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Immersive waxing / it should be more popular

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Immersive waxing / it should be more popular

Old 09-12-23, 12:05 PM
  #926  
eduskator
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Something to lift the chain so it does not touch the bottom is a must IMO. A mesh grill is perfect for this. I find that a 1/4'' gap is perfect.

Once it hardens back, you can remove the wax puck from the pot and remove the bottom part where all the dirt and grime is stuck with a knife or something sharp.
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Old 09-12-23, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by SpedFast
I turn the heat on and when the wax loosens from the walls of the container I dump it out and scrape off the bottom 1/8" or so. Then throw it back in and continue. But I like the strainer idea. Seems it might be a tad awkward with my little pot and do you leave it in the wax or not when you're finished?
That's a great idea. I just tried it:




I thought it was time to toss the whole wax block, but it clear what to do.

This also got me thinking that what we really need is a BikeForums "hot wax tips and tricks" thread to share great ideas such as this.
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Old 09-12-23, 01:29 PM
  #928  
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Originally Posted by SpedFast
I turn the heat on and when the wax loosens from the walls of the container I dump it out and scrape off the bottom 1/8" or so.
Originally Posted by eduskator

Once it hardens back, you can remove the wax puck from the pot and remove the bottom part where all the dirt and grime is stuck with a knife or something sharp.
I'm curious what kind of wax you are both using? I'm using Silca secret blend, which is dark grey in color and has some additives in it (nano-scale tungsten disulfide). When I removed the entire block of hard wax and looked at the bottom, it didn't look that different than the rest of the wax. It's all dark in color. Even scraping some of the block off, it's not clear if the bottom of the block is actually dirty or not.

I guess I'm wondering if this is even something I should worry about. I've been using this same wax block since the beginning of the cycling season, so maybe 7-8 rewaxings? I'm sure there's some gunk in there, but also the end result still seems the same, which is a pretty clean looking chain and drivetrain.

Maybe this layer of gunk is more obvious if you're using white/clear paraffin wax?
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Old 09-12-23, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Polaris OBark
That's a great idea. I just tried it:




I thought it was time to toss the whole wax block, but it clear what to do.

This also got me thinking that what we really need is a BikeForums "hot wax tips and tricks" thread to share great ideas such as this.
Mine definitely did not look like this.
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Old 09-12-23, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by msu2001la
Mine definitely did not look like this.
This in fact was pure white paraffin canning wax when I started at the beginning of the season. No additives.

This was after a particularly challenging off-road ride through moon-dust contaminated with forest fire ash. In 20 miles, my chain went from being silent to making horrific noise. Same with my wife's chain. Now that I think about this, it is probably time to toss the whole block of wax.


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Old 09-12-23, 01:59 PM
  #931  
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One year and nearly 1000 posts later, and I doubt immersive waxing has become any more popular ...
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Old 09-12-23, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by msu2001la
I'm curious what kind of wax you are both using? I'm using Silca secret blend, which is dark grey in color and has some additives in it (nano-scale tungsten disulfide). When I removed the entire block of hard wax and looked at the bottom, it didn't look that different than the rest of the wax. It's all dark in color. Even scraping some of the block off, it's not clear if the bottom of the block is actually dirty or not.

I guess I'm wondering if this is even something I should worry about. I've been using this same wax block since the beginning of the cycling season, so maybe 7-8 rewaxings? I'm sure there's some gunk in there, but also the end result still seems the same, which is a pretty clean looking chain and drivetrain.

Maybe this layer of gunk is more obvious if you're using white/clear paraffin wax?
Food grade paraffin wax + PTFE powder (20:1 ratio). I don't buy the big brand wax mixes since it seems to be a gimmick. I watched enough videos from OZ Cycle

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Old 09-12-23, 02:11 PM
  #933  
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
One year and nearly 1000 posts later, and I doubt immersive waxing has become any more popular ...
Maybe we just need to do a better job of spreading the Good News by starting a few dozen more threads.
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Old 09-12-23, 02:19 PM
  #934  
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Originally Posted by Polaris OBark
Maybe we just need to do a better job of spreading the Good News by starting a few dozen more threads.
I think late night infomercials is the way to go.
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Old 09-12-23, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by eduskator
Food grade paraffin wax + PTFE powder (20:1 ratio). I don't buy the big brand wax mixes since it seems to be a gimmick. I watched enough videos from OZ Cycle
Yeah, fully agree on that. The Silca wax is $40 for a bag, though it seems I will get many uses out of it. I'll probably just try some plain paraffin wax whenever I'm ready to buy more.
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Old 09-12-23, 06:56 PM
  #936  
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Originally Posted by msu2001la
I'm curious what kind of wax you are both using? I'm using Silca secret blend, which is dark grey in color and has some additives in it (nano-scale tungsten disulfide). When I removed the entire block of hard wax and looked at the bottom, it didn't look that different than the rest of the wax. It's all dark in color. Even scraping some of the block off, it's not clear if the bottom of the block is actually dirty or not.

I guess I'm wondering if this is even something I should worry about. I've been using this same wax block since the beginning of the cycling season, so maybe 7-8 rewaxings? I'm sure there's some gunk in there, but also the end result still seems the same, which is a pretty clean looking chain and drivetrain.

