Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

Drafting etiquette

Notices
Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Drafting etiquette

Old 09-14-21, 11:08 PM
  #76  
caloso
Senior Member
 
caloso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
Posts: 40,865

Bikes: Specialized Tarmac, Canyon Exceed, Specialized Transition, Ellsworth Roots, Ridley Excalibur

Mentioned: 68 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2952 Post(s)
Liked 3,106 Times in 1,417 Posts
Sitting 3 bike lengths back would be even weirder and more annoying because it’s too far back to get a decent draft.
caloso is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 12:10 AM
  #77  
genejockey 
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
 
genejockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,471

Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10126 Post(s)
Liked 11,468 Times in 5,875 Posts
Originally Posted by cxwrench
Are you really this big of an anti-social idiot? 'Awkward AF'? Are you serious? You couldn't have just said 'no thanks, i'm doing my own ride'? You should probably stay in mom's basement, the real world seems to be a little much for you.
This is really offensive. Some of us ride to get away from the obligation to interact with others, because for some of us interacting with others is work. If I were you, I'd delete this post and apologize.
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."

"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
genejockey is offline  
Likes For genejockey:
Old 09-15-21, 05:24 AM
  #78  
GlennR
On Your Left
 
GlennR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Long Island, New York, USA
Posts: 8,373

Bikes: Trek Emonda SLR, Sram eTap, Zipp 303

Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3004 Post(s)
Liked 2,433 Times in 1,187 Posts
Originally Posted by genejockey
This is really offensive. Some of us ride to get away from the obligation to interact with others, because for some of us interacting with others is work. If I were you, I'd delete this post and apologize.
Most people like that are wearing headphones. It tells the everyone "i want to be left alone".
GlennR is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 07:13 AM
  #79  
Maelochs
Senior Member
 
Maelochs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 15,433

Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE

Mentioned: 143 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7620 Post(s)
Liked 3,432 Times in 1,813 Posts
Everywhere I go outside my front door is shared space. I have an obligation to cooperate with other people in that shared space so that we all can make maximum use of it. Even if a lot of other people are jerks, I Cannot deliberately be a jerk myself. I have a certain moral standard and a sense of civic duty.

I Never want to talk to other people. But often I have to because a I always want to do the right thing.

If I meet another rider, I don't need to have a conversation, but if I need to communicate in order to create a safer situation, then I need to get over myself and talk. I am the king of my castle inside my home, but on the road, I am one among equals.

If I need to say, "Please back off," (I cannot imagine anyone would try to draft me unless they were walking,) or if I need to say, "Hey, I am just using you as a carrot to make myself work harder, so thanks, and I will stay back far enough not to hit you if you panic-stop," or whatever---That Is My Job as a caring and decent human being (or a person playing that part in real life) and as a person who wants to be able to safely share the road with all kinds of vehicles.

If I am so self-important or so internally conflicted that I cannot even say a few words to make Everyone's life a little better, I should stay home on the trainer and watch self-help books while I pedal.

"Freedom" is wonderful but it cannot be achieved in totality, and it cannot be achieved independently ... unless you want to walk into the Australian outback with a bow and arrow and canteen.

Unless you mined the ore, smelted the metal, forged the tubes, tapped your own rubber tree for tires, and then built all the roads .... then you are benefitting from being a member of society.

Pay your dues----and when "paying your dues" is simply saying, "I am staying far enough back not to endanger you" or "Please back off a little," or simply slowing down or speeding up a little for a few seconds .... how selfish must a person be to take so much and be so unwilling to give anything back?

Get over yourself. We are all in this together, so pull on your oar. Some people died fighting for our freedoms .... you aren't willing to say "Good morning"?
Maelochs is offline  
Likes For Maelochs:
Old 09-15-21, 07:37 AM
  #80  
ExPatTyke
Full Member
 
ExPatTyke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Weston-super-Mare, Somerset, UK
Posts: 433

Bikes: Gitane Course, Paris Sport, Peugeot AO8, Peugeot Bretagne, Peugeot Premiere 85, Peugeot Premiere 86, Peugeot ANC Halfords Team Replica, Peugeot Festina Team Replica, Motobecane Grand Sport, Motobecane Super 15, Raleigh Pro Race, Raleigh Stratos, BSA

Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 117 Post(s)
Liked 427 Times in 90 Posts
It's a bit antisocial, in my opinion, drafting on someone's back wheel without introducing yourself and asking permission. If I catch someone up (and that's a rarity!), I'll always greet them and if they're riding at a similar pace ask if they mind me riding with them for a while. The answer's nearly always Yes, and I've met some nice people and had some good conversations that way.

