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Severe Heat and Fatigue

Old 07-08-21, 09:29 AM
  #26  
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+1 on Nuun Sport Electrolytes.

Rode 56miles on Saturday. Came home and drank 5qt bottles of water, 4 of which had Nuun in them
This was in addition to 3 regular bike bottles I drank while on the bike.
Rode again Sunday and Monday.

Those electrolytes will kick, in under an hour.

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Old 07-08-21, 09:31 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by scottfsmith
  • Pick routes with more shade and more valleys. Shade is at least 10F cooler than the sun, often more
In a drive-on-the-right country, ideally ride north in the morning and south late afternoon, to get the benefit of shade from trees to the side. Also consider sun in eyes on east/west routes.

Alas I'm at the north end of my best distance route.
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Old 07-08-21, 09:33 AM
  #28  
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Lots of good tips here, I'll just add that replacing electrolytes is no joke--I've had two friends end up in the hospital with hypernatremia. Highly simplified explanation is that at a certain point straight water ends up flushing right through you and your cells can't replace the minerals they need.

Also I was always taught that people with prior heat injuries are more susceptible. During field exercises in the Army during hot weather we had to tie white ribbons around the arms of people who had prior heat injuries just in case something happened and the medics needed to know.
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Old 07-08-21, 09:33 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Rdmonster69
I know it was humid as all get out on Monday. Typical central Indiana summer. It rained for about three days straight and the humidity was off the scale Monday....felt like riding through soup.
I rode across the country during the horrible summer of '99. Stayed in Fletcher Lake, Huntington and Monroeville plus one other place I cannot remember. It was God awful hot and humid. The forecast low in Fletcher Lake was 85. Hit 106 in Huntington. Got a motel room. A couple of mornings a few of us started riding while it was still dark to get as many miles in before the sun burned off the dense fog. Ten minutes on the bike and you felt like you were wearing a wet diaper. Heat finally broke the morning we left Monroeville (where we got to sleep in a air-conditioned community center) and entered Ohio.
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Old 07-08-21, 09:36 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by coffeesnob
For me...moisture wicking clothing makes me hotter and more uncomfortable overall than a pure cotton tee shirt.
For many years I rode in old cotton, long-sleeve button-down shirts with the collars turned up. They hold a lot of moisture, but my current set-up works a little better for me.
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Old 07-08-21, 09:40 AM
  #31  
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[QUOTE=ksryder;22133354

Also I was always taught that people with prior heat injuries are more susceptible. [/QUOTE]

This is true. I have always been pretty cautious in the heat but it really snuck up on me this time. It was not stifling until I turned around and headed home. I stopped with about 18 miles left, chugged some water and ate a Kind bar. Felt draggy then but wasn't really concerned until I finished and esp. later that evening after I had hydrated even more and eaten and should have been recovered.
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Old 07-08-21, 09:44 AM
  #32  
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Everyone's physiology is different. Keep drinking constantly. Your body needs a steady supply of water. Treat your body like a leaky car radiator. Unless you keep putting water back in, the engine will seize; but, before it seizes it starts to not function correctly.

Me? On long rides, like a ~50+ over rolling hills in the heat of the Southeast, I rely primarily on water and solid food (banana, energy bar, etc).

But it depends. If I think the ride will really drain the water from me (humidity over 80%), I'll carry 2 or 3 small packets of Gatorade in my jersey to mix with water on the ride. I take stock about 25 miles in. I know my body's requirements by now and start fueling BEFORE I need to. That way I generally avoid the ups and downs.
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Old 07-08-21, 10:02 AM
  #33  
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Drinking constantly might not be a good idea. Taking supplemental electrolytes might be a good idea. I never use electrolyes because I don't need them.

https://www.outsideonline.com/190080...durance-sports

https://www.leadvilleraceseries.com/...uch-is-enough/
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Old 07-08-21, 11:07 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by GhostRider62
Drinking constantly might not be a good idea. Taking supplemental electrolytes might be a good idea. I never use electrolyes because I don't need them.

https://www.outsideonline.com/190080...durance-sports

https://www.leadvilleraceseries.com/...uch-is-enough/
This is good information and reminds me to clarify what I wrote above: While there is no doubt and lots of literature support for the idea that sodium replacement enhances performance in long events and prevents heat-related illness, over-drinking of anything, whether or not it contains sodium, can lead to hyponatremia.
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Old 07-08-21, 11:32 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by ksryder
Lots of good tips here, I'll just add that replacing electrolytes is no joke--I've had two friends end up in the hospital with hypernatremia.
Actually, it's called hyponatremia -- hypo: low, natremia: sodium in the blood.

