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Serrotta fitting bike found

Old 03-31-23, 04:30 PM
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beng1
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Serrotta SizeCycle found....

Bought from a silkscreen shop in a building that was a bicycle shop years ago, they thought it was an exercise bike, which it certainly could be used for. I could find no serial number on it with a quick inspection. Anyone know anything about these?







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Old 03-31-23, 05:11 PM
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Velo Mule
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Nice find. I would have been more fun if it had two wheels. But you got a bit of cycling history there.
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Old 03-31-23, 07:12 PM
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beng1
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Originally Posted by Velo Mule
Nice find. I would have been more fun if it had two wheels. But you got a bit of cycling history there.
The shop that used this closed up quite a few years ago and sold the building to some non-cycling business people who still have it. It was a cool bike shop and I miss it, and am glad to get this artifact from it. I will tune it up and maybe my wife will use it as an exercise bike for now.
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Old 04-01-23, 12:24 AM
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livedarklions
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Originally Posted by Velo Mule
Nice find. I would have been more fun if it had two wheels. But you got a bit of cycling history there.

It never had a front wheel:

https://www.trekchicago.com/articles...cycle-pg79.htm
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Old 04-01-23, 05:07 PM
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What is important to note is that these fit cycles only give you and approximation of the required sizes. Even very good fitters know that this business is cut and try.

I watched a video the other day of a fitter and he mentioned something that was interesting, bicyclists mostly have this manly man thing going and the bars are normally too wide and the reach is normally too long. He said one of the symptoms of too wide bars was numb hands. Well, on climbs my hands would get numb but not anywhere else. So I narrowed the bars by one cm and that seemed to work though because of the weather my condition is shot. So as the weather improves I will get a better idea. I am also suspicious of my reach but at 78 it might be I'm losing flexibility. 4 years ago when I was in good shape I did get a full time power of 298 watts for whatever that is worth since most of my rides are closer to 40 miles than 25 km.
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Old 04-01-23, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by RiceAWay
I watched a video the other day of a fitter and he mentioned something that was interesting, bicyclists mostly have this manly man thing going and the bars are normally too wide and the reach is normally too long.
So most of us should reduce our bar width? Would one size be enough? That's a cool contraption OP found, karma sent it where needed.
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Old 04-01-23, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by RiceAWay
What is important to note is that these fit cycles only give you and approximation of the required sizes. Even very good fitters know that this business is cut and try.

I watched a video the other day of a fitter and he mentioned something that was interesting, bicyclists mostly have this manly man thing going and the bars are normally too wide and the reach is normally too long. He said one of the symptoms of too wide bars was numb hands. Well, on climbs my hands would get numb but not anywhere else. So I narrowed the bars by one cm and that seemed to work though because of the weather my condition is shot. So as the weather improves I will get a better idea. I am also suspicious of my reach but at 78 it might be I'm losing flexibility. 4 years ago when I was in good shape I did get a full time power of 298 watts for whatever that is worth since most of my rides are closer to 40 miles than 25 km.
I strive to find the narrowest bars and use a short a distance between the seat and bars as I can, and it works well for me.
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Old 04-01-23, 05:38 PM
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Today I took a lot of this Serotta size-cycle apart and cleaned and lubed things so it all moves easily. Next is checking out the drive-line and making sure it all is working as it should. I don't think this thing was ever hardly used at all, besides not being used for at least the last few decades. I think it is from the 1980s is my guess.
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Old 04-01-23, 06:10 PM
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Originally Posted by shelbyfv
So most of us should reduce our bar width? Would one size be enough? That's a cool contraption OP found, karma sent it where needed.
Your handlebar width should be so that your arms go straight from the shoulder socket (acromion?) to your grip site which is normally the lever hood. Now just you try and tell me how to calculate that. This is different with every person. But everyone is riding 44 or 42 cm bars. And manufactures are likely to measure the bar outside to outside or center to center or inside to inside. Is it any wonder that even if someone stumbles upon the correct size, the bar they buy may be the incorrect size. And as I explained. I've been riding the better part of my life fitting and refitting and I STILL had a 1 cm error.
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Old 04-01-23, 07:42 PM
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A Serotta sizecycle is used by framebuilders (or fitters) to find a customer's bicycle position. The design of their custom frame will be based on the position discovered by the fitter on the sizecycle. Or by a fitter to change the customer's stem and seat position on the bicycle they own. They are particularly useful as a cyclist ages and has to adjust his/her position from what might be the most efficient in competition to a position more comfortable.

