mattscq

I've been riding Crankbrothers Eggbeaters on a road bike for almost 9 months or so now and they were my first clipless set up. I figured since I would walk quite a bit (being in the city), a cross or mtb shoe would serve me well. I've come to quite like the setup and find it very easy to clip/unclip.

I have however been curious about 3-bold road shoes. My friend has some old Shimano pedals he can lend/give me to try out but I'd need to get some new shoes and cleats. Is this a worthwhile investment? What has been your experience with the two systems? Will I experience substantially better power transfer?

I don't actually walk that far so the initial advantage of XC/MTB shoes for me is kind of moot now.

Also being in the city, I notice a lot of people in regular clothes on road bikes when they commute and they seem to pedal road pedals with sneakers. It doesn't look like the best idea but it does seem like for a quick stop, it's do-able without having to suit up whereas I can't imagine pedaling eggbeaters with anything else.

Ideas?

Steve B.

I rode on Look pedals exclusively for a decade or so. Then and having started using SPD, realized they are just immensely easier to clip in to. Then I realized the Look/SPD-L platform offered a bit more support under the foot as compared to SPD and that I had foot pain with SPD on longer than 25 mile rides, so want back to SPD-L. Then and after a year or two realized that SPD-L was just a real pain to clip into and I missed SPD so returned, only this time wearing shoes with a carbon mid-sole that supports the foot, pain gone.

As well and as this is the gravel forum, many folks who’ve used Look/SPD-L on dirt and gravel generally hate that system in dirt or sketchy conditions and use either flats or SPD or similar and have commented as such.

Metieval

The advantage for me (along with power transfer) is the Noticeable lack of a hot spot with the SPD-SL

However for anything other than Kitted up and fast road riding I have ditched the 3 bolt SPD-SL for just 2 bolt SPD. On that note, there are some seriously stiff 2 bolt shoes, I opt for less stiff shoes for nicer off the bike time.

Is there a difference between power transfer and efficiency? yes... IMO efficiency wins! concentrate on a spinning a circles, less power, drop a gear, and ride faster.

My bicycle that seems to get pedals switched a lot is my SS road bike. If I am on a out n back with no stops I'll put on the 3bolt SPD-SL, for anyride that involves a stop I'll trow on my 2 bolt SPD pedals. my 2 bolt shoes are SHIMANO Men's SH-M089 my 3bolt shoe is the Giro Trans E70

I am tempted to actually go to a Flat pedal on my MTB

Edit by the way that spd 2 bolt hotspot is only on certain pedals.

The m520 etc give hot spots, are harder to clip into
The PD-M530 doesn't give any hotspot and is easier to clip into.

Rides4Beer

The argument is that there's better power transfer, but I've never been able to find data to back this up.

I prefer SPDs for the walkability and ease of clipping in/out, so I use them on both my gravel and road bikes. I've noticed no difference in racing/sprinting. Hot spots seem to be hit or miss, I've had none on either my XT Trails or XTs both with Fizik shoes.

mstateglfr 

Everyone is different, but I can't understand what the upside of a road shoe is for a gravel bike.
Admittedly though, I don't see the upside of a road shoe for a road bike either.

2 bolt mtb shoes can be absurdly stiff, just like a road shoe, and thats the only benefit I have been able to discern for road shoes.

Mtb shoes are convenient to walk in.
Mtb shoes can be as stiff as road shoes.
Mtb pedals can be as light as road pedals.
Mtb pedals like the shimano a530 have the option to clip in or use as platform so you don't have to be goofy and ride road pedals with running shoes.

Some get hot spots from SPD. My wife did, for example, and apparently 2 hours of riding with em is also too much for Steve in this thread.
Conversely, I can ride for hours on end and my feet are fine. My legs may feel like jello, but my feet don't get hot, numb, or hurt.
Its hit/miss.

misthe fravelnrwces I've done over the last 5 years, I would be shocked if 95% of participants who clip in weren't on SPD/mtb shoes and pedals. Basically, everyone I've seen used them- even the absurdly fast roadies who cross into gravel races during the shoulder seasons.


You asked for ideas-
- don't spend $100-200 just to try road shoes on a gravel bike for riding in the city. <--that was a crazy sentence to type.
- try shimano a530 or a600 pedals. One is dual platform and the other is as light as road pedals but SPD. I have a530 pedals on my gravel bike because its what i so often use for family rides of 5-20mi, so I can just use running shoes when it's best.

