First Time Chain Waxer Calling on Chain Waxing Gurus
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#77
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It is the wax on the innards that matter most. That is where the wear is. When those bits wear and "stretch".....your cassette and chainrings become the target. I have cassettes with many tens of thousands of miles on them. I never have flaking wax when installing a newly waxed chain because I do not let it dry on the outside plates.
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I will wipe the chain upon removal from crock pot next time I wax the chain; I suspect the excess wax on the outside is causing my initial shifting problems. Do I need to be concerned about leaving paper towel lint stuck on the outside? Or should I sacrifice an old T-shirt?
I described how I do it
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#81
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11 sp chains
It's been a while, but I seem to remember 11sp Shimano chains are 'unidirectional', the side plates are shaped differently on the drive side. I installed the first few backwards. There'd have to be an extraordinary amount of crap on the chain to prevent it shifting well on the bigger cogs.
#82
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It could also be your derailleur hanger. In general, if your shifting works in the first two-three gears but gets whacky elsewhere, then you adjust that whackiness out only to find it moves elsewhere on the cluster, the issue is often a misaligned (or loose, or both loose and misaligned if it's bolted on) derailleur hanger. Your LBS should have a tool for that. Make sure your rear wheel is relatively true before you bring it in as the tool indicates against the rim It's possible to realign an aluminum hanger, but for best results, just get a new one.
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The FD pushes on the outside of the chain, the RD doesn't - how would you propose that excess wax on the outside is causing poor RD shifting? I've never wiped down my chains and I've never had shifting issues outside of the first few minutes of a ride with a fresh chain that's still a little stiff. I think that the mistake that you continue to make is adjusting your RD in the stand. Get it right after a ride, when the chain isn't stiff, and then just stop dicking with your derailleur after installing a fresh chain. You're making this too hard.
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Agreed, it's not rocket science. I've never had a problem with derailleurs getting out of whack from removing or installing chains.
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It's been a while, but I seem to remember 11sp Shimano chains are 'unidirectional', the side plates are shaped differently on the drive side. I installed the first few backwards. There'd have to be an extraordinary amount of crap on the chain to prevent it shifting well on the bigger cogs.
Last edited by SoSmellyAir; 07-26-21 at 04:20 PM.
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It could also be your derailleur hanger. In general, if your shifting works in the first two-three gears but gets whacky elsewhere, then you adjust that whackiness out only to find it moves elsewhere on the cluster, the issue is often a misaligned (or loose, or both loose and misaligned if it's bolted on) derailleur hanger. Your LBS should have a tool for that. Make sure your rear wheel is relatively true before you bring it in as the tool indicates against the rim It's possible to realign an aluminum hanger, but for best results, just get a new one.
The FD pushes on the outside of the chain, the RD doesn't - how would you propose that excess wax on the outside is causing poor RD shifting? I've never wiped down my chains and I've never had shifting issues outside of the first few minutes of a ride with a fresh chain that's still a little stiff. I think that the mistake that you continue to make is adjusting your RD in the stand. Get it right after a ride, when the chain isn't stiff, and then just stop dicking with your derailleur after installing a fresh chain. You're making this too hard.
#87
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I will wipe the chain upon removal from crock pot next time I wax the chain; I suspect the excess wax on the outside is causing my initial shifting problems. Do I need to be concerned about leaving paper towel lint stuck on the outside? Or should I sacrifice an old T-shirt?
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That is good to know. Probably because it is so difficult to remove all factory grease and prior lube in the initial cleaning, such that each subsequent waxing further cleans the chain.
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When I used to ride a lot more than I do now, I used to wax chains, especially for off-road. Process was simple.
Grab a heat gun and some scrap board ideally like a fence paling. Heat a small section of chain (say 6") and then rub on a candle. You get a feel for the right amount of heat when you can see the wax melt & get drawn inside the links. Takes <3 mins with minimal gear and setup/cleanup.
Sure it doesn't have the super xyz additive & more than likely the wrong wax but I was happy with the results.YMMV.
