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Netflix TdF 2022 documentary--they still race bikes, you know!

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Netflix TdF 2022 documentary--they still race bikes, you know!

Old 06-12-23, 04:00 PM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by chain_whipped
Maybe the conflict was exaggerated a bit by the way it was edited, but his own words in the bus made it clear that there was some conflict in his head. The way WVA gutted himself on the last climb to benefit Jonas left no doubt where his loyalty was in the end.
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Old 06-12-23, 04:55 PM
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Exactly. Without conflict, there is no story.
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Old 06-12-23, 06:35 PM
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I'm only peripherally interested in the TdF, but a former coworker of mine lived for it. He'd be 76 by now, still races locally. I guess I'm somewhat less impressed with the state of things these days, compared to the Olde Days. Like F1 and NASCAR, there's little peligro de muerte anymore to spice things up. I brought this up with my coworker, and he was horrified.
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Old 06-12-23, 07:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
Maybe the conflict was exaggerated a bit by the way it was edited, but his own words in the bus made it clear that there was some conflict in his head. The way WVA gutted himself on the last climb to benefit Jonas left no doubt where his loyalty was in the end.
What do I know, but the "conflict" seems to ring true, and I don't think it's really reflects negatively on Wout. He's clear about his intentions. The team clearly know Wout and his ambitions. No doubt there were some at least mild disagreements about tactics, but Wout also clearly saved Jonas' GC more than once. The show illustrates this really well and so I think presents a balanced view of the team dynamic.
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Old 06-13-23, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by arex
Like F1 and NASCAR, there's little peligro de muerte anymore to spice things up.
If you think bike racing isn't dangerous, you aren't paying attention.
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Old 06-13-23, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
If you think bike racing isn't dangerous, you aren't paying attention.
Of course, there's risk involved with any activity...not disputing that. However, back in the old days, there were brains splattered on the road left and right, quite literally. It's different these days, that's all I'm saying.
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Old 06-13-23, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by arex
Of course, there's risk involved with any activity...not disputing that. However, back in the old days, there were brains splattered on the road left and right, quite literally. It's different these days, that's all I'm saying.
You sure write a convincing story.
Did you pick up some splattered brain matter found on both sides of the road and stuff it into your hole from a lobotomy?

Pray for ai bikey forum.
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Old 06-13-23, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by arex
Of course, there's risk involved with any activity...not disputing that. However, back in the old days, there were brains splattered on the road left and right, quite literally. It's different these days, that's all I'm saying.
Iíve been watching bike racing since before riders started wearing helmets. I do not recall a significant amount of deaths due to race crashes. Humans donít generally survive when their brains are splattered on the road.

Personally, I like that race cars are safer than ever. Roman Grosjeanís F1 crash a couple of years ago was shocking. If he was killed, it would not have made it more exciting. Grosjean being able to walk away from his shattered, burning car was the right kind of exciting.

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Old 06-14-23, 03:58 AM
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Originally Posted by chain_whipped
You sure write a convincing story.
Did you pick up some splattered brain matter found on both sides of the road and stuff it into your hole from a lobotomy?

Pray for ai bikey forum.
Okay, buddy!
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Old 06-14-23, 04:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Eric F
Iíve been watching bike racing since before riders started wearing helmets. I do not recall a significant amount of deaths due to race crashes. Humans donít generally survive when their brains are splattered on the road.

Personally, I like that race cars are safer than ever. Roman Grosjeanís F1 crash a couple of years ago was shocking. If he was killed, it would not have made it more exciting. Grosjean being able to walk away from his shattered, burning car was the right kind of exciting.
Oh, I agree...safety should be paramount. I'm not saying anyone needs to die for our entertainment...this isn't imperial Rome. The safety measures implemented in NASCAR and F1 are nothing short of astounding, and the cars are going faster than ever.

And yeah, I overstated things a bit in the TdF of yore. However, back then, the routes were relatively "ungroomed"...poor surfaces (rocky dirt roads through the high mountains, etc.), stupid spectators running amok, inferior safety equipment (when it was used at all), inferior brakes (relative to today's brakes), etc. No, riders weren't dying every hundred yards or anything, but they were definitely getting badly injured a lot more, and there were certainly more deaths.

And, unfortunately, humans in general are attracted to such spectacles. WRC and the Isle of Man TT are both enormously popular. Both are much safer than they used to be, but they're still enormously dangerous.
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Old 06-14-23, 07:01 AM
  #61  
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I've been enjoying the series as I really enjoyed watching the Tour last year. I thought Jumbo Vismo's strategy in taking out Pogacar was fascinating and haven't seen racing like that in years. Does the series have a great story line and plot? no, but it's entertaining enough and gives people who probably know nothing about bike racing, an inside look at the drama and action they never knew existed.
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Old 06-15-23, 01:26 AM
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Originally Posted by jeirvine
For the first couple episodes I kind of "meh" Then I saw a tip on Twitter to turn off the dubbing and watch in in the original French with subtitles. It's vastly better that way.
Does the French version dub over the English speaking parts? (I do understand that most Europeans speak multiple languages. I'm just curious.)

I find that I can't read fast enough to keep up with subtitles without matching audio. I even have trouble with English subtitles when the dubbed English doesn't match, like in Squid Game.

I binged the first four episodes tonight. I'll watch the rest very soon. I'd definitely watch a series like this every June.
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Old 06-15-23, 03:59 AM
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Subtitles are the only way to go, as long as they're done well. VO dubs are simply distracting.
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Old 06-15-23, 04:39 AM
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The VO is distracting. I don't understand why the VO isn't louder. They sound nearly at the same level. I too can't read the text fast enough besides not watching the actually video!
As good as the series was, I think they could do better in terms of exploring the strategies to a greater extent and capturing more drama.

