Originally Posted by
smashndash
They way you're describing fore-aft is the way modern bike fitters do it. KOPS and plumb bobs are and always have been BS. There isn't even one particular optimal position for a given person. So any "formula" that claims to have the answer is wrong, right off the bat.
I see fore-aft as a tradeoff. More rearward is better for cruising, like on beach cruisers. Forward is better for hammering like on track bikes or TT bikes.
Your comments on this issue reminded me to pay attention on my last group ride. Yep, when I hammered I was all the way up on the nose. The more power I wanted, the further forward I found I was sitting. When I was cruising, I was all the way back.
I always start with KOPS because the reason KOPS exists is because it produces decent balance a lot of the time. It has zero to do with efficiency or muscle optimization or joint comfort, never did. After getting close with KOPS, I check for balance in my aft, cruising, saddle position. KOPS is usually quite close.
One always does saddle position first, then reach and drop. One can get saddle position right with any bar position even though that bar position isn't comfortable or optimal.
I have a fitting primer here:
https://www.bikeforums.net/21296948-post3.html