A custom frame based only on measuring body parts doesn't work as well because people with similar body measurements can sit quite different on a bicycle.

A sizecycle was part of Serotta's business plan to sell custom frames though bike stores. A store employee could do a fitting on the sizecycle and send the results to Serotta where they would convert those results into a custom made Serotta frame.

Amateur frame builders look for these old machines so they are better equipped to make custom frames for others. They are quite useful and valuable to them.
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Old 04-01-23, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by RiceAWay
Your handlebar width should be so that your arms go straight from the shoulder socket (acromion?) to your grip site which is normally the lever hood. Now just you try and tell me how to calculate that. This is different with every person. But everyone is riding 44 or 42 cm bars. And manufactures are likely to measure the bar outside to outside or center to center or inside to inside. Is it any wonder that even if someone stumbles upon the correct size, the bar they buy may be the incorrect size. And as I explained. I've been riding the better part of my life fitting and refitting and I STILL had a 1 cm error.
I think most of us know to check how the width of a set of handlebars is spec'd before we buy them.
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Old 04-02-23, 06:32 AM
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Originally Posted by RiceAWay
Your handlebar width should be so that your arms go straight from the shoulder socket (acromion?) to your grip site which is normally the lever hood. Now just you try and tell me how to calculate that. This is different with every person. But everyone is riding 44 or 42 cm bars. And manufactures are likely to measure the bar outside to outside or center to center or inside to inside. Is it any wonder that even if someone stumbles upon the correct size, the bar they buy may be the incorrect size. And as I explained. I've been riding the better part of my life fitting and refitting and I STILL had a 1 cm error.
I've got 3 bikes. One has 44 cm road bars, one has 42 cm road bars and my mtb has 76 cm flat bars. I wouldn't even notice a 1 cm difference in bar width. I'm not that sensitive to tiny arm movements. If you put your arms straight out in front of you and move each hand 5 mm left or right, do you feel any discomfort or anything at all? The difference in shoulder angle is about a quarter of a degree. As a rule of thumb it makes sense to have road bars the same width as your shoulder joints, but it's not super-critical. Road race bikes tend to have slightly narrower bars for aero efficiency. Wider bars provide slightly more stable handling, but I can't tell the difference between 42 and 44 cm road bars. I'm not the most flexible person, but my shoulders can easily deal with changes of a fraction of a degree.
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Old 04-02-23, 10:52 AM
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There were a few iterations/generations of these, there are newer models with more bells and whistles. Serotta spun off the sizing business into the Serotta International Sizing Institute:
from there website:"In my early bike building years (1972-1978) I used the “CONI method” and realized that it had it’s limitations. After applying this method to several hundred cyclists, I realized that ‘the best’ was defined by what worked the best for each individual cyclist. Therefore, trying to determine exact bike fit for an individual by comparing him/her to a broad database of information about other people was an inherently flawed hypothesis. Bike fit should be tailored to each individual cyclist.

Within a few months my staff and I had built an infinitely adjustable stationary bicycle dubbed the SizeCycle. This machine allowed the observation of the athlete, unencumbered by the confines of pre-existing bicycle geometry, and it facilitated quick adaptation of position, and direct observation of the outcomes of those changes. Although the SizeCycle was a fantastic tool, it didn’t guarantee a great result. In fact, we found that the quality of the fitting was as varied as the skill, knowledge and patience of the ‘fitter’. This further crystalized the idea that this tool would require a solid fit methodology that would include body measurement, physical assessment, and a thorough understanding of the athletes goals to be successful."
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Old 04-02-23, 04:23 PM
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Oh yeah, very familiar with the sizecycle. the ones we had (3 total) were all bare metal, not painted. We were a Serotta dealer and were taught the Serotta sizing method. The things work well, and one of the shops racers used it for training sessions in the winter, at least 3 times a week. As long as the movable joints were not overly loaded with the clamp, they do alright. We did go through a few of the resistance modules over the years, however that can be expected. No longer associated with the biz anymore, but 2 of the 3 machines are still in use.
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Old 04-02-23, 05:58 PM
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I dragged the SizeCycle outside in the sun today and put some more never-seize compound on some of it's parts, took some better photos of it's details. Seat-tube size is marked and shows up in a little round window in centimeters.












