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Well Iíve gone and done it, New Look Frame

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Well Iíve gone and done it, New Look Frame

Old 01-07-23, 03:11 PM
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Shadco 
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Well Iíve gone and done it, New Look Frame

After fretting about my options for a few months I have decided on an Endurance type of ride to augment my Gunnar Roadie.

My order is in for a Look 765 Optimum in medium Satin Black.



I have a Campy Record 12 speed compact crankset. I’m hoping Campy starts shipping their T47-86 ultra torque cups to the US real soon so I don’t have to go the bbinfinite route.

The rest of the groupset will be Campy Chorus 12 mechanical/hydraulic disc. Will go Keo pedals. Tires will be 30c.

For wheels I’m thinking Campy Shamal carbon but need to decide if I want to go cup and cone.

The rest of the fit kit is up in the air.

What to do for seat post, 350mm 27.2 25mm set back.

Bars and Stem ??? Deda?

Suggestions would be appreciated.

Frame should arrive late next week.

Better pic




,
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Old 01-07-23, 05:04 PM
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Nice looking frameset. Superb choice for drive train. No opinion on the rest of the parts, whatever stem and hbar that works best for you, not the one that looks best. I have some really nice carbon bars sitting on a shelf because my body does not like them. Seat post is a seat post, just be sure it has the setback you need.
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Old 01-08-23, 08:15 PM
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Iíve had my eye on that frame. Iím curious to hear your impressions once youíve got it built.

FWIW Iíve always been happy with Deda components, but you should go with what fits you best.
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Old 01-09-23, 03:39 PM
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Interesting bike. I took a look at its Geo though, it has a 70.3 degree HT angle with 73 degree ST angle. What if anything does this imply about its handling characteristics? Most bikes have those 2 angles closer together.
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Old 01-09-23, 03:44 PM
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I saw the title and the :New Look Frame". All my bikes are old look! (And not made by Look. In fact, only one frame is even French.

That said, good looking bike!
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Old 01-09-23, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Sy Reene
Interesting bike. I took a look at its Geo though, it has a 70.3 degree HT angle with 73 degree ST angle. What if anything does this imply about its handling characteristics? Most bikes have those 2 angles closer together.
More stability in the steering; less twitchy. Might even allow for no toe overlap!
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Old 01-10-23, 06:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Sy Reene
Interesting bike. I took a look at its Geo though, it has a 70.3 degree HT angle with 73 degree ST angle. What if anything does this imply about its handling characteristics? Most bikes have those 2 angles closer together.
Yes definitely a very interesting frame. I think this kind of "slacker" geometry (gravel bike inspired) will eventually become the norm for endurance road bikes, with more stable, less twitchy handling. Only full-on race bikes really benefit from super-quick handling and yet pretty much all performance road bikes still have "race" geometry. Gravel bikes have moved on from standard road geometry and now we are seeing frames like this that cover both gravel and endurance road applications in equal measure. If people are being honest with themselves, this is the kind of bike that would probably serve 90%+ of performance road riders better than a typical road race geometry.
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Old 01-10-23, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Sy Reene
Interesting bike. I took a look at its Geo though, it has a 70.3 degree HT angle with 73 degree ST angle. What if anything does this imply about its handling characteristics? Most bikes have those 2 angles closer together.
I have a Gunnar Roadie, lovely bike, light pretty much the other direction geometry wise though. At 70 pushing 71 before this one will be built out I find the Gunnar not relaxing to ride, itís fun itís quick but I need to focus all the time which takes some of the joy out of longer rides. I work at a bike shop but couldnít find a frame that gave me what I wanted that didnít come as a complete bike. I considered a Defy with 105 where I could pull the groupset and sell it but that didnít really appeal to me. This was announced it was available in my size the frame price was reasonable so I pulled the trigger.

The only challenge I foresee so far is that I may have to use a bbinfinite bottom bracket since it appears Campy is slow to get their T47 86 Ultra Torque cups to the states.

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Old 01-10-23, 05:54 PM
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Today was a great day frame came in unscathed and I found what may be the only Enduro T47/86 Ultra Torque bottom bracket around.

Now only need seat post, stem and saddle.




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Old 01-10-23, 08:23 PM
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I've always like the FSA stems, bars, and seatpost. Have them on my Emonda, very comfy bars.
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Old 01-11-23, 05:32 AM
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Why not get the matching LOOK seatpost, bars and stem?
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Old 01-11-23, 06:01 AM
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
Why not get the matching LOOK seatpost, bars and stem?
Stem isnít available, didnít like the bars got a nos Easton E100, a carbon seat post is a carbon seatpost probably going to get an Easton once I see the fitter.

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Old 01-11-23, 06:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Shadco
Stem isnít available, didnít like the bars got a nos Easton E100, a carbon seat post is a carbon seatpost probably going to get an Easton once I see the fitter.

