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tour de france 2021-straight...no fantasy chaser

Old 06-28-21, 04:50 PM
  #51  
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All other aspects aside, I thought it was pretty remarkable to see MVDP in yellow, doing leadout for his teammate.
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Old 06-28-21, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric F View Post
Merlier did exactly what was expected - took the short line inside his teammate. It's pretty standard practice that the leadout rider continues to go flat-out until he gets passed by his sprinter on one side or another. Ewen put his front wheel in jeopardy in his battle to get the advantage on Sagan, and had no place to go when Merlier made his move to go around the leadout. I doubt anyone beats Ewan if he stays upright, but he cost himself the chance to win today. Unfortunately, it also cost Sagan chance, and the rest of Ewan's Tour.
I agree with all of that. Just hadn't heard that Merlier's wheel was involved at all when it happened, but on the overhead it is pretty obvious that it either touched or was close enough that Ewan spilled trying to avoid it.
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Old 06-28-21, 05:13 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by canam73 View Post
I agree with all of that. Just hadn't heard that Merlier's wheel was involved at all when it happened, but on the overhead it is pretty obvious that it either touched or was close enough that Ewan spilled trying to avoid it.
It had to be a wheel touch. There's no other way that Ewan's front wheel would have kicked to the left so hard.
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Old 06-28-21, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by canam73 View Post
I agree with all of that. Just hadn't heard that Merlier's wheel was involved at all when it happened, but on the overhead it is pretty obvious that it either touched or was close enough that Ewan spilled trying to avoid it.
It's not clear if they actually touched, but Ewan definitely got trapped because of the overlap when Merlier moved. Totally Ewan's mistake, IMO.
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Old 06-29-21, 12:44 AM
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that stage three pick of ewan worked out well...it's after (business) hours. let's double down, cautiously/hopefully avoid the kod (kiss of death) and go with démare for the stage four dubya.

thinking that was more of a scylla attack on ewan vs a charybdis maelstrom. same end result tho.

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Old 06-29-21, 03:40 AM
  #56  
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^^ On Ewan, Horner thinks he was miss placed on the inside, with that curve approaching there was no where to go and he had to dangerously overlap merlier's wheel. Grand tours are brutal affairs.

I agree on Demare for stage four, the French aren't fooling around this year. I'm also thinking Gaudu is making a real GC challenge.

Seems like there's a bit of anger over yesterdays route?
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Old 06-29-21, 07:03 AM
  #57  
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I'm late to the party this morning. I missed the Go Slow event. https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tou...stage-3-route/

That was a wacky thing with Merlier and Ewan. A move across the road like that by Merlier in the final 200m of a straight sprint would have relegated him for sure. He changed his line and took Ewan out.

I was thinking that rule would have impact, but there hasn't been a peep about it. I guess the turn in the final 160m (great idea!) and acceptable outside-inside path took precedence.

As for Colbrelli, from what I understand, Roglic was passing and hooked handlebars with him. I think his hand wave was one of righteous indignation rather than innocence. Though watching the event with Mrs. Slcbob, she said it was him protesting being on one of the early drafts of my VG team.
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Old 06-29-21, 08:31 AM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by slcbob View Post
I'm late to the party this morning. I missed the Go Slow event. https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tou...stage-3-route/

That was a wacky thing with Merlier and Ewan. A move across the road like that by Merlier in the final 200m of a straight sprint would have relegated him for sure. He changed his line and took Ewan out.

I was thinking that rule would have impact, but there hasn't been a peep about it. I guess the turn in the final 160m (great idea!) and acceptable outside-inside path took precedence.


As for Colbrelli, from what I understand, Roglic was passing and hooked handlebars with him. I think his hand wave was one of righteous indignation rather than innocence. Though watching the event with Mrs. Slcbob, she said it was him protesting being on one of the early drafts of my VG team.
It wasn't a straight sprint. Merlier and his iead out, Phiipsen, were going into the corner of the right hand turn. Totally legit. As pointed out by Horner nobody in the front of a sprint would have approached that corner with any other line.
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Old 06-29-21, 08:46 AM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
It wasn't a straight sprint. Merlier and his iead out, Phiipsen, were going into the corner of the right hand turn. Totally legit. As pointed out by Horner nobody in the front of a sprint would have approached that corner with any other line.
Aye. Hence the subjunctive.