Grab a heat gun and some scrap board ideally like a fence paling. Heat a small section of chain (say 6") and then rub on a candle. You get a feel for the right amount of heat when you can see the wax melt & get drawn inside the links. Takes <3 mins with minimal gear and setup/cleanup.
Sure it doesn't have the super xyz additive & more than likely the wrong wax but I was happy with the results.YMMV.
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I waxed my chain for the first time yesterday and installed it today, and had to re-index my rear derailleur because the chain would not shift from the 3rd to the 4th physically largest cog. I am hoping that this is a one time event and not something I would have to do every time I install a freshly waxed chain.
The chain is a Shimano Ultegra 11 speed chain, with around 300 miles on the factory grease, then mild cleaning with Dawn dish detergent and a Sonicare toothbrush, then rinsed, dried, lubed with Rock N Roll Extreme, and ridden for about 100 miles, all in absolutely dry conditions. The chain (including the quick link) was then cleaned by immersion and shaking in acetone 4 times, including an immersion overnight, and dipped into melted Gulf paraffin wax at 210 *F in a covered Crock Pot on low setting, swished a few times during the first 30 minutes to release all air bubbles. The chain stayed in the Crock Pot for over 2 hours, and chain was measured at 210 *F to confirm that it has reached the equilibrium temperature. The chain was swished a couple more times, then the Crock Pot was turned off and the chain was removed after about 10 minutes and hung to drip; I did not wipe the chain as I was removing it from the wax. The chain was stiff with wax so I ran it around a breaker bar to loosen it and shed the biggest wax chunks prior to installing it onto the bike.
Am I doing something wrong? Thank you.
The chain is a Shimano Ultegra 11 speed chain, with around 300 miles on the factory grease, then mild cleaning with Dawn dish detergent and a Sonicare toothbrush, then rinsed, dried, lubed with Rock N Roll Extreme, and ridden for about 100 miles, all in absolutely dry conditions. The chain (including the quick link) was then cleaned by immersion and shaking in acetone 4 times, including an immersion overnight, and dipped into melted Gulf paraffin wax at 210 *F in a covered Crock Pot on low setting, swished a few times during the first 30 minutes to release all air bubbles. The chain stayed in the Crock Pot for over 2 hours, and chain was measured at 210 *F to confirm that it has reached the equilibrium temperature. The chain was swished a couple more times, then the Crock Pot was turned off and the chain was removed after about 10 minutes and hung to drip; I did not wipe the chain as I was removing it from the wax. The chain was stiff with wax so I ran it around a breaker bar to loosen it and shed the biggest wax chunks prior to installing it onto the bike.
Am I doing something wrong? Thank you.
I'm no guru, but have spent extensive time reviewing zero friction cycling and silca info/instructions and data on why and how to wax. In a nutshell, not doing so costs much money in terms of component (chain, cogs and cassettes) wear, a few watts of lost power, silence from chain noise, and many, at least for me, prior grease marks on my legs.
https://zerofrictioncycling.com.au/
Has all the relevant and easy to understand info.
So to answer your questions, you should have removed the factory grease initially and should use either Silca Secret Blend wax or Molten Speedwax, not paraffin. The friction and wear data is shown at the above website
Good luck
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Good for you to wax. Once you're past the firdt clean/wax, it is unbelievably easy and (almost) never requires rewashing the chain
I'm no guru, but have spent extensive time reviewing zero friction cycling and silca info/instructions and data on why and how to wax. In a nutshell, not doing so costs much money in terms of component (chain, cogs and cassettes) wear, a few watts of lost power, silence from chain noise, and many, at least for me, prior grease marks on my legs.
https://zerofrictioncycling.com.au/
Has all the relevant and easy to understand info.