.
Fair enough. But I wouldn't go thinking all carbon seatposts are going to feel the same. Some are designed with considerably more flexibility than others, which can really affect comfort. Some have much better seat clamps than others too. But I have no idea where Easton sit in either of these respects. Just something to consider when choosing.
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Old 01-11-23, 08:29 AM
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Here's a link to the geometry. It's not what others have posted. The steering trail is 67mm for all sizes. That should work just fine. Since this is an endurance model, the stack is 20-30mm taller than a racing oriented frame and the reach is a little shorter - both intended to produce a more upright fit.

https://www.lookcycle.com/us-en/prod...llic-satin-105

I've owned four LOOK frames over the years. No problems with any of them. My favorite seatpost is the FSA K-force. Great clamp for easy angle adjustment. Favorite bars are Easton EC-90 or EC-70. I've used a lot of Zipp stems.

I'll be most curious to know how well the shifting works with internally routed shift cables. It should require some fairly long runs of cable housing.

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Old 01-12-23, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by DaveSSS
Here's a link to the geometry. It's not what others have posted.
Ummmmmm ... the only aspect of the geometry that has been discussed is the (relatively) large difference in head tube angle and seat tube angle, and what has been posted by others is correct.
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Old 01-12-23, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
Ummmmmm ... the only aspect of the geometry that has been discussed is the (relatively) large difference in head tube angle and seat tube angle, and what has been posted by others is correct.
Others posted 70.3 hta and 73 sta. Neither agree with this link, which lists 70.8 hta and 74 sta. The two dimensions have nothing to do with each other, so I don't get the point. Hopefully all interested can read the geometry chart.

​​​​
https://www.lookcycle.com/us-en/prod...llic-satin-105
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Old 01-12-23, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by DaveSSS
Others posted 70.3 hta and 73 sta. Neither agree with this link, which lists 70.8 hta and 74 sta. The two dimensions have nothing to do with each other, so I don't get the point. Hopefully all interested can read the geometry chart.
The salient issue was the notable difference between the two angles, and the implications of that difference. That's the point.
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Old 01-13-23, 05:19 AM
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
The salient issue was the notable difference between the two angles, and the implications of that difference. That's the point.
Exactly. From Geometry Geeks it looks like the angles were listed slightly differently in 2022. But the head angle is still about 3 deg slacker than a typical road bike. They sell the same frame in a gravel build too. I think it makes perfect sense for an endurance road bike like this.
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Old 01-13-23, 08:15 AM
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I've followed bike geometry for over 30 years and have a binder full of old geometry charts. If you're familiar with the formula for calculating steering trail, you know that a given trail value can be achieved with different combinations of HTA and fork offset. It's common for larger frames to have steeper HTAs to avoid an overly long wheelbase and more slack on smaller frames to avoid excessive toe overlap and a too short wheelbase. Italians tend to use more trail than other builders. I like the larger trail that Colnago used for many years and I've owned four. Some brands offer frames with a small 58mm trail for all sizes. It's not right or wrong, but not what I want in a small frame.

My other point was that STA and HTA have no particular correlation, but smaller frames generally have steeper STAs and more slack HTAs, so it's common to have a HTA in the 71-72 range and a STA in the 74-75 range, so you shouldn't expect to see parallel angles. LOOK used to make frames with a 72.5 degree STA in all sizes.

Stack and reach now make getting the right frame size easier. If you know the stack that you want, find that first, then compare reach. The STA only affects your choice of seatpost setback. Right now, my Cinelli superstar has the saddle centered on a 25mm setback post, with a 74.5 degree STA. Some frames have proprietary posts and only one setback offering. My Yoeleo frames have a unique post that offers a wide range of setback at the seat rail clamp, with the maximum around 25mm. There are times when I have used 32mm setback seat posts.

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Old 01-13-23, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by DaveSSS
I've followed bike geometry for over 30 years ...
Doesn't really address the issue of how the difference in seat tube and head tubes angles might affect the OP's new frame.
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Old 01-13-23, 01:58 PM
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Slowly mocking it up. I need the Look LS3 stem which ties into the Token junction spacer and and spacer stack to lock it all together. Hopefully next week.

Enduro bottom bracket should be here Tuesday, already have the record compact crank.

Majority of the Record group should be here next week too QBP has the rd on a watch list.

Edit JBI had all the Campy stuff so went there instead.

Look Keo Max 2 carbons for pedals.

Probably going Roval 38’s for wheels gotta scrimp somewhere. Anyone want a deal on a Shimano free hub?

Ended up going Shamal C21s, decided not to scrimp.

Look Carbon Seat Post, Selle San Marco Shortfit Open Dynamic saddle

Then it’s off to the fitter.





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Old 01-13-23, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by PeteHski
Exactly. From Geometry Geeks it looks like the angles were listed slightly differently in 2022. But the head angle is still about 3 deg slacker than a typical road bike. They sell the same frame in a gravel build too. I think it makes perfect sense for an endurance road bike like this.
Gravel version is different

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Old 01-13-23, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Shadco
Slowly mocking it up.
They spelled Kool wrong. I think you got a counterfeit.
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Old 01-13-23, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
They spelled Kool wrong. I think you got a counterfeit.
Better?




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Old 01-13-23, 04:43 PM
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
Doesn't really address the issue of how the difference in seat tube and head tubes angles might affect the OP's new frame.
Not a brilliant answer. The OP didn't ask anything to be explained.

​​​​The difference between those two angles is meaningless, since the STA determines what might be the best seatpost setback to buy and HTA has no significant effect on the fit. It has a 67mm trail and will handle accordingly. Anyone who thinks there should be a correlation between HTA and STA is mistaken.
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