mstateglfr 

The 80s weren't kind to Campy. They did nothing for the MTB boom and their road products weren't exactly cutting edge and often didn't work well(Delta brakes for the loss!). Meanwhile, Shimano outfitted MTB and touring bikes alongside SunTour and Shimano innovated with indexed shifting that worked.

The 90s were no less kind to Campy as OEM presence further diminished. SRAM came onto the scene and further pushed Campy off shop floors since MTBs were still the rage.

The 00s did nothing to make Campy relevant.

The 10s did nothing to make Campy relevant. OEM continued to basically not exist for shop inventory. No mtb, no hybrid, and little marketshare overall. No 1x and super late to the scene for disc brakes. Grand Tour sponsorship dwindled.
They got 12 speeds though. Cool.

And finally Campy goes gravel/adventure in 2020.


Edited to add- they did manage to hide shift cables in Ergo setups many years before Shimano hid theirs. So that's a genuine difference that I think Campy got right.
...but then I remember you need to use that thumb button button and Campy design comes crashing back to earth(yes I recognize some like it and prefer it).

mstateglfr 

Is it though? I've read countless reviews of it and it is praised, just like grx800 and grx600. I've missed all the reviews that declare it to be the best. Heck, I've missed all the reviews that direct showdown it vs other 1x systems and declare a winner. It sounds like car and driver for bikes, so that's probably why I've missed all those style reviews.

cxwrench

Campy would be the last choice for me. SRAM and Shimano are both great. Di2 has it's issues as does SRAM. Anyone that complains about charging a SRAM battery every few weeks is clueless. This very same person most likely remembers to charge their phone every night. They should be able to check their derailleur batteries after every ride. I like the wireless aspect and also being able to swap batteries if I do get clueless. I have seen a lot of Di2 problems that end up requiring a bunch of work because the wires are now usually all internal. I never really have to waste much time figuring out what's wrong w/ an etap bike, obviously I never have to take things apart to reconnect wires that have ended up disconnected.
I'll never understand when someone is asking about opinions concerning Di2 v etap and people post trying to sway the guy to Campy mechanical. Quit trying to convince everyone how great you think your Italian parts are and just ride your bike.

chaadster

cxwrench Campagnolo was brought up in the context of compatibility, specifically with AXS. It was not a Campy fan who first suggested mechanical over electronic groupsets, but rather a Shimano fan saying they’d prefer Shimano mech over AXS. Campy came up after that again, with the point being that, if we’re talking mechanical, Campy 12spd is the better choice in terms of future compatibility with all 12spd groups, including electronic.

Anyway, it’s quite common for folks who don’t know anything about the bike biz to mistake Shimano’s ubiquity in OEM as an indictment of Campagnolo’s quality. Out of sight, out of mind, particularly for Americans; it’s unfortunate.

I think it’s interesting that it’s the SRAM folks in this thread who also appreciate Campagnolo, whereas the Shimano riders seem quite dogmatic. The dangers of groupthink, perhaps?

colnago62

Campy missed the boat on mountain groups and hydraulic discs. Besides the component industry is so small, ‘Industry Leader’ equals so what. The big three all make a good enough product that it really is more about personal choice.

DaveSSS 

It's always amusing to read the misconceptions of folks who apparently have never ventured outside of their LBS that carries no Campy products and apparently spend little time on the internet either. I moved on from 10 speed to 11 speed late in 2008, many years ahead of shimano users. Campy had 12 speed in 2018, but I waited for it to trickle down to the Chorus level in 2019. The Chorus 12 groupset was priced at a very reasonable $1060. My SRAM AXS 12 speed groups work great too, but they are far more expensive. Shimano will probably have Ultegra 12 speed in 2023 - way behind as usual.

Campy is a much smaller company than shimano, but they are still an industry leader. The only offer road bike products. The new Ekar 13 speed gravel group still uses mostly road oriented products, for drop bar bikes and it's strictly 1X.