Didn't watch '23s race so maybe there wasn't any more than what was shown. Previous years of watching satisfied my interest. Recaps typically had me wanting more.

Use of bike mounted cameras have added a marginal improvement. The issue with them is the camera movement. If there was equivalent stabilization as those on the motorcycles, it would be huge. That is just more weight or more SW development.
Really don't want to see individual performance suffer from the application of too much tech or add to injuries.
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Old 06-15-23, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by SJX426
The VO is distracting. I don't understand why the VO isn't louder.
I've edited and packaged many documentaries for international markets. The problem with audio stems from a combination of varied audio mix standards and the limiters and gains that are inherent within each network streaming, delivery and compression system. Producers routinely have to make several Masters as part of the deliverable boilerplates. It's ugly. Cinemas have it even worse with surround sound in theatres.
I miss stereo mixes.
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Old 06-15-23, 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by clubman
I've edited and packaged many documentaries for international markets. The problem with audio stems from a combination of varied audio mix standards and the limiters and gains that are inherent within each network streaming, delivery and compression system. Producers routinely have to make several Masters as part of the deliverable boilerplates. It's ugly. Cinemas have it even worse with surround sound in theatres.
I miss stereo mixes.
I know I'm not the only one who finds that music and audio FX often overwhelm VO and dialog in a lot of film and TV these days. Christopher Nolan's films are an extreme case, though if I wrote dialog like that in 'Tenet,' I'd bury it in the mix too.

We're watching the TdF series in original language with subtitles; no problem as we're fast readers though the cutting rhythm makes them go by quickly. In fact sometimes the mix makes the actual English harder to grasp. This is particularly the case in the B-roll, where understandably the micing isnt't ideal. Is the VO and dialog mixed higher in the dubbed version?

BTW there is a good reason that this show is reminiscent of 'F1: Drive to Survive:' it is co-produced by James Gay-Rees and his company Box to Box, which did not only 'Drive to Survive,' but many other epic sports docs. Also, early in his career, the clever Banksy doc 'Exit Through the Gift Shop.' Gay-Rees was on last week's episode of Geraint Thomas' podcast 'Watts Occurring.' G and his buddy Luke Rowe spend most of the show in matey talk but there are some good insights from Gay-Rees.
Also, as of last week a second series of 'Unchained' wasn't confirmed, but now it is!
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Old 06-15-23, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by SJX426
Didn't watch '23s race...
No one has. It doesn't start until next month
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Old 06-15-23, 01:20 PM
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I finally watched E6, about Jasper Philipsen, and I thought it did a better job at getting into the mechanics of what actually goes on in a race, and a sprint stage in particular. With limited sprint stages, and a break up the road, how much do the teams with sprinters push the pace in the peloton to make the catch, and those with GC ambitions don't (and even block the road to keep the pace down and save their GC guys legs). And more about Van Aert staying and helping Fulgsang after the crash vs staying up front to contest the stage. I.e. less fake drama and more real race drama.

Maybe for season 2 they could bring in Cosmo Catalano to direct. Then it could be 100% racecraft analysis.
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Old 06-15-23, 06:38 PM
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Its about time to bring back real sizzle.
Refreshing~~~~~
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Old 06-16-23, 08:15 PM
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Great series and I’m ready for The Tour. The confidential interviews and the fly on the wall stuff was pretty cool. It reminded me of watching “Big Brother”.
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Old 06-16-23, 09:22 PM
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Originally Posted by arex
Oh, I agree...safety should be paramount. I'm not saying anyone needs to die for our entertainment...this isn't imperial Rome. The safety measures implemented in NASCAR and F1 are nothing short of astounding, and the cars are going faster than ever.

And yeah, I overstated things a bit in the TdF of yore. However, back then, the routes were relatively "ungroomed"...poor surfaces (rocky dirt roads through the high mountains, etc.), stupid spectators running amok, inferior safety equipment (when it was used at all), inferior brakes (relative to today's brakes), etc. No, riders weren't dying every hundred yards or anything, but they were definitely getting badly injured a lot more, and there were certainly more deaths.

And, unfortunately, humans in general are attracted to such spectacles. WRC and the Isle of Man TT are both enormously popular. Both are much safer than they used to be, but they're still enormously dangerous.
Deaths donít make racing more exciting.

RIP Gino Mader. 😢
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Old 06-18-23, 07:05 PM
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Spoiler alert...

Originally Posted by Classtime
Weíre enjoying it. montclairbobbyb please edit your spoiler for those that didnít/donít follow racing. It would be neat if the real time broadcast could collect and share some of the bike-camera views for sprints, crashes, close calls, etc.
For those who follow this forum, but who actually DIDN'T have a clue that Jonas won the TdF in 2022, yet who are watching the documentary as if to learn there was a TdF in 2022 (I can't believe such a person exists), let me say "sorry for the spoiler"... but truthfully that's ridiculous, get over it.
​​

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Old 06-18-23, 07:06 PM
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Sorry for the snarkiness...
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Old 06-19-23, 07:28 AM
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Wow this thread didn't age well.
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Old 06-19-23, 08:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K
Does the French version dub over the English speaking parts? (I do understand that most Europeans speak multiple languages. I'm just curious.)

I find that I can't read fast enough to keep up with subtitles without matching audio. I even have trouble with English subtitles when the dubbed English doesn't match, like in Squid Game.

I binged the first four episodes tonight. I'll watch the rest very soon. I'd definitely watch a series like this every June.
I binged the whole thing in a day... Agree, a slightly documentary style wrap up every few years would be something to look forward to!
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