RB1-luvr

I'm semi-interested in this vintage bike for sale locally. I don't know anything about the brand. I would be appreciative if someone could tell me their opinion about the price, and if it's a decent bike, and if they see anything alarming.

Thanks in advance.

Vintage Sam Benoto Cazenave,10 speed,Shimano 600,Simplex - bicycles... (craigslist.org)


moderator, kindly move this to C&V if that would be more appropriate.

Iride01 

Unless you are looking for a bike to fill out a vintage collection of several hundred bike you already have, I'd pass.

If you want a daily rider then get something newer and more suited for exactly the type of riding you are going to be doing most of the time.

cb400bill

Thread moved from General to C&V Appraisals.

Pic Assist

TugaDude

At that price I wouldn't be interested. It has some decent components on it, but the frame, to me is not one to chase after.

Also, mismatched components, broken front shifter, etc. are more reasons I believe it to be overpriced.

RB1-luvr

my interest is just in the age of it. I don't have any bikes from the 60s at the moment. Not having heard of the brand, I don't know what level of quality it is. Sounds like it is low from the initial replies. Thank you for them.

bikemig 

Likely not a low end bike given the chrome and nice Nervar crank (assuming its original) but likely not high end either. I'm guessing its a middling quality bike and the bike may well be made of decent quality steel. That said, the price is high at $340 given the parts and condition.

TugaDude

The presence of a derailer hanger is an indication it is/was probably lower end.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Here's a related thread:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vintage/661742-sam-benoto-cazenave.html"&gt;https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vintage/661742-sam-benoto-cazenave.html&lt;/a&gt;<br /><br />Another:<br /><a href="https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vintage/1182104-cazenave-sam-benotto-king-crust.html">https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vintage/1182104-cazenave-sam-benotto-king-crust.html</a>

Photo in the thread leads me to figure it originally came with a cottered crank.

TugaDude

Here's info on the brand:

Cazenave bicycles

TugaDude

Here's another photo of a Cazenave from the 60s which is cottered.

Wildwood 

If you want a 60s bike that is a substantial refurbishment project - at 1/3 the price listed, it might be worthwhile. I would move to late 70s or 80s given the greater availability of appropriate parts, the larger number bikes to select from, etc.

TugaDude

Hopefully you can find a 60s bike that is a bit higher end and/or at least has most all of its original components. Who knows, maybe someone here are the forum might have one and in your size? And no, that isn't a veiled attempt to sell you one of mine, I don't own any from that decade. Only bothering to say that because I was once accused of it. It wasn't true then and isn't now.

robobike316 

I agree with the others. That would be $100 top price. I would keep an eye on it as it seems near complete and is a pretty cool old machine. It will not sell for what he is asking or even anywhere close.

jasoninohio

Would make a fine project and probably ride nicely but I would want to spend like $60-$80 (or less); the seller is asking what it might be worth after a complete overhaul...

Edit: Looking at the pics more, the cables are all janked out, the one shift lever is broken, the tires are trash; the frame has a bit of character but is not special, the wheels and drivetrain do look usable; this would be a fine rat rod/streetfighter build if you found the thing for free but no way the seller is getting $300+ for it in that condition.

elcraft

The Nervar Crank has an odd size for chain rings ; 128mm BCD; incredibly difficult to source replacement chainrings. The head set and frame details look to be French; that means metric tube sizes and French stem/fork dimensions. Frame also appears to be gas pipe steel. I would do a pass on this unless you have some desire to deal with all the arcane /obsolete sizing and parts issues. There are other French cycles out there for sale that have better frame materials. the Simplex shifter is already broken and the front derailleur may already be cracked.

RB1-luvr

Thanks all! I'll check the CL ads from time to time and see if it comes down in price.

branko_76 

It's not that low.

If you're able to restore it, it could be very nice. I agree with the others regarding price, $125 would be the most I would pay.

TugaDude

Curious as to how you reach that conclusion. While there is some info on this maker online and I provided some leads, I was unable to find any info on the hierarchy of models at all. To me this bike has all of the visible hallmarks of a lower-end bike. Just how low is obviously debatable because we just don't know, unless someone has some facts to support its position. Having chrome doesn't mean anything in my mind as I have seen some real junk that had chrome socks and fork crowns. Anyway, I think most of us do agree on one thing and that is the seller is wishful thinking.

bikemike73 

Interesting bike...no way 340.00 !!!

Like others have said....MAYBE $100.......

Frame looks like a 23 /24. Seller has is listed as a 21 inch.

Some sellers really have no clue, but you never know...someone might pay more than the forum has suggested **********

Look for something else...there are PLENTY of bikes out there

branko_76 

I'm curious how you would think I came to a "conclusion". I was merely expressing an opinion. I also never equated quality with the presence of chrome and I don't need to know the hierarchy of any given product to decide if I like it or not.



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RB1-luvr

Thanks again for the advice folks. I'm going to keep my eye on it. It has a nice vintage look and I think I could make something of it.

TugaDude

You seem to have been offended by my question. No offense was intended. You said "It's not that low". That is a pretty definite statement. I was curious as to how you reached that opinion, that's all.

I didn't claim that you said anything about chrome, someone else did. If you felt I was putting words in your mouth, I'm sorry.

branko_76 

I'm not sure how a statement like "it's not that low" would be interpreted as "definite".... it's an opinion based on a photograph that I don't really feel like defending

okay, but you did quote me and respond with a one paragraph post

TugaDude

I don't get why you are seemingly taking this personal. Yes, I quoted you, I do that for clarity in case people haven't read the entire thread. It is for convenience, nothing more, nothing less. Opinions are welcome here! I just wanted to know if you had any information on the bike that you were basing your evaluation on. Again, there was no hidden agenda. It was an honest question.

I think you are being overly defensive, especially given the fact that I actually apologized!

branko_76 

time to move on

wrk101

In the world of vintage bikes, it's not so much the "brand", as the quality of the frame, parts and overall condition. Despite having had hundreds of bikes pass through my hands, I continue to see brands I have never heard of. I've picked up four such unknown brands to me in the last year. This one obviously needs work, a lot of work. Unless you have the time/tools/aptitude/pile of parts, I would avoid such bikes. Taken to a bike shop for repair, it's n rare that an old bike's value exceeds the repair cost.

In a similar vein, I picked up a vintage stereo system. Included in the set up was a broken reel to reel tape deck. I just got an estimate to repair the tape deck: $450. This for a deck once repaired, would be worth $150, $200 max. I wasn't counting on the deck working, I bought the stereo for its other parts. So I am happy with the purchase, but no way will I get that deck repaired. Now I will not put it in the garbage, I will sell it not working/parts only, and someone handy may be able to use it for parts or whatever.

I might pay $50 for this bike. But I have the time/tools/pile of parts to refresh it. When I was done, I would lose money on it, no doubt, despite having many of the parts in hand. I will occasionally take on projects like this just for fun. But as a financial decision, they have all been losers. I have started to be more selective on my "fun" projects. Did this recently with a Frejus, in deplorable shape, missing some key parts, but still pretty interesting.

As far as project choice, I find the 1980s to be the sweet spot, a lot of nice bikes that used common sized parts. Japan made millions of nice bikes, plenty are still out there at reasonable prices.