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First S24O this weekend. Am I overthinking it?

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First S24O this weekend. Am I overthinking it?

Old 09-22-22, 01:17 PM
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superdex
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First S24O this weekend. Am I overthinking it?

Howdy --

So I'm heading for my first overnighter this weekend. It's not epic mileage, but the experience of being solo and bikepacking for the first time is going to make it adventure enough. I've been planning/day-dreaming/obsessing/over-analyzing this to the point where I can't even mention it anymore to the wife ("just get on with it already!"). There is camping riding distance from the house, but I'm not in the fitness to tackle the climbing to get there (this year was spent on another high-value pursuit so the cycling suffered), so I've been planning a "park-n-ride" route. I've been trying to balance site availability, accessibility, distance, phone service, water resources and weather. Just to ride 20-30miles to pitch a tent? Sheesh. I'm at the "just get on with it!" stage myself, har.

The (current, most likely) plan: Park at the Walmart in Woodland Park CO (I'm about an hour's drive away), ride to Mueller State Park, camp. Ride back. Perhaps ride some of the trails in the park (as they seem to be pretty accessible on a gravel bike). I'm 90% confident in the logistics --the one thing that has me a little uneasy is the temps for Saturday night look to drop into the upper 30s F. Which impacts the clothing I pack, which impacts space. I have a new sleeping bag arriving today and will pack tomorrow to make sure I've covered everything.

My question to you folks is, What do you pack for low 40s/high 30s to stay warm in camp? (no fires allowed)). I have a packable puffy jacket, and will have a pair of pants. I need to see how I can pack a pair of thermals too. And heavier gloves (which I won't use riding). And a winter beanie.

Thanks,
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Old 09-22-22, 03:17 PM
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As far as temperatures go and planning:
- I make sure I have layer clothing that is sufficient for range of temperatures I expect when cycling
- I make sure my sleeping bag and tent are sufficient for overnight temperatures.
If it gets too cold in the evening one alternative I have is turning in early in my sleeping bag. So cold temperatures are more of an issue in the morning when I am looking to get going. Again if it is particularly cold I can wait to get going until at least the sun is up and sunlight is making things warmer.
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Old 09-22-22, 03:45 PM
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For those temps I bring thermal tights, thick sleep socks, a hooded puffy jacket, a beanie, a buff, and some thick gloves. For overnighters, I usually pack some luxuries too, like a book or printed out crossword puzzles and a pen if I know I might be holed up in my sleeping bag for a long time.
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Old 09-22-22, 03:50 PM
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Have you camped in temps that cold before? You might be surprised how cold the upper 30s F are when you are tent camping. Depending on your sleeping bag, you may need to wear wool socks, long underwear, and a beanie just to stay warm while you sleep.
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Old 09-22-22, 05:26 PM
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Last weekend with 4 friends we biked from Burlington Vermont to Portland Maine on the Cross Vermont Adventure trail and Cross New Hampshire Adventure Trail. Second night in Jefferson, NH the temps dipped to 30 degrees. We woke up to frost on the tent, ground and our bikes (see pic below). We all had summer sleeping bags and everyone felt it haha. So, I'd say bring a bag for spring or fall (20-30 degree)


Frost on the front bag and saddle
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Old 09-22-22, 09:33 PM
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Definitely do as good of a sleeping bag as you can afford. It just helps ya sleep better, by not having to worry about the weather. Worse than a good frost, is an unexpected snowfall, in the mountains. That's when you'll be DARN glad you packed a tent and good sleeping bag. And you're more likely to survive, lol. 😁

Far better to have something, & not need it, than need it & not have it. 🙂
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Old 09-23-22, 06:36 AM
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Your clothing sounds about right. That sounds like an excellent idea for a shake-down cruise. Have fun!

I personally wouldn't pack anything puffy for those temps, just an extra jersey. My packs don't have much volume. If I'm not comfortable outside, I go to bed early. One of the reasons I like camping is the long nights of rest.

For temps near freezing, I use a 30F down quilt. I've never done it, but I could also use it as a serape for sitting around camp.
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Old 09-23-22, 07:58 AM
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The beenie/skullcap is an excellent way to get cheap, light, extra warmth.
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Old 09-23-22, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by pdlamb
The beenie/skullcap is an excellent way to get cheap, light, extra warmth.
Yep, I really like a thin one that is like pile inside and windproof on the outside. One of mine feels like neoprene wetsuit on the outside. Both are thin enough to wear under a helmet. They are a favorite clothing of mine item for trouring, backpacking, xc skiing, snowshoeing, MTB-ing, and trail running. REI sells a nice one (Novarra house brand).. It only covers the tops of my ears, but I find that sufficient in any weather not much below 0F for most sports of maybe a bit higher at higher speed on the road, but it has always been fine on tour or for other sports.