If someone catches me up and wants to ride with me that's great - as long they say hello and are prepared to share the work, or at least explain that they're cooked and want a tow for a while. But I can't help thinking if they're that tired how did they catch me? Someone just coming up behind and drafting me is, in my opinion, both rude and showing a complete lack of ambition - there's plenty of back wheels that are going faster than mine.

If someone's going faster than me I've no objection to them going past and leaving me. I ride at my own pace and prefer not to alter that just to jump on a wheel - my racing days are over and my only real concern is getting to the next tea stop.

I've had, I think, two people say they didn't want company. That's fair enough - I understand that some people, for any number of reasons, do want solitude during their ride and I'm happy to wish them a good ride and part company.

It's been interesting during the various Covid lockdowns though to see how some people have amended their behaviour to cope with rules and guidelines on social distancing. Very wide passes and riding quite a few yards back have been the order of the day.
ExPatTyke is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 08:08 AM
  #81  
genejockey 
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
 
genejockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,471

Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10126 Post(s)
Liked 11,468 Times in 5,875 Posts
Originally Posted by GlennR
Most people like that are wearing headphones. It tells the everyone "i want to be left alone".
You should hear what I think of people who wear headphones when riding.......
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."

"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
genejockey is offline  
Likes For genejockey:
Old 09-15-21, 09:57 AM
  #82  
razorjack
Junior Member
 
razorjack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 82

Bikes: Trans Sentinel, Spesh Tarmac

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 50 Post(s)
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by bshell
When you are riding and some stranger passes you, is it ok to catch up and draft behind them? Is this considered bad manners? Or is there some proper way to do this that is polite? I do this from time to time without problem but the other day I did it and the guy in front slammed on his brakes so of course I slammed into him and both of us were very annoyed with the other. He did it on purpose because he thought I was a creep for drafting behind him. I had no idea this was not allowed. So what is the right way to draft behind a stranger when out and about?
WTF? #$^%$& did he have a death wish?? pleasure from crashing ? or was he so concerned about your time on Strava segments ?? :O
Personally i don't draft very close after other ppl, as most of them are amateurs without proper awareness and skills to ride smooth.

the guy in front slammed on his brakes
but creating dangerous situation only because your ego hurts.... that's just a real dick move ...

Last edited by razorjack; 09-15-21 at 03:36 PM.
razorjack is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 12:49 PM
  #83  
GlennR
On Your Left
 
GlennR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Long Island, New York, USA
Posts: 8,373

Bikes: Trek Emonda SLR, Sram eTap, Zipp 303

Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3004 Post(s)
Liked 2,433 Times in 1,187 Posts
Originally Posted by genejockey
You should hear what I think of people who wear headphones when riding.......
I don't acknowledge them. I figure the headphone are their way of saying is "leave me alone"
GlennR is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 12:58 PM
  #84  
genejockey 
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
 
genejockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,471

Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10126 Post(s)
Liked 11,468 Times in 5,875 Posts
Originally Posted by GlennR
I don't acknowledge them. I figure the headphone are their way of saying is "leave me alone"
I sometimes flinch when passed by another rider, or pinged or addressed from close behind, so I imagine a headphone wearer would be even more likely to startle.

BTW, I may not speak to other riders, but I also don't draft them, nor do I do anything stupid like slamming on the brakes if they have grabbed my wheel. Indeed, if someone's close behind me, drafting or not, I will start pointing out hazards, and if someone's close I refrain from spitting or blowing snot rockets. But my nose does tend to run when I ride, so if you sneak up behind me, you may not enjoy the experience.
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."

