Expected Lifespan of a frame made out of Aluminium or Carbon Fibre or Steel
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HillRider, I suspect that Wheever has spent too much time in the road riding and road racing forums. I recognize all the memes from that context. They stem from typos from several years.
#27
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Actually, all the misspellings are deliberate and refer to ongoing BF memes. (And I had to fight autocorrect on them. Lol.) Search for user RyanF for context on "drope the hamer."
#28
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Sigh. These are references to ongoing BF memes. Perhaps you are too recent a member to know this?
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From a purely theoretical perspective, a monocoque carbon frame should last the longest. A carbon fiber frame has the same infinite fatigue life as steel and is not prone to rust or corrosion. Lastly the monocoque construction eliminates the weld seams removing a common failure point of other materials.
Given the choice for a long lasting bike between a Ti frame and a CF frame, smart people would chose the Ti frame every time.
#32
Constant tinkerer
But CF frames that are really just reinforced plastic is subject to deterioration from sun light, and the plastic resin turning brittle because the plastic slowly gasses off.
Given the choice for a long lasting bike between a Ti frame and a CF frame, smart people would chose the Ti frame every time.
Given the choice for a long lasting bike between a Ti frame and a CF frame, smart people would chose the Ti frame every time.
Any material could carry the OP 10 years without issue. But since carbon frames are pretty much all meant for racing, I wouldn't recommend any of them. Titanium would be way over budget. So I'd recommend the sturdiest steel or aluminum frame available. The example of the Surly Long Haul Trucker would be a good choice.
#33
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I was told by a Bianchi rep in the 1980s that the management in Italy found the idea that Bianchi USA offered lifetime warranties for their steel frames to be ludicrous. (Don't know how it works now, but at that time, Bianchi USA, not Bianchi Italy, assumed responsibility for warranty replacement of Bianchi frames sold in the United States).
The Italians apparently said, more or less, "Sure, we can build frames and offer lifetime warranties on them, if you don't mind frames that are 1 kg heavier."
I blame Schwinn, which was, I believe, the first company to offer lifetime frame warranties, for training U.S. cyclists to expect frames to last forever. I know that the sales reps I spoke to in the 1960s tried to steer clear of the subject of frame warranties.
And they had a point, particularly with regard to high-performance frames. If a high-end frame---steel, aluminum, titanium, or carbon---lasts for more than a season of professional racing, the builder isn't trying hard enough.
The Italians apparently said, more or less, "Sure, we can build frames and offer lifetime warranties on them, if you don't mind frames that are 1 kg heavier."
I blame Schwinn, which was, I believe, the first company to offer lifetime frame warranties, for training U.S. cyclists to expect frames to last forever. I know that the sales reps I spoke to in the 1960s tried to steer clear of the subject of frame warranties.
And they had a point, particularly with regard to high-performance frames. If a high-end frame---steel, aluminum, titanium, or carbon---lasts for more than a season of professional racing, the builder isn't trying hard enough.
#34
Senior Member
ColnelSanders, I'm no structural engineer, but I think that most frames, regardless of construction material, will out live their owners with normal use. If you want to hedge the bet, go for Ti.
At a weight you mentioned a touring bike is a good selection and just about every touring bike made these days is steel, making the choice of frame material easy.
Brad
At a weight you mentioned a touring bike is a good selection and just about every touring bike made these days is steel, making the choice of frame material easy.
Brad
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You're ignoring the fact that a Ti frame (or ANY material) when under-built for the stresses it will see, will fail.
Any material could carry the OP 10 years without issue. But since carbon frames are pretty much all meant for racing, I wouldn't recommend any of them. Titanium would be way over budget. So I'd recommend the sturdiest steel or aluminum frame available. The example of the Surly Long Haul Trucker would be a good choice.
Any material could carry the OP 10 years without issue. But since carbon frames are pretty much all meant for racing, I wouldn't recommend any of them. Titanium would be way over budget. So I'd recommend the sturdiest steel or aluminum frame available. The example of the Surly Long Haul Trucker would be a good choice.
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I was told by a Bianchi rep in the 1980s that the management in Italy found the idea that Bianchi USA offered lifetime warranties for their steel frames to be ludicrous. (Don't know how it works now, but at that time, Bianchi USA, not Bianchi Italy, assumed responsibility for warranty replacement of Bianchi frames sold in the United States).
The Italians apparently said, more or less, "Sure, we can build frames and offer lifetime warranties on them, if you don't mind frames that are 1 kg heavier."
