6 vs 7 speed why people upgrade?
05-26-21, 05:30 PM
#51
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My experience is similar to thook's. I had my rear DO spacing changed to 126 mm (from 120) to fit 125 mm Campy hubs. A Shimano 7-speed freewheel fits fine. I have heard that there sometimes are problems with the smallest cog and chainstay wanting to be in the same space, so it will probably work for you but might not.
05-26-21, 05:32 PM
#52
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05-26-21, 09:09 PM
#53
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It may not. I often find 6-speed hub spacing requires an additional 1-2mm for the Sunrace 7-speeds. As long as you have an additional spacer, the axle is long enough and you can redish the wheel properly, this usually isn't a problem.
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05-26-21, 09:18 PM
#54
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Anything requiring re-dishing a wheels is not what I'd call 'fit'. I guess I'll stick with my aged 6-speed Uniglide freewheel.
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05-26-21, 09:25 PM
#55
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he did go from a 6spd suntour to a 7spd sunrace, BUT he also swapped wheelsets...haha. oh well. i don't use any sunrace freewheels. all i have are shimano and suntour
Last edited by thook; 05-26-21 at 09:31 PM.
05-27-21, 05:29 AM
#56
Zip tie Karen
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I have skimmed every post. Any each poster missed the obvious reason to go to 7-speeds versus 6 speeds. Shifters. Unless you are happy using friction shifters, it's getting harder and harder to find indexed 6-speed shifters. That is, unless you have a well-stocked coop nearby with bins of discarded shifters. That's where you might find some 6-speed stuff. Maybe.
I just replaced a set of Shimano 6-speed indexed downtube shifters for a customer. We had to go from nice Shimano 600 stuff (the inner notched plate failed) to cheaper Light Action 452 shifters. That set cost $40, cheapest I could find on eBay.
7-speed shifters are plentiful, whether for flat-bar with v-brake, or drop bar STI equivalent or twist grip. That's why. If you want inexpensive indexing on the rear, and you lack the compatible parts (starting from scratch build), then 7-speed is the way to go.
I just replaced a set of Shimano 6-speed indexed downtube shifters for a customer. We had to go from nice Shimano 600 stuff (the inner notched plate failed) to cheaper Light Action 452 shifters. That set cost $40, cheapest I could find on eBay.
7-speed shifters are plentiful, whether for flat-bar with v-brake, or drop bar STI equivalent or twist grip. That's why. If you want inexpensive indexing on the rear, and you lack the compatible parts (starting from scratch build), then 7-speed is the way to go.
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05-27-21, 06:07 AM
#57
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05-27-21, 08:58 AM
#58
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I stopped paying attention to bikes in 1974 (the instant I got a drivers license) and started again 20 years later. Like Rip van Winkle, I fell asleep in an era of 5 speed, downtube shifters, suicide levers, and dodgy brakes and woke up in the era of 8 speeds, STIs, and dual pivots.
And yet now I find myself working backwards from 10 speed STIs to 8 speed indexed DT to 7 speed, and now to 6 speed friction shifting. I must be nuts.
And yet now I find myself working backwards from 10 speed STIs to 8 speed indexed DT to 7 speed, and now to 6 speed friction shifting. I must be nuts.
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05-27-21, 10:56 AM
#59
Clark W. Griswold
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let's distinguish between tier level and quality, okay? just because a parts group is not marketed as the higher group status doesn't automatically exclude quality. i've had altus and alivio parts last as long and work as well as upper tier groups. quality does trickle down, in some cases. and, in some cases, the only thing really distinguishing or separating the groups is weight and finish...eg. flat/hex head fasteners vs allen head. tourney? i may concede to that, but otoh plenty of folks seem perfectly satisfied to their needs. perhaps this where our friend PimpMan has an axe to grind with marketing? i can relate to him because in many way he's absolutely right. "upgraditus" is condition we fanatics can get sucked into. i've done much better over the years. still a bit of a snob, though....lol. i actually hold respect for individuals who proudly and successfully run bottom end parts not giving a rat's ars. take commuters; they buy the most affordable stuff and run that sh** into the ground.
i don't know anyone who'd argue the freehubs/cassettes have an advantage. years of freewheel use by those who run them only proves their validity and quality though, like anything, they have limits.
i don't know anyone who'd argue the freehubs/cassettes have an advantage. years of freewheel use by those who run them only proves their validity and quality though, like anything, they have limits.
Allen is hex just a brand name for hex tools. Just like Xerox and photocopy.
05-27-21, 10:58 AM
#60
Clark W. Griswold
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Their original stuff had some issues but the newer stuff is fine. I have been running them for years but none of mine were first gen.
05-27-21, 11:45 AM
#61
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Sure but Tourney is tourney is tourney. It is not of quality, we know that we can say we don't or claim it is great stuff. It is the bottom end of the garbage pile, it is cheaply made with cheap materials and doesn't last well. Yes there is a small amount of trickle down but not to the level that modern 2021 tourney will be better than say 30 year old 600 it will be maybe better than 30 year old tourney.
Allen is hex just a brand name for hex tools. Just like Xerox and photocopy.
Allen is hex just a brand name for hex tools. Just like Xerox and photocopy.
i conceded on tourney, didn't i? anyway, it doesn't matter. tourney has it's place. i'm sure pimpman is just happy to have something he can afford and ride for a while
Last edited by thook; 05-27-21 at 12:59 PM.