"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
genejockey is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 01:12 PM
  #85  
ericcox
Trying to keep up
 
ericcox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Fort Worth
Posts: 2,137

Bikes: Pinarello Prince, Orbea Onix, Ridley Fenix

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 79 Post(s)
Liked 136 Times in 79 Posts
This whole thread is fascinating. Personally, I'm a huge introvert, but if someone can hop on my wheel and hold it, fine. If they don't greet me, I'll usually say something to them. If someone passes me, but not fast enough to create a lot of space, I'll say something. I don't assume they're an ******* - maybe just a) shy; or b) unsure what to say. I've met a few riding buddies on some local routes where neither of us was creating distance.

Basically, all I'm saying is I try to be decent. Pass someone? I usually say good morning (or afternoon)? Get passed? I acknowledge the person; I'm unlikely to up my effort, but neither am I going to slow down. If I catch that person, I'll greet them.

I like my solo rides, but I also have really been trying to give others the benefit of the doubt and try not to be an *******.
ericcox is offline  
Likes For ericcox:
Old 09-15-21, 02:30 PM
  #86  
Sy Reene
Advocatus Diaboli
 
Sy Reene's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Wherever I am
Posts: 8,585

Bikes: Merlin Cyrene, Nashbar steel CX

Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4696 Post(s)
Liked 1,512 Times in 987 Posts
One rider coming up from behind (especially if they didn't ask permission) and sliding in front of you, is an overt invitation to draft them, isn't it?
Sy Reene is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 05:44 PM
  #87  
Atlas Shrugged
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,603
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1191 Post(s)
Liked 1,257 Times in 643 Posts
Let’s get back to the original post. This guy was drafting so close that when the rider in front applied the brakes the yokel rode into the back of him and crashed. Then accused the rider of brake checking him which I highly doubt. Story seems like a troll however the whole premise is ridiculous.

I don’t draft others unless really in the hurt locker and need a tow home friends only. I also don’t provide draft to people I do not know because I find it irritating and a invasion of my private space.
Atlas Shrugged is offline  
Likes For Atlas Shrugged:
Old 09-15-21, 06:01 PM
  #88  
caloso
Senior Member
 
caloso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
Posts: 40,865

Bikes: Specialized Tarmac, Canyon Exceed, Specialized Transition, Ellsworth Roots, Ridley Excalibur

Mentioned: 68 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2952 Post(s)
Liked 3,106 Times in 1,417 Posts
Originally Posted by Sy Reene
One rider coming up from behind (especially if they didn't ask permission) and sliding in front of you, is an overt invitation to draft them, isn't it?
I would say an overt invitation is the rider tapping their hip. Even more overt is to say out loud "hop on."
caloso is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 06:53 PM
  #89  
Maelochs
Senior Member
 
Maelochs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 15,433

Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE

Mentioned: 143 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7620 Post(s)
Liked 3,432 Times in 1,813 Posts
Originally Posted by caloso
I would say an overt invitation is the rider tapping their hip. Even more overt is to say out loud "hop on."
last time I tried that "tapping the rider's hip" she slapped me out of the saddle.
Maelochs is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 06:55 PM
  #90  
Maelochs
Senior Member
 
Maelochs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 15,433

Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE

Mentioned: 143 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7620 Post(s)
Liked 3,432 Times in 1,813 Posts
Originally Posted by Atlas Shrugged
Let’s get back to the original post. This guy was drafting so close that when the rider in front applied the brakes the yokel rode into the back of him and crashed. Then accused the rider of brake checking him which I highly doubt. Story seems like a troll however the whole premise is ridiculous.
---Yup..... "I snuck up behind this guy, he slowed because he didn't even know I was there, and since I was head down and hammering I rammed right into him .... and He had the nerve to get upset."
Maelochs is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 06:58 PM
  #91  
Mojo31
-------
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Tejas
Posts: 12,544
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9439 Post(s)
Liked 6,236 Times in 3,436 Posts
Originally Posted by Maelochs
last time I tried that "tapping the rider's hip" she slapped me out of the saddle.
Wait and see what happens when you tell her to hop on.
Mojo31 is offline  
Likes For Mojo31:
Old 09-15-21, 07:19 PM
  #92  
SapInMyBlood
Enthusiastic Sufferer
 