Last edited by staehpj1; 09-23-22 at 08:29 AM.
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Old 09-23-22, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by PedalingWalrus
Last weekend with 4 friends we biked from Burlington Vermont to Portland Maine on the Cross Vermont Adventure trail
Did you ride through the Groton State Forest on the trail? Back in June I got on a trail at its western end in Plainfield on my way to Stillwater State Park on Groton Lake. I am pretty sure the Cross Vermont Trail uses that right-of-way at some point, but maybe not as far west as Plainfield, because I seem to recall seeing signs for the trail as I headed east.
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Old 09-23-22, 11:27 AM
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Originally Posted by gna
Have you camped in temps that cold before? You might be surprised how cold the upper 30s F are when you are tent camping. Depending on your sleeping bag, you may need to wear wool socks, long underwear, and a beanie just to stay warm while you sleep.
Heh. The first night of my first ever tour (across the U.S. using ACA's Northern Tier route) we camped at Kitsap Memorial Park in WA. It was my first night ever camping. It was freezing in later May. I don't remember what I wore at night, but I did have a 32 degree bag.

If I am going to be in an area where it might get nippy at night I will bring a warm pair of wool socks, a bottom base layer (I have a synthetic one and a wool one), my Rahpa top base layer and a wool hat along with the little beanie that fits under my helmet.
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Old 09-23-22, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by indyfabz
Heh. The first night of my first ever tour (across the U.S. using ACA's Northern Tier route) we camped at Kitsap Memorial Park in WA. It was my first night ever camping. It was freezing in later May. I don't remember what I wore at night, but I did have a 32 degree bag.

If I am going to be in an area where it might get nippy at night I will bring a warm pair of wool socks, a bottom base layer (I have a synthetic one and a wool one), my Rahpa top base layer and a wool hat along with the little beanie that fits under my helmet.
The ratings on sleeping bags are based on a person wearing one long underwear layer and a pair of socks, sleeping on an insulated surface. There is also a comfort rating, as well as a cooler rating, plus there is often rounding to the nearest 0 or 5 number.
For instance, my bag is a 20 degree bag, but the comfort rating is 32 degrees and the tested lower limit is 21. When it's in the 30s, I'm wearing long underwear, socks, and a hat.

See https://www.rei.com/learn/expert-adv...e-ratings.html
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Old 09-23-22, 01:25 PM
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Thanks all for the insight! I'm between nervous and excited.

I got everything packed:

Handlebar bag: Sleeping bag and pad, puffy jacket (Patagonia something-er-other the work bought us one year as a gift. It's a-real nice), thermal legs and warmup-pants, thermal jersey, beanie, extra gloves (will go on outside), extra socks, camp towel and toothbrush. Food (granola and trail mix. Not bringing a whole lot because I plan on stopping halfway and purchasing a Subway or something and back-pocketing it in, and riding to breakfast on the way out)

Seat pack: Tent (with rainfly --gonna need it for the "insulation"), empty 2L bladder to fill when I get to the park, Katadyn BeFree water filter (just in case). The tent is a Sierra Designs Hyperlight AST that I bought like 15 years ago when I first moved to CO and needed to get kitted up because you know, you're in the Rocky Mountains now. Much smaller and packable than I remember.

Frame bag: Leatherman, first aid kit, wipes, toolkit and spare tube, and about 6oz of Elijah Craig Rye to commemorate the occasion.

Top tube bag: Phone, earbuds (at camp, I don't wear them riding), charging brick (I most likely won't need it but it makes the wife happy), food (couple bars and some Oreos. Yeah, that's how I roll)



I am amazed just by the whole packing process and how the kitchen goes from overflowing with all sorts of crap to everything gone and stowed in just a few bags. Totally cool.

The route is under 20mi one way, which allows me to get a taste of this thing, and if there's time, maybe ride around Mueller State Park either before I lose light on Saturday or before heading to the car on Sunday. Also taking Trout Creek Rd as a detour because who wants to be on the same road the whole time? https://www.mapmyride.com/routes/view/5226152251/

So yeah, I think I'm all set. Trip report when I get back!

Last edited by superdex; 09-23-22 at 01:35 PM.
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Old 09-23-22, 01:48 PM
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Do you have a pad to sleep on? A good pad will go a long way to keeping you warm. When you lie in a sleeping bag, the insulation underneath you will compress, lessening its insulating properties. If you do not have a pad, stop in the Walmart where you are planning on parking, and buy one of the blue closed cell foam sleeping pads they have in the camping section. They are not expensive and it will help keep you warm, and comfortable.
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Old 09-23-22, 02:10 PM
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Have fun and let us know how it goes.
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Old 09-23-22, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by phughes
Do you have a pad to sleep on? A good pad will go a long way to keeping you warm. When you lie in a sleeping bag, the insulation underneath you will compress, lessening its insulating properties. If you do not have a pad, stop in the Walmart where you are planning on parking, and buy one of the blue closed cell foam sleeping pads they have in the camping section. They are not expensive and it will help keep you warm, and comfortable.
I do have a pad -- this one https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01M9I8RAN/ --R value of 2.2. Probably a little low for upper 30s, but I think I'll make it work....
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Old 09-23-22, 03:06 PM
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Have fun and enjoy the ride
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Old 09-23-22, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by superdex
I do have a pad -- this one https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01M9I8RAN/ --R value of 2.2. Probably a little low for upper 30s, but I think I'll make it work....
Just wanted to be sure. Regarding the 2.2 R value of that pad, I seriously question it. From what I see, it has no internal insulation. One test I read showed it was around R 1.3, which sounds mor like it. I have a Klymit Static V2 uninsulated pad which has an R value of 1.3, and it gets a bit cool at colder temps. I also have a Klymit V insulated pad, which has and R value of 4.4, it is much nicer when it gets cold.