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Old 04-02-23, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by TiHabanero
Oh yeah, very familiar with the sizecycle. the ones we had (3 total) were all bare metal, not painted. We were a Serotta dealer and were taught the Serotta sizing method. The things work well, and one of the shops racers used it for training sessions in the winter, at least 3 times a week. As long as the movable joints were not overly loaded with the clamp, they do alright. We did go through a few of the resistance modules over the years, however that can be expected. No longer associated with the biz anymore, but 2 of the 3 machines are still in use.
I was thinking my wife may use this next winter as a stationary bike. The paint job and graphics on this one are part of what make it cool. This unit seems very heavy duty, no corners were cut in it's construction. On Serotta's website, they have three models available, the cheapest one is $9500 !!! My wife gave me the money to get this, $100, as a present for an upcoming birthday.....
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Old 04-02-23, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by beng1
I strive to find the narrowest bars and use a short a distance between the seat and bars as I can, and it works well for me.
It's a battle between you and Moisture for who should be listened to less when it comes to bike fit.
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Old 04-03-23, 10:11 AM
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We had a similar fitting bike in the shop. It had a fixed gear hub, which was a safety problem. I was afraid some customer would lose a finger, so we had to lock up the rear wheel when not in use.

If the Serrota has a fixed gear, watch your fingers and loose clothing.
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Old 04-04-23, 11:13 AM
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@beng1 - try pushing those handlebars out so you can evaluate extending your arms when in your aero position. You may like it. Or not.
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Old 04-04-23, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Wildwood
@beng1 - try pushing those handlebars out so you can evaluate extending your arms when in your aero position. You may like it. Or not.
Or, since he likes aero positions, maybe he should try less extended arms. It worked for Graeme Obree:


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Old 04-04-23, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by beng1
I strive to find the narrowest bars and use a short a distance between the seat and bars as I can, and it works well for me.
Narrow bars: that's the direction the World Tour racers are going in. In fact, the UCI has stepped in with new rules concerning how narrow a bar is allowed.

From this page:

After a few ambitious riders had begun experimenting with extremely narrow handlebars in recent years, the UCI has stepped in to put a stop to the fun – or bring in some much needed safety limits (depending on your perspective).

While there was previously only a maximum permitted overall handlebar width (which still stands at 500mm for road, track and time trial bikes), a minimum overall handlebar width of 350mm has now been implemented for certain events as well.

In both instances, this is measured outside to outside, meaning at the outside edge of the outermost point of each side of the handlebar.
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Old 04-04-23, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by terrymorse
Or, since he likes aero positions, maybe he should try less extended arms. It worked for Graeme Obree:



He looks like he's having a bike inserted, if you know what I mean.
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Old 04-04-23, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Trakhak
Narrow bars: that's the direction the World Tour racers are going in. In fact, the UCI has stepped in with new rules concerning how narrow a bar is allowed.

From this page:

After a few ambitious riders had begun experimenting with extremely narrow handlebars in recent years, the UCI has stepped in to put a stop to the fun – or bring in some much needed safety limits (depending on your perspective).

While there was previously only a maximum permitted overall handlebar width (which still stands at 500mm for road, track and time trial bikes), a minimum overall handlebar width of 350mm has now been implemented for certain events as well.
Narrow bars is an old thing, not new. My 1984 touring Centurian had 38 (ctc) bars on a 59cm frame.
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Old 04-04-23, 07:48 PM
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The bars on my Huffy are only 15" (380mm) wide and it is the most comfortable road bike I have. They are it's original bars. Usually all the old road bike have bars an inch or two wider. I just read an article where testing was done with two road bikes and when fitted with narrower bars it cut aero drag down significantly.
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Old 04-04-23, 07:52 PM
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Originally Posted by terrymorse
Or, since he likes aero positions, maybe he should try less extended arms. It worked for Graeme Obree:
I watched a movie about him building and racing that bike. I liked it because he can think for himself, outside the box. The sort of person that if he posted on this forum about his ideas would be ridiculed.
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