Digger Goreman

I commute on flat pedals, but maintain good contact by wearing shoes/boots with standard rubber heels.

fourfa

I'm a lifelong roadie, spent a decade on Look, more than that on Speedplay and carbon shoes, then started touring on 2-bolt SPD and walkable MTB shoes. After that I could not find a reason to keep using the road shoes, and lack of walkability became too annoying. Honestly for some it's aesthetic - full kit and matching shoes and the duck walk just screams 'pro' to everyone around you (or maybe not). Here in the CX/gravel sub you likely won't get a lot of Look riders. Ask the same question in the roadie sub and there will be passionate defenders.

If you push 300+W, if you race on tarmac, if you do a lot of heavy sprinting, if your knees like a zero-float locked-in pedal, if you're counting grams (shoe tread is heavy), 3-bolt and carbon road shoe might be for you.

Personally I like low-friction float, 2-sided pedals, and walkability/hikeability above those factors.

BluFalconActual

My 2 bolt Fizik X1 Infinito’s that I use for my gravel bike are every bit as stiff as my carbon soled Giro Empires that I use for my road bike. I still prefer 3 bolt for my road bike because it feels a little more stable laterally, but honestly I could go without road shoes on my road bike and I probably wouldn’t miss them at all.

mattscq

Oddly somehow I realized after I posted this, that this was the gravel forum, but that's ok. I was mostly wondering if there was anything really to be gained by switching pedal types and what the subjective ride/feel differences are.

fourfa

Subjectively, 3-bolt (and the 4-bolt Speedplay pedals I liked most) are very stable in 'wobble' - the tiny 2-bolt cleats (and the small areas where the pedal grabs them) often have enough slop and play that they can wobble around the vertical axis. In my experience it gets worse as the cleats wear out too. 3-bolt cleats are much bigger, with a flat platform under the cleat, and the contact points don't change as much with time and wear. So there's more side-to-side stability against ankle roll.

There are different 3-bolt cleat types that allow more or less rotational float - the tight ones can feel very locked down stiff and rock solid immobile. That can be comforting in power sprints. It can also be hard on knees - mine tend to like a bit of rotation at the cleat through the pedal cycle. The 3-bolt cleats with float still have a lot of friction, so it's like you set the cleat at a certain angle relative to the bike, and it stays there. Every time you clip out and in again, you set the angle where you want it. This is the big difference with traditional Speedplay road pedals, they have a very large float allowance, but extremely low friction. Feels like standing on ice, rotationally, but rock solid in wobble. Speedplay also makes models with adjustable float down to very small amounts, if you don't like the huge amount in their original pedals.

SPDs with brand-new cleats have rotational friction, but after wearing in for a while, have a fairly loose float (enough to be comfortable for me). The wobble can be lessened by using pedals with more platform, all the way up to a large downhill-style MTB cage. The platform interfaces with the tread, and how stiff it is depends on the tread. MTB race shoes tend to have rock hard plastic tread, which isn't great to walk or hike in. Soft tread allows more wobble. Over time I've found the wobble just doesn't matter to me, I just use more ankle muscle for stability. Compare it to hiking: 3-bolt and road race shoes are like a mountaineering boot - nothing moves. SPD is like hiking in trail runners, it's up to you to keep your ankles stable. But you can see why in road racing, you might want the boot.

Some people still like Time pedals, which are stable like a 3-bolt road pedal but with a recessed walkable cleat. I tried them, their front-hinged mechanism would move under load and didn't feel secure, unless the spring tension was raised to absurd levels. I'm a big 200+ lbs guy, your mileage likely varies here. All other pedals have a rear-hinged mechanism (or the wire bail on Speedplay) that can't move under load and feels very connected.

I only tried Eggbeaters briefly, and found too much rotational friction for my taste. So I'm not positive where they are in this.

Hope that helps

Metieval

Personal Experience the wider the pedal just feels more stable. too subjective? yeah... probably. haha

It's like lifting in the gym, The thinner the foot bed the more stable, means more powerful lifts/squats. I Lifted in my Altra Torin shoes before,, it sucks being all wobbly. However, lifting on unstable footing also is beneficial in some ways. Watch some of Kate Courtney's workouts where she balances on a ball and flips a weight.

Rides4Beer

Def agree that SPD-SL "feels" more solid, but in practical application, I haven't noticed any difference in riding. When I'm sprinting on SPDs, I don't feel my feet moving around, but I'm sure there is some movement, which would suggest some level of energy loss. I was actually a little surprised that no one has tested it.

Metieval

I can't put numbers on it but my SS is 50T oval to a 17 freewheel. The hills are much easier with the SPD-SL on the bike. yet if I really want to nitpick my average speeds over all my rides, not a bit of difference.

but I will place everything that counts in the basket of enjoyable. which is probably why I swap pedals a lot on my SS, If its just to go out burn 40 miles and get off when I get back home I put the spd-SL on every time, if I stop for coffee etc, or hit friends houses with gravel lanes, I'll drop the SPD 2 bolts on.