05-27-21, 04:29 PM
#62
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05-27-21, 05:36 PM
#63
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05-27-21, 05:40 PM
#64
Senior Member
Honestly, other than needing to re-center your brakes, you could just add the 2mm and ride it as-is with the slightly offset wheel. You won’t
notice it.
05-27-21, 09:15 PM
#65
Clark W. Griswold
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it's not just a brand name, dude. allen is a hex shape, but it's not the same as what's called hex head. you'll need a different tool for either. google in "hex head bolt" and "allen head bolt" and you'll get different results.
i conceded on tourney, didn't i? anyway, it doesn't matter. tourney has it's place. i'm sure pimpman is just happy to have something he can afford and ride for a while
i conceded on tourney, didn't i? anyway, it doesn't matter. tourney has it's place. i'm sure pimpman is just happy to have something he can afford and ride for a while
I don't know that you could easily recycle derailleurs but if possible and more ecologically sound then yes they have a good place. Shimano could easily make low cost derailleurs that are a touch higher quality and not just slap their name on something. However they choose not to and instead will put their logo on anything that can even sort of shift at least for a bit.
05-27-21, 09:32 PM
#66
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I get ya now on that. I was reading it wrong. Allen is a brand though like Xerox, the bolts are sometimes called Allen head or more typically socket cap or hex cap or hex socket.
I don't know that you could easily recycle derailleurs but if possible and more ecologically sound then yes they have a good place. Shimano could easily make low cost derailleurs that are a touch higher quality and not just slap their name on something. However they choose not to and instead will put their logo on anything that can even sort of shift at least for a bit.
I don't know that you could easily recycle derailleurs but if possible and more ecologically sound then yes they have a good place. Shimano could easily make low cost derailleurs that are a touch higher quality and not just slap their name on something. However they choose not to and instead will put their logo on anything that can even sort of shift at least for a bit.
shimano could do that. and, they do; altus, alivio, and what's that other one? oh, acera. (i have no idea on road groups. all my road group experiences are suntour early/mid eighties). yeah, i get what you're saying, though. and, i suppose it's best to be honest with people posting about the reputation of equipment. but, to more or less just say,"hey, that's a piece of garbage (ie. bottom of the barrel)"? it's rather discouraging in several ways. personally, i try to encourage people... if i'm not feeling too salty
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05-27-21, 10:02 PM
#67
Clark W. Griswold
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lol....not much point in going back and forth on this. i guarantee, though, if you worked in a shop for a bit, Allen head would be the identifying term used.
shimano could do that. and, they do; altus, alivio, and what's that other one? oh, acera. (i have no idea on road groups. all my road group experiences are suntour early/mid eighties). yeah, i get what you're saying, though. and, i suppose it's best to be honest with people posting about the reputation of equipment. but, to more or less just say,"hey, that's a piece of garbage (ie. bottom of the barrel)"? it's rather discouraging in several ways. personally, i try to encourage people... if i'm not feeling too salty
shimano could do that. and, they do; altus, alivio, and what's that other one? oh, acera. (i have no idea on road groups. all my road group experiences are suntour early/mid eighties). yeah, i get what you're saying, though. and, i suppose it's best to be honest with people posting about the reputation of equipment. but, to more or less just say,"hey, that's a piece of garbage (ie. bottom of the barrel)"? it's rather discouraging in several ways. personally, i try to encourage people... if i'm not feeling too salty
Alivio is fine Tiagra is fine, that could be the low end of the spectrum or maybe one lower and everything would be fine, just fine, how are you? (Sorry it was a Solo joke this time don't want to Star t any Wars)
Salt is an important part of the human diet. One must al
05-27-21, 10:11 PM
#68
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i don't know how to use a shift key, so i won't be capitalizing 
05-27-21, 11:53 PM
#69
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So what was the point of starting this thread if you think it's all marketing and you don't care whether your ride 6 or 7 speeds anyway?
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05-31-21, 03:03 PM
#70
Newbie
fewer cogs
The question is relevant to me 6 or 7 speed, I'm still riding a mid 80s 6 speed helicomatic, original cluster, and can only see wear on the middle cogs where it seems to be more a function of the wear induced by changing gears(wear to the sides of the cogs rather than in the ramps) , whereas I do most of my miles in the top two gears and they look brand new. Sure, Id like to be in the optimum cadence more often but just treat it as some exercise variation when I'm between ratios........big picture, unless a few seconds/minutes per ride is a big deal, 10 or so useable ratios is "infinitely" better than a single speed.
06-01-21, 02:22 PM
#71
Junior Member
I upgraded from 6 to 7 speed. Reason was simple - much more choice of 7 speed shifters, and at a pinch you can use 8 speed shifters on a 7 speed freewheel (spacing is only a tiny bit different) whereas this doesnt work with 6 speed. Why not go with 8 speed freewheel I hear you ask? 8 speed freewheels snap axles and often need more space than the old 6 speed wheel has available.
So I guess if I want to go above 7 speed I'll need to move into the 21st century and pick up some modern wheels.
So I guess if I want to go above 7 speed I'll need to move into the 21st century and pick up some modern wheels.
06-01-21, 04:29 PM
#72
Senior Member
I dont know the answer to this, but just a few observations, Ive never seen a fixed speed(on older commuter bikes that see zero maintenance) wear out the chainwheel or rear cog despite being used for "centuries". I appreciate that could be because they don't get ridden the same distances as serious "fitness" cyclists.
