightspeed, Merlin and others has several models and I was in a place where I could afford a $4000 dream bike. Eye opening. $4000 wasn't going to get me a dream bike, just a "B" fit or handling. So I now own two ti bikes that do it all but I had to pay the extra k for custom.

And all this has taken me (well, one bike) down a rabbit hole. Long top tube and front end, steep-ish to get the handling I love, short chainstays all seem to add up to high speed shimmy; not a major problem 14 years ago but now in my late 60s, I'm not as strong or fearless and have become part of the problem. (I thought I was doing myself a favor by getting a bike long enough that I could ride it with a 120 stem for perfect fit. Easy to find plus every racer of my generation knows Eddy Merckx and God both rode 120s. Now I know my ridiculously long stems on my other bikes are reliable wobble dampers.)
Oh, I could solve some of the weight balance issues by simply sitting further back on the saddle. Yes. And have a bike where I have to watch how I'm riding and force myself out of the sweet comfortable place my body loves to keep the bike happy. So instead of it being "my bike", I am the bike's "rider" and I am supposed to do what it wants. No thanks. I raced a bike long ago that worked perfectly without me making any compromises. I want and expect that.
All that said, I just purchased a 40yo frame from a forumite, Japanese race bike. I know a couple of measurements, no angles. Rust and $75 so not a lot to lose. I'll measure it up when I get it, stem and post accordingly, throw some parts and wheels on, ride it and see if it's a keeper. What I do know is that I have owned two Japanese race bikes of that era that were sublime fits. Maybe this Pro Miyata will share some DNA with my old Fuji Pro. If it does, I might be riding this rusty mess a long time!

Sortta catching up to this Thread, not having really read all the posts... But some interesting and pertinent comments, especially from those who came from riding in the '70s, 80's and early 90's.
I think we all (or many/most) rode bikes which might have been a bit too large or maybe way too large. LOL! Won;t go into the reasons, because, at this point, it only matters whether we have 'adjusted' our old preceptions or remained with old school.
But, with regards to 'Balance', Handling and general performance, weight and pressure distribution are key for many things; quickness, stability, safety...
There's a significiant difference between bikes which have a 58 cm TT coupled with a 9mm stem and a 56 cm TT with a 12mm stem (11 cm for many). I rode both. They both give roughly the same 'reach', but are very different in handling (front end design being a very important factor, of course). Weight/pressure distribution being a major contributor to handling. I rode some bikes with longer TT and shorter stem, because I was supplied with them. But it wasn;t until I was put on bikes with shorter TT and accompanying longer stem, that I felt more 'in control' and made greater progression in performance. That coming from greater confidence that I was 'stuck' to the road better, regardless of the conditions. I wasn't 'touring', so a bare road race bike was my primary vehicle.
That all has certainly been echoed in each newer generation of road bikes, whether 'race' or 'endurance'. "twitchy" handling is as much about front end design as TT, both contribute to what that might feel like. A bike which might not be 'twitchy' doesn;t guarantee it will be 'stable' on a fast descent, or be predictable in a close/fast group ride. Too far forward or back also might negatively affect bike handling, with influence from other geometry/construction parts of the bike.
In any case, a frame which allows more 'tuning' (variability in stem and saddle position) mostly will be better to get 'tuned in'. Too small a frame will again limit or create issues, not the same but similar to going too big... So, in the middle... LOL!
To address the OP's concerns...
Maybe before moving from what you have - modify and try. It might have a small cost, but may be worth it...
Try going from 37mm tires to 42 or 45mm - I've found there are 42mm tires which are quite 'fast/quick' and handle well, run at quite reduced psi...
Try a suspension stem - I have a RedShift Shockstop stem, with the softest elastomers being used. No discernible reduction in handling/control, but clearly a big improvement on rough road or off-road surfaces.
Try a suspension seatpost - the lighter, higher perf. kind - I didn't buy new, but repurposed a Rockshox suspension seatpost for my gravel bike - set to lightest, it's great and dulls many of the strong hits I get thru the saddle.
If the topstone still feels too 'long', get a good sized frame with shorter Toptube and try with all the new suspension goodies.
There are drop bars with 'rise' to consider.
I've been dealing with 3 badly herniated disks since my 20's, hereditary scoliosis, and generally greatly compressed disks. But thankfully no surgery administered. Just a life long decision to do things to help stabilize/support the problem areas....
I try to be consistent on strong core strengthening work, always working to keep as much flexibility, balance and suppleness as possible - given the issues.
so far it has helped. Sometimes I 'slack off', but always quickly reminded by the body, of the inattention. Yoga (done in consideration of the issues) stretching, and balanced strengthening of the entire body seems to be keeping me in the game.
I can't speak for anyone else, but my stubbornness is a strength, in this regard. Don;t give up, start or work from 'light' to stronger methods/efforts to improve the 'engine'. Patience and 'persistence' will always keep us at our best.
Ride On
Yuri
EDIT: I bought a Poseidon X, because I wanted something more 'road' than my very nice CF mtb bike, for some of the local stuff which I can link with crappy sideroads... But wasn't thinking 'top end' need. I was blown away by the quality and performance of this $750 bike! Awesome.
Why I bring it up? I was worried it was gonna bet TOOO Short (lengthwise) some 2 cm shorter TT and 1 cm shorter stem than my 'shortest' preferred bike...
Well it rides Great ! and still allows me to get 'forward'... added a Shockstop stem, my Rockshox seatpost, and 42 mm tires - fabulous an fun, yet also fast.
For the OP - the frame is 'road' oriented, but with a quite short TT - a Medium has a 52.6 cm effective TT - this might be an option as an alternative for the Topstone... Full bike is $750, Frame is $299, - whichever, you can move your better components to the X and then figure out what to do with the topstone and remaining stuff. Just an option to consider, for staying with the kind of riding you enjoy... YMMV