Maybe this layer of gunk is more obvious if you're using white/clear paraffin wax?
I started with a block of parafin canning wax and then began adding all colors and scents depending on the candles that are donated to me. It's kind of a reddish hue now but smell great! The gunk on the bottom is definitely darker, similar to O'bark's.
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Old 09-13-23, 06:11 AM
  #937  
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Originally Posted by msu2001la
Yeah, fully agree on that. The Silca wax is $40 for a bag, though it seems I will get many uses out of it. I'll probably just try some plain paraffin wax whenever I'm ready to buy more.
Yeah. The big brand's response to the ''waxing trend'' was to develop its own lineup of wax blends. This tells a lot. Still, I wouldn't be paying 40$ for a bag of wax pellet when I can buy the same thing under 10$. Once you know, you know.
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Old 09-14-23, 07:41 PM
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
One year and nearly 1000 posts later, and I doubt immersive waxing has become any more popular ...
You may well be correct, but count me as one of the happy and enthusiastic immersive waxing converts. I am mildly obsessive about keeping drivetrains clean, and the effort to wax seems well worth it to me.
I recently went on a little tour, 8 days and about 400 miles on pavement and 100 miles on dry gravel in the Mt. Hood and Mt. Jefferson area. No rain, one hour of wet pavement. This picture is the chain as it came off on its way to the crock pot of delicious Silca Secret Sauce. I had to use the Wend product almost every day. It was the most rudimentary and quick application, once the wax wore off the drip on stuff wasn't nearly as durable and long lasting, but it seemed to be very effective. The Wend looks like slightly thickened milk when it goes on. The instructions say to keep the top closed and store at room temperatures.
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Old 09-14-23, 07:58 PM
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Originally Posted by venturi95
You may well be correct, but count me as one of the happy and enthusiastic immersive waxing converts. I am mildly obsessive about keeping drivetrains clean, and the effort to wax seems well worth it to me.
I recently went on a little tour, 8 days and about 400 miles on pavement and 100 miles on dry gravel in the Mt. Hood and Mt. Jefferson area. No rain, one hour of wet pavement. This picture is the chain as it came off on its way to the crock pot of delicious Silca Secret Sauce. I had to use the Wend product almost every day. It was the most rudimentary and quick application, once the wax wore off the drip on stuff wasn't nearly as durable and long lasting, but it seemed to be very effective. The Wend looks like slightly thickened milk when it goes on. The instructions say to keep the top closed and store at room temperatures.
So, you waxed the chain with Silca Secret Sauce at the beginning of the tour, and then applied Wend every day during the tour?
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Old 09-14-23, 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
So, you waxed the chain with Silca Secret Sauce at the beginning of the tour, and then applied Wend every day during the tour?
Yes, the Wend was applied almost every day. It may have been a little over done on my part. I have a bag of the Silca pellets and that is my first and only hot wax product. Fun Fact: Owl poops are called pellets.
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Old 09-14-23, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by venturi95
Yes, the Wend was applied almost every day. It may have been a little over done on my part. I have a bag of the Silca pellets and that is my first and only hot wax product. Fun Fact: Owl poops are called pellets.
Does that mean you cast the Silca pellets into a crock pot?
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Old 09-14-23, 08:46 PM
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Ha ha, I see what you did there.
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Old 09-15-23, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Polaris OBark
This in fact was pure white paraffin canning wax when I started at the beginning of the season. No additives.

This was after a particularly challenging off-road ride through moon-dust contaminated with forest fire ash. In 20 miles, my chain went from being silent to making horrific noise. Same with my wife's chain. Now that I think about this, it is probably time to toss the whole block of wax.

so that wax was new just this year and it looks like that? wow, pretty nasty stuff. i don't recall if you clean your chain before waxing but i do and my crock pot is full of very clean wax after 3 years now, very little crap on the bottom. certainly not enough to even consider filtering out or cutting off. i too am only using gulf wax with no additives. i'm going to continue to clean the chain before waxing. seems to be paying off.
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Old 09-15-23, 11:01 AM
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I don't think wax is a good choice for off-road applications. Too much water and dirt; gonna switch back to wet lube for my MTB. For dry weather road? The best.

I'm also gonna drop in here (again) as a counter example of how simple waxing can be. Many people here are going way overboard compared to what I would tolerate.

I do clean chains once - when they are new. Overnight soak in degreaser with a shake here and there. After that? Nothing - into the wax every few weeks (or months). Sometimes I don't even bother wiping it off, and just let it drip a bit. I don't clean the drivetrain or the pot at all except when it's time for a new block of wax. Sure, there is some grime at the bottom of the pot and on my chain, but it is dry. I can still grab it with my bare hand on the side of the road no problem, and it doesn't leave marks when it touches legs or clothing.
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Old 09-15-23, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by TMonk
I don't think wax is a good choice for off-road applications. Too much water and dirt; gonna switch back to wet lube for my MTB. For dry weather road? The best.