I blame Schwinn, which was, I believe, the first company to offer lifetime frame warranties, for training U.S. cyclists to expect frames to last forever. I know that the sales reps I spoke to in the 1960s tried to steer clear of the subject of frame warranties.
And they had a point, particularly with regard to high-performance frames. If a high-end frame---steel, aluminum, titanium, or carbon---lasts for more than a season of professional racing, the builder isn't trying hard enough.
The Italians apparently said, more or less, "Sure, we can build frames and offer lifetime warranties on them, if you don't mind frames that are 1 kg heavier."
I blame Schwinn, which was, I believe, the first company to offer lifetime frame warranties, for training U.S. cyclists to expect frames to last forever. I know that the sales reps I spoke to in the 1960s tried to steer clear of the subject of frame warranties.
And they had a point, particularly with regard to high-performance frames. If a high-end frame---steel, aluminum, titanium, or carbon---lasts for more than a season of professional racing, the builder isn't trying hard enough.
#37
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Sigh. These are references to ongoing BF memes. Perhaps you are too recent a member to know this?
#38
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I like to get used frames and build them up as experiments or for self or as give-aways. But I don't do aluminum or CF unless I know their specific history (original owner, usage, etc). Just sayin'.
#39
Constant tinkerer
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But CF frames that are really just reinforced plastic is subject to deterioration from sun light, and the plastic resin turning brittle because the plastic slowly gasses off.
Given the choice for a long lasting bike between a Ti frame and a CF frame, smart people would chose the Ti frame every time.
Given the choice for a long lasting bike between a Ti frame and a CF frame, smart people would chose the Ti frame every time.
As to Ti, Litespeed did build a very light (<800 gm) Ti frame years ago that was very competitive with carbon and aluminum in weight but wasn't very durable so durability is as much, or more, a matter of construction as it is of material..
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Seems to me the answer to the OP's question is, it depends. As mentioned a few times already each material comes in different versions and can be built to last a long time with a 270lb rider with the right design or could break in a short time with the wrong choices. I think the best thing is to go for some test rides, contact the mfrs. directly of the bikes you like and ask if they guarantee their frames for a heavy rider and get one with a lifetime guarantee. Make sure the guarantee is in writing when purchasing. Buy it and enjoy your new bike.
#42
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There are steel and aluminum bikes designed for the stated purpose. Just get one of them.
If I weighed 270 lbs, I would buy a steel-frame bike. Come to think of it, all of my too-many bikes have steel frames (except for one titanium), so I'm clearly biased. But there are plenty of good aluminum-frame bikes.
If I weighed 270 lbs, I would buy a steel-frame bike. Come to think of it, all of my too-many bikes have steel frames (except for one titanium), so I'm clearly biased. But there are plenty of good aluminum-frame bikes.
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#43
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OK, I wasn't sure since we get so many truly unintentional typos here and occasional well meaning but misguided "advice". Your posting was amusing and, since I only frequent the Mechanics forum I wasn't aware of the memes on other ones.
Uhh, no. Look at my posting count.
Uhh, no. Look at my posting count.
And I wasn't referring to you re: the newbie observation. It was the other guy who was a junior member. (Teach me to post before I've finished my morning coffee!)
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I was told by a Bianchi rep in the 1980s that the management in Italy found the idea that Bianchi USA offered lifetime warranties for their steel frames to be ludicrous. (Don't know how it works now, but at that time, Bianchi USA, not Bianchi Italy, assumed responsibility for warranty replacement of Bianchi frames sold in the United States).
The Italians apparently said, more or less, "Sure, we can build frames and offer lifetime warranties on them, if you don't mind frames that are 1 kg heavier."
I blame Schwinn, which was, I believe, the first company to offer lifetime frame warranties, for training U.S. cyclists to expect frames to last forever. I know that the sales reps I spoke to in the 1960s tried to steer clear of the subject of frame warranties.
And they had a point, particularly with regard to high-performance frames. If a high-end frame---steel, aluminum, titanium, or carbon---lasts for more than a season of professional racing, the builder isn't trying hard enough.
The Italians apparently said, more or less, "Sure, we can build frames and offer lifetime warranties on them, if you don't mind frames that are 1 kg heavier."
I blame Schwinn, which was, I believe, the first company to offer lifetime frame warranties, for training U.S. cyclists to expect frames to last forever. I know that the sales reps I spoke to in the 1960s tried to steer clear of the subject of frame warranties.
And they had a point, particularly with regard to high-performance frames. If a high-end frame---steel, aluminum, titanium, or carbon---lasts for more than a season of professional racing, the builder isn't trying hard enough.
