livedarklions

I think you need to brush up on your Pavlov. No one wants a "ding".

sdowen

You can start a thread on who’s Shimano components are better than the other companies Shimano components.

That’s how silly these threads get. Giant or another subcontractor makes many of the bikes under $1500 USD.

TCollen

Let's admit it, that a Rivendell with Grant Peterson-approved accoutrements​​​should be near the top of any list of desirable bikes.

(I will now duck in order to avoid enemy assault.)

PeteHski

I prefer Specialized over Trek, but only because I prefer their more understated colour schemes. Trek bikes tend to look a bit shouty with ever larger TREK logos. Also not a big fan of current Trek "curvy" frame design, but again purely an aesthetic point. As far as quality and performance goes I doubt there is much in it. Pricing is also very similar where I live. Giant and Canyon are better value and just as good. So that's where I currently have put my money. But I'm not brand loyal. I choose bikes on the basis of what particular model suits my needs best at the time. Like at the moment I'm thinking of buying a Cervelo Caledonia 5 because it looks like a great fast endurance bike for crappy UK roads and I like the simple clean lines and colours. Not because it's a Cervelo.

terrymorse 

I constantly monitored bike brand and model popularity on my bike rental web site.

Specialized models always came out on top.

Sy Reene

what's the Dean story anyway? It looks like Dean is the same company as the ole Merlin. Same factory, owners, etc. Does anything original remain in terms of ethos or fabrication methodology, etc

cyccommute 

Dean...or more correctly the Janus Cycle Group...acquired Merlin, brought it back, and is making them in Boulder. John Siegrist, who founded Dean bought it. Here’s the skinny.

Sy Reene

Thanks! Hadn't seen that article previously. It mentions dealers near the end so looked up.. only 3 unfortunately nationwide so far. I wish them luck

NomarsGirl

I ride a Specialized. Expected to buy a Trek, but my bike was the previous year's model and a women's specific design, so the bike shop wanted it sold and gave me a great deal. When I walked in, the salesgirl was looking me up and down trying to figure out if the bike would fit me. I think there was a contest for the salespeople to sell that bike. I guess they didn't get a lot of women who wanted nice road bikes.

Lazyass

Specialized is better than Trek because Trek and Lance Armstrong banded together to destroy Greg LeMond's bike company. Only because Greg spoke the truth.

DomaneS5

I like Trek. I'm a Fred.

70sSanO

Everything depends on individual perception and the timing of those impressions.

Go back far enough and Trek crushed Specialized when it came to road/touring bikes. There is no comparison. Specialized wasn’t even a player in drop bar bikes. And during the Lance years, Trek was all about road bikes.

But Specialized destroyed Trek when it came to mountain bikes. One could possibly say that Trek tried to buy respect in the sport with Fisher and Bontrager because they couldn’t get there on their own.

In reality, both companies made good bikes and today it is really a moot point.

John

mobile1mobile1

I like specialized

Motorazr

Few big bicycle companies have a reputation as sullied as Trek with regard to what they did to Greg Lemond because he wouldn't shut up about teammate Lance Armstrong's doping. Trek deliberately and with malice screwed Lemond (who is a really good guy) every way imaginable while backing Armstrong as their marketing cash-cow. Ultimately, the truth came out about Armstrong (who did very nasty things to people in the sport who talked about what they saw and heard) yet there was no apology or amends made to Lemond.

Moreover, there was the way Trek screwed their Gary Fisher dealers when Trek merged the two brands into one. Gary Fisher dealers located too close to existing Trek dealers got shut down almost overnight.

I'm not eager to support a company who plays so ruthless and dirty with their own people. Add to that, the issue of frequently substandard specs and the fact that Trek bikes are just EVERYWHERE, mostly ridden by people who didn't understand their buying options. They just went to the nearest big bike shop; "THAT much money for a bike with sketchy components? Okay, here’s my card!"

Not that all Trek bikes are bad - the Supercaliber and E-Caliber in particular look very impressive. It’s just that I don't like the company and if a part says "Bontrager" on it, then I don't want it.

drlogik 

Trek stopped being Trek when they moved production to Taiwan. And yes, the Greg LeMond saga is disgraceful.

Trek's used to be made by Trek in Waterloo Wisconsin. Ironically their headquarters is still there. Now they are most likely made by Giant, Maxway or one of their competitors in Taiwan.

According to an Internet search, Giant may make Trek's frames. Why? Quality and technology is as good as it gets for high production bike frames and the production cost is lower.

I would not shy away from a Taiwanese-made bike. They make high quality goods. Am I a Taiwan lover? Heck NO!!! I buy American as much as possible. But I do give the devil his due.

Giant and Maxway are the companies behind the big names we recognize. Specialized's bikes are made in Taiwan also and probably by one of these companies or one their competitors. That's why so many different bikes these days from multiple brands look a lot the same.

You might ask, what's in it for Giant to make frames for Trek? Money...lots of it too.


--

vane171

I bought this secondhand Trek bike, model 2007. I guess the deeds you bring up here don't date that far back?
I mean otherwise it might make me feel not so good about my 'new' bike. But as it is secondhand it would be OK with me either way.

Actually, it says on the rear stay 'Handbuilt in the USA of Domestic and Foreign Parts', so probably still from the good old days...

vane171

I fall into the same buyer category, the look of the bike, the frame style and that it doesn't look like mobile advertising kiosk plus colors, it all plays more role than the brand.

I don't like that frame style with tubing like from 1970s and the top tube sloping down too much or some weird angles on stays, forks (like those splayed sideways on the back), also the bikes with deep wheels full of big stickers, makes the bike look too stout and also like a billboard. TT aero style frames look nice though, just not combined with those very deep rims, only the mid-deep ones.