I'm also gonna drop in here (again) as a counter example of how simple waxing can be. Many people here are going way overboard compared to what I would tolerate.

I do clean chains once - when they are new. Overnight soak in degreaser with a shake here and there. After that? Nothing - into the wax every few weeks (or months). Sometimes I don't even bother wiping it off, and just let it drip a bit. I don't clean the drivetrain or the pot at all except when it's time for a new block of wax. Sure, there is some grime at the bottom of the pot and on my chain, but it is dry. I can still grab it with my bare hand on the side of the road no problem, and it doesn't leave marks when it touches legs or clothing.
Same. The only time I cleaned my chain was after a really grimy rain ride. I rinsed it off with some boiling water. Other than that, it's gone straight into the pot every time. After 7-8 rounds of this everything still seems really clean.

I ordered a mini-strainer because it was just a few bucks and seems like it might be easier to use than threading the chain onto an old coat hanger, but I'm skeptical that this will really keep the chain any cleaner by keeping it "above the gunk". I'm still going to need to stir the chain around in the pot a bit to get it coated, and this seems like it would just stir up whatever gunk is on the bottom anyway.
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Old 09-15-23, 02:34 PM
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one "mod" I've done for the process is to place a strong earth magnet below the perforated pan [drilled speed holes into an old aluminum egg frying pan] . It's attracted some particles, so it wasn't a wasted added effort.

I have a few 9100 & 8100 series chains, which prompted a thought/theory.
Being that one has hollow pins & the other has solid pins, that thought/theory is that the hollow pins encapsulates some of the wax & if that wax happens to dislodge at some point it can "feed" or fling it whereabouts onto a moving part.... or just fling it like a snot rocket.
The other thought is that it might do nothing & just add weight (if it matters to anyone) nulling the point of having hollow pins (again, if weight matters) .


Deep thoughts, by a random cyclists.
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Old 09-15-23, 02:38 PM
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Good ole speed holes. They make everything better/faster.


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Old 09-18-23, 04:24 AM
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Originally Posted by eduskator
Yeah. The big brand's response to the ''waxing trend'' was to develop its own lineup of wax blends. This tells a lot. Still, I wouldn't be paying 40$ for a bag of wax pellet when I can buy the same thing under 10$. Once you know, you know.
Well, even though Silca uses paraffin pellets, there are a lot of different types of paraffin waxes. It's a pretty big umbrella term for a category of waxes. The oil content is not the only deciding factor. Then there are microcrystalline waxes some chain wax brands also use and those are even more diverse than paraffins.

I have three different paraffins (without additives) and they all behave pretty differently from one another.

While that 10 $ is going to work just fine, it's not the same as the 40 $ stuff. The difference is how long the stuff lasts and how long it lubricates.

And with the topic of lubrication comes additives. Silca uses tungsten disulfide which is a pretty good metal on metal lubrication powder. That'll decrease friction and increases how long the wax lasts in the dry.
Molten speedwax used to use molybdenym disulfide which isn't quite as good as tungsten. Not sure what they use these days.
Rex uses something proprietary which combined with a wax mix of paraffins and other stuff gives pretty amazing dry duration results (almost 900 miles per application).

I'm not convinced however that the additives increase wet duration and may actually decrease it as the friction modifier powders may make it easier for the wax to slough off the metal on the chain.
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Old 09-18-23, 05:10 AM
  #949  
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Originally Posted by elcruxio
Well, even though Silca uses paraffin pellets, there are a lot of different types of paraffin waxes. It's a pretty big umbrella term for a category of waxes. The oil content is not the only deciding factor. Then there are microcrystalline waxes some chain wax brands also use and those are even more diverse than paraffins.

I have three different paraffins (without additives) and they all behave pretty differently from one another.

While that 10 $ is going to work just fine, it's not the same as the 40 $ stuff. The difference is how long the stuff lasts and how long it lubricates.

And with the topic of lubrication comes additives. Silca uses tungsten disulfide which is a pretty good metal on metal lubrication powder. That'll decrease friction and increases how long the wax lasts in the dry.
Molten speedwax used to use molybdenym disulfide which isn't quite as good as tungsten. Not sure what they use these days.
Rex uses something proprietary which combined with a wax mix of paraffins and other stuff gives pretty amazing dry duration results (almost 900 miles per application).

I'm not convinced however that the additives increase wet duration and may actually decrease it as the friction modifier powders may make it easier for the wax to slough off the metal on the chain.
I find that PTFE does the job pretty well.

I'm a big OZ Cycle fan and he made several comparison of his own blend VS the big brands. His home maid paraffin & PTFE mix was the most efficient one. I know it isn't an undeniable scientific proof, but I trust him.

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Old 09-18-23, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
One year and nearly 1000 posts later, and I doubt immersive waxing has become any more popular ...
I was thinking the opposite. Glad to see this thread reviving every now and then, with people sharing their wax knowledge and experiences. I also think there has been a marked pro rider/team uptake since, some more marketing.

Maybe it is just a personality thing. We should create a quick aptitude test to see whether one is the wax type. Maybe it could be on a tablet in every bike shop at the lubricant section. Or a more low tech version to keep costs down, could look like this:


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