I got it once after Climb to Kaiser on a record hot day. It felt like the worst flu ever: headache, vomiting, unable to stand, unable even to hold my head up. Putting salt on my tongue was the fix (couldn't drink anything without vomiting).
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Old 07-08-21, 12:21 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse
Actually, it's called hyponatremia -- hypo: low, natremia: sodium in the blood.

I got it once after Climb to Kaiser on a record hot day. It felt like the worst flu ever: headache, vomiting, unable to stand, unable even to hold my head up. Putting salt on my tongue was the fix (couldn't drink anything without vomiting).
Good catch, I always have to google it for the spelling and I still got it wrong.

I've been fortunate to avoid heat injuries but for several years I participated in a well-known 200-mile gravel race and it took a lot of trial and error to dial in my hydration strategy for those >90 degree high humidity days in June in Kansas. Basically a combination of Skratch in my bottles and water in my hydration pack. (Or was it the other way around? I can't remember now.) I have to dilute the Skratch more than they recommend though because when it's hot and you're exhausted, sugar is not appealing.
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Old 07-08-21, 12:30 PM
  #37  
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What I can contribute:

-some folks need more salt/electrolyte than others, so the Nuun tablet or table salt in your drink mix can help

-sure, starting really early can help

-I tried this year to "heat adapt" as warmer weather rolled in on purpose. I didn't avoid it. Started easy with just a lunch hour spin as the lunch hour temps crept up over a month. Then increased time. Still mowed grass or went out to do outdoor chores when hotter. It seemed to help. You always hear about American football teams that play in the deep south or far north having "trouble" playing as well at away games in the opposite situations. Same for riding the bike.
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Old 07-08-21, 12:46 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by burnthesheep
-some folks need more salt/electrolyte than others
Questionable to what degree.

Volume of fluid intake would be the main determination. If it's limited, water is fine. Beyond a certain rate plain water is bad news.

so the Nuun tablet or table salt in your drink mix can help
​​​​​​Yes, but these are not interchangeable.

Table salt, potato chips etc are just sodium chloride. Nuun has sodium, but even more potassium. Both are ultimately needed because they play complementary roles.

Eating a bag of chips can help, because sodium is the first one you miss. But I wouldn't ride all day sweating buckets of water in the heat with only junk food sodium and no replacement potassium.

When I'd spike gatorade powder to avoid buying nuun tablets, I used both table salt and the completely different and mildly offensive tasting potassium chloride salt replacement, each carefully weighed out and tipped into the bottle portions.

Nuun of course then goes on to market you all sorts of other additives, my personal decision for me was I could probably live without those as long as I was getting the sodium, potassium, and sugar.

If you didnt pack it from home, potassium turns out to be hard to find in a convenience store. Bananas, some fruit chips, maybe the odd dehydration packet sold as a hangover remedy. Sport drinks seem to get the sodium potassium balance wrong, probably so they taste better. Ensure shakes have around twice as much potassium as sodium which would nicely offset gatorade or junk food, but the rest of a six pack is a bit much to ride off with, so short of a group or emergency they're a buy before and bring one or two thing.

Last edited by UniChris; 07-08-21 at 12:58 PM.
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Old 07-08-21, 12:47 PM
  #39  
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Did anyone mention weighing yourself before and after a ride?
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Old 07-08-21, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by genejockey
Did anyone mention weighing yourself before and after a ride?
The link arguing runners were over hydrating (vs only failing to maintain electrolyte balance) made me think one could do a study with scales at the pit stops.
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Old 07-08-21, 01:12 PM
  #41  
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Did anyone mention weighing yourself before and after a ride?
I do. Depending on the ride length, temperature, etc, I lose anywhere from one to 2 and sometimes 3 lbs. On my 20 mile loop I lose about 2 lbs during the summer months.
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Old 07-08-21, 01:13 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by UniChris
The link arguing runners were over hydrating (vs only failing to maintain electrolyte balance) made me think one could do a study with scales at the pit stops.
Here's a classic which addresses that question: https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJ...bi.nlm.nih.gov

and a review which puts it in context: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1872071/
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Old 07-08-21, 01:23 PM
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Their interpretation that fluid composition doesn't matter is interesting.