Those making such ignorant comments should explore the Campy website - campagnolo.com. They have reduced their low level road groups to only one and they don't sell MTB products. Campagnolo/Fulcrum also make great wheels at reasonable prices, that will work with Campy, Shimano or SRAM drivetrains. I chose the Fulcrum racing 3 DB wheelset, tubeless ready with no rim tape required, for my SRAM AXS bikes. Great wheelsets for about $500.

colnago62

Industry Leader is a marketing term that companies define to their advantage. Here are some facts; Campy makes some products that work very well for their intended use. Shimano makes some products that work well for their intended use. SRAM makes some products that work well for their intended use. All three companies have had products that haven’t worked so well. Pick one, put the stuff on your bike and ride.

chaadster

Within the context of the OP, the point that DaveSSS has been making is that you don’t need to “pick one,” as you say, if going AXS rather than Di2, because of AXS’s 12spd compatibility.

I mean, we don’t know what Shimano 12spd would look like in terms of backward compatibility because they don’t have 12spd yet, so what, if any, sense it makes to get into 11spd Di2 at this point rather than 12spd AXS is exactly what the OP was asking.

colnago62

Put whatever on your bike and ride it. Worry less about whether someone agrees with your choice.

Rumor is Shimano 12 speed could possibly be introduced in the next two weeks or so.
Shimano 12 speed will not compatible with 11 speed equipment. Shimano has applied for patents and the documents show that it will be a semi wireless system.

chaadster

Okay, now you’re understanding the point DaveSSS has been making: going with AXS rather than Di2 makes more sense from a future compatibility standpoint. Whether that’s a significant factor to the OP, only the OP can say.

I don’t know for a fact that the patents prove 12spd Di2 will be incompatible with 11spd— I haven’t looked at it— but it seems to me that derailleur firmware controls the movement, so it would appear do-able. I guess chain handling is a wildcard, but Rotor got to 13spd with a 12spd chain...

colnago62

Unless you dont want to ride AXS and then it makes no sense. Never mind that isnt even what we were talking about. The idea that any of the top hree manufacturers’ product is better than the other is just not true.
It is a fact, you just haven’t looked into it. New Shimano 12 speed is going to be semi wireless or wireless.

chaadster

I think you’ve confused the discussion, but we certainly agree that the big three are equally good.

colnago62

Which has been my point; There really is no Industry Leader. Each has something they do better than the other two, but overall, all of them create very good products for the right person.

Dancing Skeleton

This'll never be settled.
Go with which one has the style of shifting that you like better.
Weight used to be a consideration, but 12-speed Sram eTap has fattened up a bit.

Personally, I like eTap (Red22, I don't have AXS) & DoubleTap over Shimano's shifting, but I've got Ultegra on my gravel bike.

eTap is very easy to set up, follow Sram's video, and it takes under 30 minutes the first time, less than half that if you try it again.

chaadster

I don’t know where the confusion arose that you think anyone was talking about one, singular industry leader, but that is not what I was saying. For Campagnolo to be an industry leader is not to the exclusion of all others, hence my acceptance of the phrase, “big three.”

Campagnolo, SRAM and Shimano are industry leaders, and any one of them is an industry leader.

I don’t think anyone would argue that companies like SunRace, S-Ride, or MicroShift, all of which are in the derailleur industry, are industry leaders. I wouldn’t consider either TRP or FSA as leaders, although a case could be made for their inclusion, and probably Rotor could be reasonably considered a leader, too, what with their innovation in hydraulics.

Of course, what defines “industry leader” is open for discussion and can be viewed in various ways, but no serious definition of the term can exclude any of the big three, but yet that’s exactly the position we saw staked out upthread, prompting this rather silly discussion.

Dean V

Aside from Campagnolo not being mentioned by the OP he was deciding between two electronic group sets so it is getting a bit left field even by BF standards.

colnago62

Made even more silly by this explanation.