As to big letters like Trek has, it actually blends in more, by being that big (like on aero frames), than other bike brands advertising. I suppose that depends on the graphic art they put into the logo. Like I am not too enthusiastic about Specialized logo.

70sSanO

Then I guess you won’t buy Specialized either. They’ve never made any of their frames and I believe they have always been imported. But I’m not sure on their S-Works.

It really doesn’t matter. Everyone imports frames, and definitely, components. Of course you can get an American made bike, it just won’t be from a major bike mfg.

John

cjenrick

Specialized is better. Always has been, always will be. Why? Location. Specialized is in Silicon Valley, world leader in innovative technology for 70 years now. Talented engineers on every street corner. Trek? Wisconsin. Home of milk and cheese, bratwurst and mutated pig farmers who couldn't engineer their way out of a paper bag. Bunch of capitalist pigs who could care less about cycling. Would rather ruin the bike business by having everything tig welded in china.

We use to call them Wreck. kept the repair dept real busy back in the 80's, you should have heard the mechanics scream at their junk.

Specialized? started the whole mountain bike biz. look at the 84 Stumpy. fully lugged frame with chrome plated vertical dropouts, Tomaselli motorcycle brake handles which i still love to this day, sealed hubs with cro mo axles and chrome bolts that were better design than phil wood, sealed headset, dual heavy duty water bottle cages that were impossible to break, a trend setting Avocet saddle that yo7u could ride all day, a ****** seat post that got replaced with Campy, (nobody's perfect) Araya 7X rims that you could pound to death, forks that would take a 30 mph crash into a log and send you into a cartwheel without bending, (been there, done that) a mount tech front deraileur that still gets raves today and which i happen to have on my road bike, heavy duty motorcycle brake cables and housing that never needed service, a Sugino triple crankset that still blows evrything else away, bullmoose alloy handlebars made by tom ritchey and were recalled due to cracked welds but never the less were the most light weight and ergonomically designed bars on the market that needed no stem and had a built in front brake cable housing stop, a sugino ug gold chain that still fetches 100 dollars on evilbay they are so good, a suntour rear derailleur that would later be replaced with the are superior deore xt, a frame with a built in chain hanger, Suntour bear trap peddles that, if you have never had the experince to ride, well, lets just say you will never find a more fabulous mtb peddle in your life, after losing your feet on a high speed drainage hump air time cliffhanger, you can instantly regain your footing in one form or another due to the extra large foot print and aggressive cage, i mean the attention to detail is an overwhelming joy. i got a trek aluminum mtb out on the garage that makes me puke it is so terrible. ****** geometry, heavy as a tank, an endless list of mis-concieved and badly executed artifacts on the bike that make it a complete burden to ride, the only good thing being that you don't have to lock it at the grocery because nobody in their right mind would steal such a hideous creation.

Lazyass

Look also screwed Greg. In his documentary he said he rode a prototype pedal and was promised $1 for every pair they sold and they gave him nothing. He kept one of his race bikes and removed the Look decals from it.

PeteHski

That's a bit too much info to take in one breath (has to be a contender for longest single sentence ever!), but are you saying Specialized peaked in '84?

I do agree with your point about Silicon Valley vs "mutated pig farmers", but Tesla cars built in China have far better build quality than those built in California. The tech is fantastic, but the home production quality is terrible. Design in Silicon Valley + build in the far east seems like the best solution to me.

drlogik 

The actual origins of mountain biking didn't start with Specialized or Trek. It started in the 1960's and 70's with a loose group of bikers and road racers in Marin County on Mount Tamalpais with Klunkers and Repacks. Out of that group emerged Gary Fisher, Tom Ritchey and others.

America still makes really fine bikes. Many are hand-made and some are semi-production. They can compete with any bike manufacturer in the world on innovation and build quality, especially with Titanium.

Belittling Wisconsin because it they are "Mutated pig farmers" and a "Bunch of capitalist pigs"? Really?

"Silicon Valley, world leader in innovative technology for 70 years now." And they aren't capitalists?

Wow, just wow.

Gresp15C

"Quality control is a management problem." -- William Edwards Deming

In a modern production system, quality is engineering.

Gresp15C

Trek is popular in Wisconsin.

I've met people who work at Trek, Pacific (Schwinn, GT, Mongoose), and Saris. All corporate behaviors aside, the actual people who work at those places tend to be passionate about bikes and cycling. Pacific is located along my commute, so I've chatted with people who work there.

It's quite possible we don't lead the world in mountain biking because we don't exactly lead the world in mountains.

Sure, "silicon valley" is hot right now thanks primarily to the advertising and media industries. Other kinds of technology and engineering have gone global. Wisconsin is not a hub of computer programming, fine. In fact, agriculture is a regional strength, and has led to the University of Wisconsin being the largest biology research facility in the world. It's nothing to be ashamed of, even if it doesn't necessarily offer the highest paying jobs. Agriculture is an urgent matter for humanity.

I could imagine being looked down upon for pig farming -- it's a dirty, heavily subsidized industry. But being looked down upon by the advertising industry? That's a stretch.

sean.hwy

From recently bike shopping Giant seems to be the value leader at least around 3k for a gravel bike where I was shopping. I don't think any of the big name brands make a bad bike. Comes down to what moves you. Since I was on budget the most value for group set is where I pulled the trigger. Maybe my next bike I buy will be a more emotional purchase. I keep eyeing Ti bikes but they are like 2k more for the same groups set I can get on a Giant.