You won't be gone long, so it won't be bad, and you will get a good idea of how your equipment works in those conditions. Simply ride, and enjoy. Have a great time.
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Old 09-23-22, 09:10 PM
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Oh yeah, I forgot to say, have fun. That is the whole point, after all. 😁😉

I'll add another yip, for a 100% Merino wool beanie hat. The Merino ones are softer than most, and plenty warm. 👍 I got the one that just about halfways covers your ears, thinking it would work well under my helmet, but it's TOO warm for that. Works great off the bike though. 👍

And don't forget pics, dammit. 😁😉
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Old 09-24-22, 05:07 AM
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Originally Posted by stardognine
Definitely do as good of a sleeping bag as you can afford
I hesitated to comment on this since I have mixed feelings. I have gone with a wide range on this and can't resist putting in my $0.02 worth. Particularly for summer or three season camping you really can get by with an inexpensive bag. If the budget is tight or you are not sure you will be doing much camping starting out with an inexpensive bag isn't that terrible. I rode the TA with a $70 bag and did years of camping including canoe camping and backpacking mostly with other inexpensive bags.

I have since splurged on nicer bags and ultimately a really nice one. My current one was pretty expensive, but may be my favorite piece of gear. It is warm and comfy and packs down to about the size of a liter bottle of sport drink. So yes it was worth it, but then again the $70 bag did serve it's purpose at the time.

The expense may be a bit less than it seems though since the $70 bag was kind of shot after a couple long tours and the expensive down bag is like new after years of use. I figure it is probably a lifetime purchase. It certainly will be for me since I was near retirement when I bought it. I have no doubt I will wear out before it does so barring some catastropic damage it will outlast me.

So yes if you can afford a really nice bag it is a real joy to own and use. That said I wasn't that unhappy touring with a really cheap bag when I started out. So buy what you can afford and justify.
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Old 09-24-22, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by staehpj1
I hesitated to comment on this since I have mixed feelings. I have gone with a wide range on this and can't resist putting in my $0.02 worth. Particularly for summer or three season camping you really can get by with an inexpensive bag. If the budget is tight or you are not sure you will be doing much camping starting out with an inexpensive bag isn't that terrible. I rode the TA with a $70 bag and did years of camping including canoe camping and backpacking mostly with other inexpensive bags.

I have since splurged on nicer bags and ultimately a really nice one. My current one was pretty expensive, but may be my favorite piece of gear. It is warm and comfy and packs down to about the size of a liter bottle of sport drink. So yes it was worth it, but then again the $70 bag did serve it's purpose at the time.

The expense may be a bit less than it seems though since the $70 bag was kind of shot after a couple long tours and the expensive down bag is like new after years of use. I figure it is probably a lifetime purchase. It certainly will be for me since I was near retirement when I bought it. I have no doubt I will wear out before it does so barring some catastropic damage it will outlast me.

So yes if you can afford a really nice bag it is a real joy to own and use. That said I wasn't that unhappy touring with a really cheap bag when I started out. So buy what you can afford and justify.
Oh, I know you can "get by" with an inexpensive bag. I've done so quite a bit before. And I hope I didn't sound snobbish, that was definitely not my intention. It's more like, once you get a good one, you wish you'd done it sooner. 😁😉

Last time I was up in Seattle, I scored an old REI down bag, at the Ballard Goodwill, for a great price. Someone cut the tag off, at the bottom, so I dunno what model it is, but it has at least 5 pounds of down filling, maybe more. It would probably cost a few hundred, today. 🙂

BTW, it's a dark red, and supports the urban myth, that vintage red sleeping bags are warmer. 😁😉
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Old 09-24-22, 05:36 PM
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I have service!

I thought I might, so here’s a little update in bullets:
  • the bike has probably 25-30 lbs on it. Totally changes how the bike climbs. I’m happy I picked a route that doesn’t have a ton of elevation
  • 20mi on the nose, and I’m wiped. It was an off year fitness-wise but even still, I don’t think I coulda done more on this outing
  • I love my state. Especially this time of year. It’s about a week early for peak fall colors, but what is changing is gorgeous





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Old 09-24-22, 05:45 PM
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Woohoo, I knew I got online for a reason. Great pics. 👍

I bet you'll sleep good tonight. 😁
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Old 09-24-22, 06:07 PM
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Thanks for the update.
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Old 09-25-22, 04:46 AM
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Loos even better than it sounded. And now you know the answers to your questions better than any of us could have told you. Every trip is a learning experience. Sounds like you could learn to slow down. Try two gears lower than you would unladen for hills so you are not wiped when you get to camp.
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