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When internal cable routing sucks

Old 07-21-21, 07:52 PM
  #26  
GlennR
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I don't get the point of this topic. If you don't like internal cables, get a frame with external.

I'll repeat my previous post... get Sram eTap HRD, no cables at all.
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Old 07-21-21, 11:26 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
Sram eTap... problem solved.
but then you have derailleurs only a mother could love.


...I thought I posted this earlier. It's not really funny to begin with, but even less funny for what seems like the second time.
and yet, I've thought it twice now so clearlynits worth posting!
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Old 07-22-21, 02:06 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
I don't get the point of this topic.
The point was basically the OP asking how people deal with routing internal cables. He's researching. Not sure why that's a problem.
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Old 07-22-21, 02:35 AM
  #29  
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WhyFi, you bring up a good point, why accept anything one says on a forum. You don't know me, I don't know you. Your opinion of my wrenching skills is based on what? Not really sure, however my opinion on your skills as a wrench are not forthcoming. as it is irrelevant to the topic of internal routing of cables and lines. Shall we agree to disagree? If not, we have missed an opportunity to bring more light to this world.
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Old 07-22-21, 03:13 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by jayp410 View Post
How do you deal with this?
Di2 and hydraulic brakes.
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Old 07-22-21, 04:47 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by Lazyass View Post
The point was basically the OP asking how people deal with routing internal cables. He's researching. Not sure why that's a problem.
It should not be a problem, all they need to do is get on of the magnet tools like the Park.

https://www.amazon.com/Park-Tool-Int...25062811&psc=1
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Old 07-22-21, 07:24 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by TiHabanero View Post
Had to route rear brake line from the caliper to the lever completely internally routed. Could not have done it alone as it required two people, one to guide the hose to the opening in head tube and the other person twisting the hose to get it past the internally routed rear derailleur cable where the hose was getting hung up. Complete bulls**t.

Internally routed cables and hoses are for boy racer wannabes. They solve nothing and add a level of complexity not necessary for one of the simplest transit machines.
Externally routed cables and hoses are for boy mechanic wannabes. They are ugly and add a level of over simplicity that is not necessary for one of the simplest transit machines to wrench on.

/s ... kind of
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Old 07-22-21, 07:26 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by TiHabanero View Post
If not, we have missed an opportunity to bring more light to this world.
Lol. Interesting sentiment from someone that entered the thread with the declaration that internally routed cables and brake lines were only for "boy racer wannabes."

Feel free to hold on to your own opinion, and I'll continue to believe that internal routing shouldn't vex anyone, of at least moderate ingenuity, too greatly.
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Old 07-22-21, 10:10 AM
  #34  
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I always dab a little superglue on the end of fresh cut cables ...... prevents fraying.

I will likely have internal cables on my next bike if I don't go Di2. I like the way they look.

I am not a racer wanna be .... Im a slow old guy with some spare money to spend.
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Old 07-22-21, 10:32 AM
  #35  
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You are never going to pull a new internal cable on the road and I wouldn't carry such a thing even on an externally routed bike. For a broken RD cable, make sure you have a place on the frame, e.g., a bottle cage, to anchor the broken cable with enough tension to put it in a rideable gear. Rather than trying to cleat off or tie the cable under tension, make it fast to a zip tie and attach that to the anchor point, using the zip to add tension.

On my internally routed bike, I have a removable guide under the BB, which provides access to the interior of the shell. I slide two pieces of cable sheath, one from the chain stay exit to the BB and one from the BB to the exit on the down tube, along the old cable with a break under the BB. That makes running the new cable a piece of cake. I have also used the old cable to pull a messenger line, but you have to do a meticulous job taping the ends together or it will catch. I keep thinking about getting a cabling kit, but the sheath thing keeps working so well that I haven't bothered.
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Old 07-22-21, 11:41 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by ShannonM View Post
This reminds me of an episode of Car Talk, when some dude called in and told Tom & Ray that he and his wife had a Honda Accord, (early 1990s, IIRC,) with like 245,000 miles on it.

They'd never changed the oil. Just checked it every so often and added some when it got a bit low.

Dude's question was "so, should I do an oil change?" To which Click and Clack both responded with some version of "Dear God, No!!! If you do, your car will be dead in a week!", followed by much existential angst about "everything we know is wrong" and "have we been ripping off our customers for all these years?"

Seriously, you've been riding the same cables for 45 years??? Man, I ain't been livin' right!

--Shannon
No, of course not. I've never owned the same bicycle for more than ten years. I change bikes after around 10 or so years.
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Old 07-22-21, 12:55 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by jackb View Post
I've been cycling for 45 years and have never had to replace a cable. Keep your bikes dry and properly lubricated to reduce the chances of a broken cable.
I've had two of them break, probably 3000 - 5000 miles between them. I don't ride in the rain, and my bike is in good condition.

The problem (both times) has been metal fatigue inside the DA shifter. It breaks maybe 1 cm from the head of the cable, where the shifter wraps the cable to tighten it.

Where I ride is rolling hills, and I'm just over 200 lbs. During a typical ride, I'm shifting dozens of times... all of that adds up to metal fatigue.

Last edited by jayp410; 07-22-21 at 01:02 PM.
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Old 07-22-21, 01:23 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
It should not be a problem, all they need to do is get on of the magnet tools like the Park.

https://www.amazon.com/Park-Tool-Int...25062811&psc=1
I did use a magnet when building the bike, and while it was diffcult due to my chainstays, I got it routed and the magnet was helpful. However, now with the BB and fork installed, it would be difficult without using the old cable as a guide.