I'm juggling the USAC and UCI rules and the proposals (CPA, et al?) and my gaps of understanding of theory and practice. Bottom line: that's bike racing.

P.S. the UCI "hold your line" rule isn't for a straight sprint. It's for a sprint.
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Old 06-29-21, 09:00 AM
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When I posted about this earlier, I didn't realize that they were coming into a right hand turn. There's no way Ewan could have reasonably thought that he could pass the Fenix guys on the inside corner of a turn. Nobody who's ever seen or raced a crit would think that. The best he could have hoped for was to take Merlier's wheel and pass as they came out of the turn. The wheel touch is totally Ewan's misjudgment. "Hold your line" has nothing to do with it.

Edit: Also, this might make your geometry teacher cry, but the "line" in "hold your line" does not mean go straight. A bike racer's line can be a curve, and in fact, it is a curve going through a turn.

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Old 06-29-21, 09:08 AM
  #61  
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Cav!

When he took those intermediate sprint points I thought he was looking good and thought how cool it would be if he could get another great lead out at the end.

Crashes aside, there has been some compelling racing so far.
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Old 06-29-21, 09:40 AM
  #62  
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Yay for the old guy!!
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Old 06-29-21, 10:32 PM
  #63  
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let's go with the beat-up and downtrodden roglic to gain back some lost time vs some rivals and to put others farther back with a win on stage five.
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Old 06-29-21, 10:47 PM
  #64  
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Originally Posted by ooga-booga View Post
let's go with the beat-up and downtrodden roglic to gain back some lost time vs some rivals and to put others farther back with a win on stage five.
ITT are so dull to watch, but so important.
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Old 06-29-21, 11:34 PM
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Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
ITT are so dull to watch, but so important.
mostly agreed. the last stage tt's in last year's giro and tour were the recent exceptions.

haven't seen a ttt in quite some time...anyone? last grand tour team time trial? *edit...looks like 2019 tdf*

would you rather have one long (40km+) tt or two shorter ones? or maybe a flattish one of 20km or less
combined with an uphill/mountain tt of 10 km or less. they've done the prologues of just a few km's which
seem to have to fallen into disfavor recently. what about an uphill tt on a banging climb of 3-4 kms?

Last edited by ooga-booga; 06-29-21 at 11:43 PM.
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Old 06-30-21, 03:38 AM
  #66  
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I am not opposed to uphill TTs but I almost don't count them as filling the role of TTs. There is already vertical aplenty in a GT (except perhaps this one). IMHO the TT is supposed to test out another dimension of the all-around rider and/or throw a bone to another type of rider. Lumpy and technical OK.

This one is lumpier than it looked to me at first glance so a bit more of a tilt to Pogacar. I'm not sure I buy the Ahlaphilippe / WVA predictions but we'll see. Stealth Kelderman near but not at the top of GC at the end of the day and we'll still not be talking about him.

There's going to be a whole lot of hurt for G and Roglic. Both of whom would normally be challenging for the stage but I don't expect to see either in the top 10 today.
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Old 06-30-21, 04:33 AM
  #67  
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So crazy that Cav won stage four! Stage five I'll be interested to see if Geraint goes well. I listen to the tour with headphones while working so the TTs are nice in that you get some commentary on every rider as they leave the block. I had picked Küng over Bisseger for the TT win here.

I was thinking about stage three and how once again they should've extended the 3km timing to 6k or 10k. I think it will lead to more exciting racing. You'll have only motivated sprint teams pulling at the front, instead of all the GC teams as well. More chance for a successful breakaway like the scenario yesterday. I haven't seen a team so aggressive in placing riders to snub the chase like Lotto did.
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Old 06-30-21, 06:13 AM
  #68  
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I must be weird, but I really like watching the TTs.
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Old 06-30-21, 10:18 AM
  #69  
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Originally Posted by slcbob View Post
This one is lumpier than it looked to me at first glance so a bit more of a tilt to Pogacar. I'm not sure I buy the Ahlaphilippe / WVA predictions but we'll see. Stealth Kelderman near but not at the top of GC at the end of the day and we'll still not be talking about him.

There's going to be a whole lot of hurt for G and Roglic. Both of whom would normally be challenging for the stage but I don't expect to see either in the top 10 today.
Spot on with Pogacar's performance and WvA/Alaphilippe hype deflation. The commentators said there were issues with his radio, but that didn't seem to throw him off at all. He's making a habit out of jaw-dropping TdF ITTs. The only superlatives that fit his rides ("incredible," "unbelievable," "otherworldly") can equally be taken at face value or not. He's clearly on a different level.