#47
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What "regular service" does a steel frame need? As to "lifetime warrantees" both Trek and Litespeed have them, or did in the past and perhaps still do.
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Okay, let's say the choice of frame is out of a Specialized Crosstrail Expert with their M4 aluminium or Giant's Toughroad with their SLR aluminium vs something like the Kona Big Rove ST with 4130 steel or Surly's Disck Trucker 4130 steel.
Forget I asked about Carbon.
Forget I asked about Carbon.
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#49
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Originally, it was thought that Aluminum frames introduced in the mid-80s onward would have the overall advantage.
So they all had lifetime warranties initially. And of course, the promise that they would come out of the factory already properly aligned - ready to go - no prep work needed unlike steel frames.
By the early 90s, reality set in. Well established brand name aluminum frames were seen breaking as soon as 7 years out - alternatives breaking in as little as 3 years out. So the warranties were walked back to 5 years and 3 years. Pretty much everyone walked back their warranty terms...with Klein being a very stubborn holdout.
The ugly part was discovering that some were not in alignment as was the "industry promise". Brand name or not, we'd run into frames in the shop where overall alignment was off, hangers were off, dropouts were off, etc.
And of course, we didn't like bending aluminum . . . so we registered our complaints...we did not let them slide by.
Meanwhile, the prediction was made in many circles that Titanium frames would have limited life expectancy...on par with or even shorter than aluminum frames.
In 1999, 2000 and 2001, titanium frames could be had for super cheap - you could buy a Douglas at Colorado Cyclist for just 900.00. No joke...that cheap. Slightly cheaper than a Tommasini Sintesi at 960.00.
Decade later, it's discovered..."Hey, these Titanium frames are holding up . . . just as well as steel frames!!!"
So here we are now, you want a frame cheap....
...it's gonna be Aluminum - with a 1-3 year warranty in most cases.
You want lightweight steel? Squeeze your family jewels.
You want a titanium? Sell your first born...
You can see the hierarchy at all the Italian, UK and US based high-end builders.
Anyone who purchased a Titanium frame in 1999, 2000 and 2001 cheap, and kept it and still ride it today - you are lucky bastards!
=8-|
So they all had lifetime warranties initially. And of course, the promise that they would come out of the factory already properly aligned - ready to go - no prep work needed unlike steel frames.
By the early 90s, reality set in. Well established brand name aluminum frames were seen breaking as soon as 7 years out - alternatives breaking in as little as 3 years out. So the warranties were walked back to 5 years and 3 years. Pretty much everyone walked back their warranty terms...with Klein being a very stubborn holdout.
The ugly part was discovering that some were not in alignment as was the "industry promise". Brand name or not, we'd run into frames in the shop where overall alignment was off, hangers were off, dropouts were off, etc.
And of course, we didn't like bending aluminum . . . so we registered our complaints...we did not let them slide by.
Meanwhile, the prediction was made in many circles that Titanium frames would have limited life expectancy...on par with or even shorter than aluminum frames.
In 1999, 2000 and 2001, titanium frames could be had for super cheap - you could buy a Douglas at Colorado Cyclist for just 900.00. No joke...that cheap. Slightly cheaper than a Tommasini Sintesi at 960.00.
Decade later, it's discovered..."Hey, these Titanium frames are holding up . . . just as well as steel frames!!!"
So here we are now, you want a frame cheap....
...it's gonna be Aluminum - with a 1-3 year warranty in most cases.
You want lightweight steel? Squeeze your family jewels.
You want a titanium? Sell your first born...
You can see the hierarchy at all the Italian, UK and US based high-end builders.
Anyone who purchased a Titanium frame in 1999, 2000 and 2001 cheap, and kept it and still ride it today - you are lucky bastards!
=8-|
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5000+ wheels built since 1984...
Disclaimer:
1. I do not claim to be an expert in bicycle mechanics despite my experience.
2. I like anyone will comment in other areas.
3. I do not own the preexisting concepts of DISH and ERD.
4. I will provide information as I always have to others that I believe will help them protect themselves from unscrupulous mechanics.
5. My all time favorite book is:
Kahane, Howard. Logic and Contemporary Rhetoric: The Use of Reason in Everyday Life
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#50
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Okay, let's say the choice of frame is out of a Specialized Crosstrail Expert with their M4 aluminium or Giant's Toughroad with their SLR aluminium vs something like the Kona Big Rove ST with 4130 steel or Surly's Disck Trucker 4130 steel.
Forget I asked about Carbon.
Forget I asked about Carbon.
I have two steel bikes. The tourer has over 70k miles and the road has 122k miles.
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