So to answer your questions, you should have removed the factory grease initially and should use either Silca Secret Blend wax or Molten Speedwax, not paraffin. The friction and wear data is shown at the above website
Good luck
I'm no guru, but have spent extensive time reviewing zero friction cycling and silca info/instructions and data on why and how to wax. In a nutshell, not doing so costs much money in terms of component (chain, cogs and cassettes) wear, a few watts of lost power, silence from chain noise, and many, at least for me, prior grease marks on my legs.
https://zerofrictioncycling.com.au/
Has all the relevant and easy to understand info.
So to answer your questions, you should have removed the factory grease initially and should use either Silca Secret Blend wax or Molten Speedwax, not paraffin. The friction and wear data is shown at the above website
Good luck
Edit: and i should add that it works very well on its own.
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It probably doesn't matter to most people, but that's what the data shows.
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maybe i am just ignorant about waxing...the site sells only one brand as far as i can tell so it seems to be it is just an advertisement. and i cannot find anything that states not to use paraffin. also, why would a special wax work only for 10 and 11 speed drive trains?
https://zerofrictioncycling.com.au/p.../highmilepack/
https://zerofrictioncycling.com.au/p.../highmilepack/
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A long time (March 2013) Velonews ran a test on 50 chain lubes. Friction Facts' Ultrafast wax mix was one of the lowest friction lubes tested. Friction Facts published this recipe for their ultrafast wax mix:
1 pound of food-grade paraffin wax with a melting point of approx 130F, such as Gulf Paraffin.
5g pure Teflon (PTFE) 3-micron powder. (Available from https://www.howardpianoindustries.com...e-ptfe-powder/)
1g pure Molybdenum Disulfide (MoS2) sub-micron powder. (Amazon)
I think most of the commercially available waxes are some variation of this recipe, likely using tungsten disulfide in place of the molybdenum disulfide as this has lower friction.
1 pound of food-grade paraffin wax with a melting point of approx 130F, such as Gulf Paraffin.
5g pure Teflon (PTFE) 3-micron powder. (Available from https://www.howardpianoindustries.com...e-ptfe-powder/)
1g pure Molybdenum Disulfide (MoS2) sub-micron powder. (Amazon)
I think most of the commercially available waxes are some variation of this recipe, likely using tungsten disulfide in place of the molybdenum disulfide as this has lower friction.
#95
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I am using Gulf Wax on its own for now. I also bought a kilogram of Silca wax; I figured both Silca and Zero Friction deserve my business after I researched and analyzed their instructions so extensively, but only the former seems to sell in the USA. After my chain has gone through a few rounds of Gulf wax I figured it would be clean enough and my technique would be good enough for me to switch to Silca.
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#96
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Lately, when I remove the chain from the hot wax, I wipe it with a paper towel and then install it while it is still warm. This is a lot more convenient than when I let it cool while hanging up. Run it through the gears a few times on the stand and it is ready to go. NO stiff links!
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Some chains are directional and meant to go on a specific way which could account for the shifting issue but I don't think a Shimano Ultegra is such a chain. I have been waxing for years and have never had to make cable adjustments after doing so. It's more likely that removing the chain and taking the tension of the derailleur spring that the cable housing relaxed and did not re seat in quite the same way.
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I've only ever used Molten Speed Wax. I'd seen the home brew formula posted above, but didn't want to bother tracking down and paying for shipping on all the proper ingredients. Besides, the MSW was less than 20 bucks and, more than a year later, half of it is still in the bag, untouched - I'm a-okay with that kind of value for convenience.
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Hi all; I have been waxing the chains on our bikes for a few years now with no problems whatsoever, I heat 1/4 lb of Gulf Wax in a fry pan on a hotplate, swish the chain for about 10 minutes, then hang to let excess wax run off before it solidifies. the chain will be very stiff so I pull it over the bike stand to loosen it up otherwise for the first several miles it won't roll over the jockey wheels easily or shift as nice. I also take a 2" paintbrush and paint the rear cogs with the molten wax. when its time to clean the rear cogs i heat them with a heat gun and the wax and dirt just fall off. I don't re-use the wax, just dump it when done.
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