Think Roglic and Thomas are satisfied with their times given all their damage? Having the podium still possible is about as good as anyone other than Pogacar can hope for if nothing disastrous happens to any of the GC contenders. They both did better than what most were expecting.
​​​​​
So much for the "Carapaz isn't as bad at time trialing" hope to have a legit threat to Pogacar. At least he wasn't as bad as Keldermann, who I'm relieved to not have given serious chances to in the other thread although I whiffed on every other Stage 5 prognostication.

I think ITTs in most stage races are boring, but with serious GC implications in the mix due to the type of contenders (i.e., many who aren't pure climbers) they can be quite the opposite like at this year's TdF. Especially when more conservative team tactics take the fireworks out of many mountainous stages.
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Old 06-30-21, 11:36 AM
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What happened to McNulty? Dead last. Did he crash?
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Old 06-30-21, 11:43 AM
  #71  
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Originally Posted by surak View Post
Spot on with Pogacar's performance and WvA/Alaphilippe hype deflation. The commentators said there were issues with his radio, but that didn't seem to throw him off at all. He's making a habit out of jaw-dropping TdF ITTs. The only superlatives that fit his rides ("incredible," "unbelievable," "otherworldly") can equally be taken at face value or not. He's clearly on a different level.

Think Roglic and Thomas are satisfied with their times given all their damage? Having the podium still possible is about as good as anyone other than Pogacar can hope for if nothing disastrous happens to any of the GC contenders. They both did better than what most were expecting.
​​​​​
So much for the "Carapaz isn't as bad at time trialing" hope to have a legit threat to Pogacar. At least he wasn't as bad as Keldermann, who I'm relieved to not have given serious chances to in the other thread although I whiffed on every other Stage 5 prognostication.

I think ITTs in most stage races are boring, but with serious GC implications in the mix due to the type of contenders (i.e., many who aren't pure climbers) they can be quite the opposite like at this year's TdF. Especially when more conservative team tactics take the fireworks out of many mountainous stages.
When Roglic finished, I thought he had done a very good ride. I think he should have been quite happy with it and it doesn't look like his injury is affecting him.
The Pogacar happened. Beating Kung by 19 seconds is incredible. He looks virtually invincible.
Turns out MVDP is also pretty good at time trials. Nice to see him stay in yellow, and I'm sure TP is fine with that since he isn't a GC threat.
One nice thing, Ineos isn't going to be able to just ride tempo up the climbs. We're going to see lots of attacks coming up.
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Old 06-30-21, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
What happened to McNulty? Dead last. Did he crash?
Had to do a bike change early on. At the time, no one was sure why. Looks like he did crash, but I haven't seen footage of it.
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Old 06-30-21, 11:54 AM
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Originally Posted by OBoile View Post
The Pogacar happened. Beating Kung by 19 seconds is incredible. He looks virtually invincible.
Unlike last year, he mentioned in an interview yesterday that he hadn't even reconned today's stage much or spend much time on the TT bike leading up to it (both reasons UAE gave out last year to explain his seemingly out of nowhere shocking performance). Coupled with the radio malfunction, just madness that he can destroy the competition at will, almost entirely on feel alone if he either didn't ride with a powermeter or look at his numbers, which he didn't last year.

And once again, he didn't look that tired after crossing the finish line.
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Old 06-30-21, 12:18 PM
  #74  
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Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
What happened to McNulty? Dead last. Did he crash?
I read that he 'crashed hard' somewhere likely because of wet roads from a rain shower.
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Old 06-30-21, 04:16 PM
  #75  
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Originally Posted by surak View Post
Unlike last year, he mentioned in an interview yesterday that he hadn't even reconned today's stage much or spend much time on the TT bike leading up to it (both reasons UAE gave out last year to explain his seemingly out of nowhere shocking performance). Coupled with the radio malfunction, just madness that he can destroy the competition at will, almost entirely on feel alone if he either didn't ride with a powermeter or look at his numbers, which he didn't last year.

And once again, he didn't look that tired after crossing the finish line.
Hmmm, when have we seen this type of thing before? When performances defy belief, it is time to squint and be very skeptical.
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