The frame came with some little pink transparent sleeves that are just larger than the cable itself, which I installed in the channels of the little plastic guide bracket on the BB. With those in place, there's no way I'm going to be able to install a new cable (even with a magnet tool), unless guiding it through using the old cable. Perhaps without those little sleeves it would have been possible, but I didn't think of that when installing them... only thought about how they would help reduce friction through that area. Will probably have to cut both cables and remove those sleeves the next time I install a cable.

Di2 does sound nice... but then there are batteries.
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Old 07-22-21, 02:15 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by jayp410 View Post
I've had two of them break, probably 3000 - 5000 miles between them. I don't ride in the rain, and my bike is in good condition.

The problem (both times) has been metal fatigue inside the DA shifter. It breaks maybe 1 cm from the head of the cable, where the shifter wraps the cable to tighten it.

Where I ride is rolling hills, and I'm just over 200 lbs. During a typical ride, I'm shifting dozens of times... all of that adds up to metal fatigue.
Typical for the bar-routed iterations of DA and Ultegra. The radius of the sheave on the ratchet is too small.

Last edited by MoAlpha; 07-22-21 at 02:46 PM.
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Old 07-22-21, 02:45 PM
  #40  
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The look of 'no cables/housing' has the best visual impact (IMHO) when the internal routing starts at the handlebars. That totally clean and aero appearance up front also likely has the best practical aero benefit, too. Internally routing the wires on frames with significantly curved tubing improves aesthetics, too.

I never really understood the practice of piercing the top tube twice to hide a rear brake cable for a straight distance of only 50cm.


this thread needs internet pics - as I have nothing this new.




Last edited by Wildwood; 07-22-21 at 02:55 PM.
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Old 07-22-21, 04:37 PM
  #41  
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How does a magnet work on stainless cables?

The amount of years the cable has been on the bike does not really matter; it is the amount of miles ridden in those 45 years. My wife's 10-year old touring bike has 26,000 miles on it and the cables have been changed several times. Also new cable housing. I've broke one shifter cable on my CX bike. It was the only cable that I actually broke in 50 years. I change cable regularly, especially if there is any sign of fraying.
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Old 07-22-21, 04:49 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Doug64 View Post
How does a magnet work on stainless cables?
I use a magnet to pull a ferrous bit o' metal, tied to floss, through the frame. You then tie the floss to the cable and pull it through.
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Old 07-22-21, 06:06 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by jayp410 View Post
Di2 does sound nice... but then there are batteries.
Di2 still needs the wires run.

Removing the crank and fork are not difficult and should be greased occasionally. I service the bottom bracket bearings every 1000 miles.
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Old 07-22-21, 10:49 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by Doug64 View Post
How does a magnet work on stainless cables?.
Depends on the grade. 304 stainless is attracted to magnets, while 316 is not. Shimano cables are attracted to magnets.

[EDIT] From a web search, apparently 304 is non-magnetic as well as 316. However, some other types of stainless are. Shimano cables are, because I used a magnet to draw them through the frame.

Last edited by jayp410; 07-22-21 at 10:53 PM.
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Old 07-23-21, 02:07 AM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
It should not be a problem, all they need to do is get on of the magnet tools like the Park.

https://www.amazon.com/Park-Tool-Int...25062811&psc=1
Eh, you could have told him that instead of asking what the point of the topic was. Not everyone knows these things.
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Old 07-23-21, 02:33 AM
  #46  
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Sure, not every body has a full complement bike tool chest and most have no idea such tools even exist. Its strictly bike-nerd stuff. I have done my own repairs for decades, literally, but I too find internal cabling a faff. Some bikes worse than others. I just converted a drop bar bike from from mech to hydro disc. Man! it took some ingenuity and patience getting both the gear cables and (plastic) brake hoses routed in a frame with no internal guides, tight bends and tiny little holes for the gear cables under the crank. My other bike, with external cabling would have been done in less than 1/2 the time.
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Old 07-23-21, 05:16 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by Lazyass View Post
Eh, you could have told him that instead of asking what the point of the topic was. Not everyone knows these things.
Guess I was a Lazyass.
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Old 07-24-21, 08:12 AM
  #48  
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For me, internal routing is extra work and zero benefit. Its not a dealbreaker, but it is definitely something I would prefer not have, and it would go in the “con” column when comparing new bikes/frames.

Since I gravitate towards steel on road/gravel bikes it is easy to avoid, but all of the new MTB frames I am interested in are internal routing.
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Old 07-25-21, 07:12 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by jayp410 View Post
I've had two of them break, probably 3000 - 5000 miles between them. I don't ride in the rain, and my bike is in good condition.

The problem (both times) has been metal fatigue inside the DA shifter. It breaks maybe 1 cm from the head of the cable, where the shifter wraps the cable to tighten it.

Where I ride is rolling hills, and I'm just over 200 lbs. During a typical ride, I'm shifting dozens of times... all of that adds up to metal fatigue.
I've had three in total break on me, at the same place. Twice on a Sora brifter (always the rear) and once on a Deore Rapidfire shifter (also the rear). Probably about the same mean time between failure as you.
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Old 07-25-21, 07:33 PM
  #50  
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I can't remember the last time I had a gear cable break. Certainly talking decades ago. Bound to happen next time I ride now though!
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