SapInMyBlood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 229

Bikes: 2015 Specialized Roubaix, 2014 Salsa Fargo, 2013 Trek Remedy, 2014 Cannondale Synapse

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 124 Post(s)
Liked 311 Times in 107 Posts
Originally Posted by big john
Well, does it?
Bernoulli says it won't
SapInMyBlood is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 07:38 PM
  #93  
Gonzo Bob
cycles per second
 
Gonzo Bob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,930

Bikes: Early 1980's Ishiwata 022 steel sport/touring, 1986 Vitus 979, 1988 DiamondBack Apex, 1997 Softride PowerWing 700, 2001 Trek OCLV 110

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 44 Post(s)
Liked 71 Times in 48 Posts
Originally Posted by big john
Well, does it?
Yes. The propulsion is not provided by the wheels. It is provided by the propeller.
Gonzo Bob is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 07:58 PM
  #94  
DonkeyShow
Full Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2021
Posts: 333
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 195 Post(s)
Liked 234 Times in 141 Posts
This is why ride with my Bluetooth speaker blasting. Tryna invite the party or sufficiently warn others to avoid me. Yall take this **** too serious.
DonkeyShow is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 08:05 PM
  #95  
GlennR
On Your Left
 
GlennR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Long Island, New York, USA
Posts: 8,373

Bikes: Trek Emonda SLR, Sram eTap, Zipp 303

Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3004 Post(s)
Liked 2,433 Times in 1,187 Posts
Originally Posted by DonkeyShow
This is why ride with my Bluetooth speaker blasting..
I take safety seriously. Sure hope you keep a straight line or you can get elbowed into the curb when being passed if you wonder
GlennR is offline  
Likes For GlennR:
Old 09-15-21, 08:11 PM
  #96  
big john
Senior Member
 
big john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: In the foothills of Los Angeles County
Posts: 25,032
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8147 Post(s)
Liked 8,800 Times in 4,368 Posts
Originally Posted by SapInMyBlood
Bernoulli says it won't
How many planes did he launch from treadmills?
big john is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 08:12 PM
  #97  
big john
Senior Member
 
big john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: In the foothills of Los Angeles County
Posts: 25,032
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8147 Post(s)
Liked 8,800 Times in 4,368 Posts
Originally Posted by Gonzo Bob
Yes. The propulsion is not provided by the wheels. It is provided by the propeller.
What about a jet?
big john is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 08:23 PM
  #98  
GlennR
On Your Left
 
GlennR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Long Island, New York, USA
Posts: 8,373

Bikes: Trek Emonda SLR, Sram eTap, Zipp 303

Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3004 Post(s)
Liked 2,433 Times in 1,187 Posts
Originally Posted by big john
What about a jet?
There are fan blades on the compressor. Just saying...
GlennR is offline  
Likes For GlennR:
Old 09-15-21, 08:38 PM
  #99  
DonkeyShow
Full Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2021
Posts: 333
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 195 Post(s)
Liked 234 Times in 141 Posts
Originally Posted by GlennR
I take safety seriously. Sure hope you keep a straight line or you can get elbowed into the curb when being passed if you wonder
Im a safety first person always. Elbowing people into curbs while riding bikes is suspect at best. Best hope it's not a regular route you ride.
DonkeyShow is offline  
Old 09-15-21, 08:44 PM
  #100  
GlennR
On Your Left
 
GlennR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Long Island, New York, USA
Posts: 8,373

Bikes: Trek Emonda SLR, Sram eTap, Zipp 303

Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3004 Post(s)
Liked 2,433 Times in 1,187 Posts
Originally Posted by DonkeyShow
Im a safety first person always. Elbowing people into curbs while riding bikes is suspect at best. Best hope it's not a regular route you ride.
I wasn't implying it's done on purpose.

I see people, some with headphones on, that don't hold a line and weave. So passing them is a matter of timing and I try to do it safely. But if they weave into me as i pass i'll make sure they don't collide with me.

The problem with headphones is not have to loud to the point they are not aware of their surroundings and don't hear others calling out as they get ready to pass.

I've seen cyclists weave into a passing car and bounce off.
GlennR is offline  
Likes For GlennR:

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.