However I also note that they're using 3 liters and 4 hours as problem likelyhood thresholds; they're looking at marathons.


Thats the range where I used to be able to get away with water; it's things like 6 liters and 8 hours or 9 liters and 12 where it really starts to matter to me.

I don't start a ride with electrolytes in one bottle unless I'm planning to refill both during it. What a bunch of us keyed on with alarm was the report of five bottles of water.

Last edited by UniChris; 07-08-21 at 01:28 PM.
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Old 07-08-21, 01:31 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by genejockey
Did anyone mention weighing yourself before and after a ride?
I weighed 187 before my 59 miler. I weighed 183 after. : /

Not sure what that means as I usually lose a bit when I ride but that seemed more than normal.
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Old 07-08-21, 01:32 PM
  #45  
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You didn’t mention your age. When I was 18 I could ride all over the San Ramon valley with just a bottle and the occasional refill from a rural house. Or even better when I had the mom spray me off all over with the hose on Blackhawk rd. Now Old Blackhawk road.

But those days are gone. All those nice people are now hiding behind the gates of Blackhawk development. And it’s hotter and I am older. At 69 I really need to get out earlier and take it easier. And stay away from all the rich a—holes who have built houses on my prized rides. And who drive way to fast on my own street.
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Old 07-08-21, 01:36 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by genejockey
Did anyone mention weighing yourself before and after a ride?
I weigh myself before and after every single ride.

Why do you ask?
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Old 07-08-21, 01:41 PM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by UniChris
Their interpretation that fluid composition doesn't matter is interesting.

However I also note that they're using 3 liters and 4 hours as problem likelyhood thresholds; they're looking at marathons.


Thats the range where I used to be able to get away with water; it's things like 6 liters and 8 hours or 9 liters and 12 where it really starts to matter to me.

I don't start a ride with electrolytes in one bottle unless I'm planning to refill both during it.
What seems to come out of the literature is that it doesn't matter statistically in terms of the single outcome of clinically meaningful hyponatremia, but that's very different from saying there is no effect of including sodium in the bottle. It obviously makes you feel and perform better whenever there are significant fluid losses.

There is also another potentially important mechanism in athletic hyponatremia beside water intake. Non-osmotic release of anti-diuretic hormone in response to intravascular volume reduction during exercise puts the kidney into volume conservation mode, impairing the ability to offload fluid and worsening plasma dilution.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2435641/

Last edited by MoAlpha; 07-08-21 at 01:44 PM.
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Old 07-08-21, 01:44 PM
  #48  
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I noticed after writing that, that your second added link mentioned more of a role for replacement in Ironman events.
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Old 07-08-21, 02:12 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by Rdmonster69
I may have to bite the bullet and get up as early as possible...which I hate as I am in no way a morning person !! That is good advice tho. The Gatorade powder would be a smart idea as well.
You could always go the other way; put on some lights and ride after sunset. It'll still be hot, but without the giant heat lamp beating down on you, and it'll cool off over time. Still carry some Nuun tablets, and use them. They're tasty; they also fizz, so keep the nipple on your water bottle open until it's done.
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Old 07-08-21, 02:12 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by Joe Bikerider
You didn’t mention your age. When I was 18 I could ride all over the San Ramon valley with just a bottle and the occasional refill from a rural house. Or even better when I had the mom spray me off all over with the hose on Blackhawk rd. Now Old Blackhawk road.

But those days are gone. All those nice people are now hiding behind the gates of Blackhawk development. And it’s hotter and I am older. At 69 I really need to get out earlier and take it easier. And stay away from all the rich a—holes who have built houses on my prized rides. And who drive way to fast on my own street.

I'm 51 next month .... and I try really hard to stay away from *******s rich or otherwise !!!
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