PeteHski

Exactly. Fuelling on the bike never causes weight gain. Eating crap off the bike often does. Fuelling long hard rides to optimise performance actually requires training. As you say 90g of carbs an hour is hard to get down while riding at pace and your gut needs to get used to doing it.

PeteHski

+1
I don't think some of these guys actually do the maths. Here's my stats for a typical 5.5 hour non-stop endurance ride:-

Av Power 201 W
Tot Work 3740 kJ
Calories 3593
Av Speed 31.1 kph
Elevation gain 2300 m

During that ride I consumed maybe 1500 calories and a protein shake at the end. I was about 2kg lighter than when I started despite drinking as much fluid as I could cope with.
In the summer months when I'm regularly doing long rides like this I typically drop 5-6 kg from my winter base weight.

woodcraft

I inferred from your post #81 that you may be trying to replace calories burned while riding.
"I struggle to consume more than about 80-90g carbs per hour (or roughly 500 calories). But I can easily burn more than that."

WhyFi

Say what now? I said that I'm usually in the 2k+ calorie region for rides of 3+ hours. This is based solely off of PM info and not including base rate (~750kj per hour up to 3 hours or so, increasingly lower as the ride duration extends).

genejockey 

You mentioned 5000 calories, but didn't make it clear you meant metabolic + exercise. I made the same inference.

woodcraft

Oh, I was looking at post #96:

"On my days with rides of 3+ hours...5k+ calories consumed."

PeteHski

The longest rides I attempt are around 160k (100 miles) with between 2-4k elevation and there isn't any point in riding those fasted if you want to be remotely competitive. The only fasted riding I do are recovery spins!

WhyFi

​​​​​​
I thought that I was pretty clear - I said a couple thousand on top of my base rate.

PeteHski

I'm not sure how you inferred that when I was saying that it would be virtually impossible to achieve a net calorie balance during a ride. But anyway just for clarity I don't try to replace all calories burned while riding. Not by a long way. I just follow the current advice in how to fuel endurance rides for optimum performance. The Trainer Road Podcast is a great source of info on this topic and it gets discussed a LOT.

genejockey 

I was feeling so inadequate, only burning 2000 calories over the course of 4 hours and 65 miles!

woodcraft

OK, got it. My poor reading comprehension.

IME, even 14 hours DCs only result in eating a bit more the following day, with little weight change beyond some re-hydrating.

WhyFi

You didn't get a PM for any of your bikes yet, did you? Because of that 2k cal based off of the Strava guesstimate or a fitness tracker, it's just a WAG. When I ride my bike without a PM, Strava's calorie estimate is usually conservative vs my kj/hr at typical RPE. My fitbit estimate is WAY conservative until it scrapes PM info from Strava.

WhyFi

If I could churn out 5,000kj in a few hours, I wouldn't be chatting with you Schmoes online.

genejockey 

No, I buy more bikes instead of frippery like power meters.

genejockey 

You'd be in France, eating a 3000 calorie dinner on your rest day.

WhyFi

Messed up priorities, I tells ya! Trade in some (or all!) of those metal bikes for a power meter!

wolfchild

Calorie counting is pointless, I don't understand why people are so obsessed about numbers. You don't need fitness apps, you don't need to count calories to loose weight and maintain healthy weight.

WhyFi

You don't understand that what works for you might not work for others, and vice versa?

genejockey 

Maybe YOU don't, chum, but it's pretty damn presumptuous to assume your experience is universal.

WhyFi

Maybe he's been enough people to have a high degree of certainty.

GhostRider62

I can tell why it is important to me. I ride long distances, up to 1220 km without sleep or rest stop. I need to understand caloric needs for several reasons. One is obvious....so, I do not bonk. The other is so I do not puke or overhydrate, either of which result in a least poor performance. Nothing about losing weight or maintaining health. I think about food much differently than many cyclists.

pgjackson

You ride 1220km without stopping? What?

seypat

VCU Medical Center/Healthcare is the title sponsor of the Richmond Marathon. Every year they put on a nutrition clinic for the training team members. The estimated calorie/electrolytes needs for individuals are based one one's weight and how much of a sweater they are. The heavier the individual, the more fuel they will burn/need. That need increases rapidly as the weight is increased. 3 things are stressed during the training season that must be learned. They are fueling, hydration and pace. You don't learn those 3 you aren't going to have a successful marathon. Once the training runs get to a certain distance/duration, it is recommended you go without fueling until you bonk for the first time. Then you fuel immediately after the bonk and make it to the end of the run. That way, you know what it feels like so you can deal with a bonk. You also will know to start your fueling 10-15 before the bonk so there is no drop off in performance. You hold out as long as you can before the first fueling. Once you start the fueling, you have to continue it on a consistent basis through the duration of the event. The thinking is: You start out with a full tank of fuel at the start and go until you empty the tank. After that, you don't refill the tank. Instead, you only refuel 1/4 tank, empty it again and repeat until you cross the finish line. Your system can only process so many calories per hour. Go over that, and you get gut rot/runner's gut. Been there, done that. Not a pleasant experience.

seypat

To answer the question posed in the thread title, bonking is caused by a depletion in fuel/hydration. If you correct those, the bonk leaves and you go on about your business. "Hitting the wall" is an overall physical/metal fatigue/exhaustion that you have to learn to overcome. You've had all you can take and you just want to quit. You want to lay down on the ground, get into a fetal position, suck your thumb and start screaming for mama! You have to figure out how to keep going. On a marathon, when I get within 6 miles(10k) of the finish, I think I can make it. When I get within 3 miles, I know I can scrape it in from there. On the bike, however I never get those "I think/know I can make it" feelings until I actually cross the finish line. Even if the line is in sight, the doubts are there.

PeteHski

These sort of posts are pointless.