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So the omnium has changed again

Old 09-29-16, 08:30 AM
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queerpunk
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So the omnium has changed again

The schedule for the Track World Cup in the Netherlands in November is out, and it looks like there's a new omnium format. Source: Programme ? Trackwordcup.nl

New Format:
  • Scratch Race (10/15km F/M)
  • Tempo (7.5/10km)
  • Elimination
  • Points Race (20/25 km)

All four races are in one day. They've dropped the timed events. The men's tempo is a stunning 40 laps, which sounds brutal. And, the points races are shorter.

Thoughts?

I hope that they still run it such that the points you accrue in the points race are omnium points. I think that's a really key feature.

Last edited by queerpunk; 09-29-16 at 08:33 AM.
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Old 09-29-16, 10:53 AM
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Wow.

What happened to The Omnium being the event for the best all-around track racer? Time trials are at the core of track racing (Flying 200, 500M, 1K, 3K, 4K, Team Sprint, Team Pursuit, The Hour).

The Omnium is squarely just a bunch of mass start events now.

I guess some folks would be glad to not have to use their aerobars.

Is this an attempt to get more roadies to race track? To make it more spectator-friendly?
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Old 09-29-16, 10:55 AM
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Now maybe we can have a Sprint Ominum?
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Old 09-29-16, 11:07 AM
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I wonder what the point of this is - if cramming an Omnium into 1 day lets Omnium races also race one-off mass start races and TTs at World Cups and World Championships, and therefore helps ensure participation in those events.
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Old 09-29-16, 11:54 AM
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Does the schedule contain errors?
Women: a 250m qualifier for the 500m TT? I suspect this is for sprint seeding.
Men: no comparable TT (1000m) to the womens 500m TT.

Also when were these world cup changes made? It seems that competitors may have been preparing for this new omnium format.

Last edited by 700wheel; 09-29-16 at 12:04 PM.
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Old 09-29-16, 12:11 PM
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Excuse my ignorance, but FOUR races in one day? That's grueling....
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Old 09-29-16, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by sarals View Post
Excuse my ignorance, but FOUR races in one day? That's grueling....
That's a normal weekly meeting at any local track

Have a look at Dick Lane Velodrome's results page to see what a normal race day/night looks like: https://www.dicklanevelodrome.com/results/Results.php
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Old 09-29-16, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
That's a normal weekly meeting at any local track
Oh. Joy.

If they're spaced apart decently, I might survive a schedule like that. I've survived stage races with more than one long event a day in them!
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Old 09-29-16, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by sarals View Post
Oh. Joy.

If they're spaced apart decently, I might survive a schedule like that. I've survived stage races with more than one long event a day in them!
It's not the same. The races are 10-15 minutes each with maybe 20-30 minutes between. For example:

10 lap scratch:
CAT 5 race
CAT 3/4 rest
CAT P/1/2 rest

then

CAT 3/4 race
CAT P/1/2 rest
CAT 5 rest

then

CAT P/1/2 race
CAT 5 rest
CAT 3/4 rest

All 10 lap scratches are over.

Race 1, rest 2 for every event.
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Old 09-29-16, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by sarals View Post
Excuse my ignorance, but FOUR races in one day? That's grueling....
It is definitely grueling.

Track races are short, but track meets are long days, and the need to warm up, race, warm down, rest, warm up again, race again... it is demanding. Your days start at 8AM, end at 10PM, you have to figure out when to eat, when to nap (and where!)... it's hard. This year at the National Championships I tried to "do some work during the day" between sessions. Nope. Doesn't work like that. You have to be totally focused because there are a lot of logistics! I realized two years ago that the real pros are able to pack up, leave the track, eat in their hotel room, and get to sleep as quickly and efficiently as possible.

Track races are short but packing a lot of them into one night is hard. At the Fixed Gear Classic in Minnesota this summer, the endurance field was deep enough that there were qualifiers for each event. That meant a qualifying scratch race, then the scratch race... a qualifying elimination, then the elimination. Etc. I wound up racing 12 races in 3 days. I think one of the nights, between warmup, racing, and warmdowns, I wound up doing well over 100kms.

The last race was a Madison and I was wasted. I looked at my partner before the race and I said, "You know when you're pretty drunk but you're convinced that you're sober, so you keep drinking? That's this race for us: we're going to drink ourselves sober."
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Old 09-29-16, 01:06 PM
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So, even at the World level, they will have a minimum number of minutes rest between events. I think it's officially at least 30 minutes. So, they might do something like:

Omnium: Scratch Race
Keirin Qualifying heat 1
Omnium: Tempo
Keirin Qualifying heat 2
Omnium: Elimination
Keirin Qualifying heat 3
Omnium: Points race

Last edited by carleton; 09-29-16 at 01:44 PM.
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Old 09-29-16, 01:20 PM
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Ignorance showing again, but does one have to do all of the events at worlds and nats? You can pick and choose, right?
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Old 09-29-16, 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by sarals View Post
Ignorance showing again, but does one have to do all of the events at worlds and nats? You can pick and choose, right?
You can pick and choose. I know people that are going to worlds this week and only racing 1 event. Other people are like, "I booked and flight and a hotel, I'm gonna get my money's worth" and race everything.

Personally, I'll usually do like 2 or 3 events at Masters Nationals.

The Omnium is considered 1 event with 4 sub-events. But the other events are as you would expect, they are singular.

Organizers try to spread the events out such that "sprinters" don't have their events all in the same day. Same for "enduros". That way they can get some rest and recovery between. That's why you'll see sprint and endurance races woven together in a daily program.

So, it's unusual to have this new Omnium format all in one day. I would expect it to at least be split over 2 days.

Time trials are the most time consuming. Mass start races run the fastest because everyone goes at once, unless the field is so big and you need qualifying heats.
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Old 09-29-16, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by sarals View Post
Excuse my ignorance, but FOUR races in one day? That's grueling....
I usually double up in SR4 and Masters to do 5-7 races over the course of 3hrs on Saturdays, albeit these are shorter races.
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Old 09-29-16, 04:24 PM
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I know someone who's at Manchester right now. I have no idea what she's racing. My training partner did the flying 200 and 1K at Indianapolis and got rained out in everything else. I don't know what her full schedule was to be.
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Old 09-29-16, 04:57 PM
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I like it! Sounds like an evening at Hellyer!
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Old 09-29-16, 05:52 PM
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I don't get it...seems pretty boring to have the Omnium comprised of four pretty similar events.
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Old 09-29-16, 06:01 PM
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Suggestion I've read is to make it more spectator friendly.
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Old 09-29-16, 06:05 PM
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Political??? Stick it to the Brits. Having 4 mass start races means the outcome of the omnium is less predictable. For example, Laura Trott scores her wins/second places in the individual omnium races generating a lead and does good but not great in the mass start events. At least that is how Rio played out

For masters track national and worlds, there is no omnium just individual and team events. Elite track nationals has an omnium that includes individual events...at least it did.

At LAVRA timed events at Carson, I may do team sprint and the 500 in the morning and team pursuit and individual pursuit in the afternoon.

Two years ago, Hellyer offered a timed race omnium - flying lap, 500, kilo and 2k pursuit. There were 3 of us in my group slugging it out. By the pursuit, it was a death march and the pursuit times totally stunk up the place.
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Old 09-29-16, 06:36 PM
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I can understand the desire to compact it into one day. And I'm generally fine with the new combo.

I personally would have kept the kilo, though (at expense of Tempo I guess... I would say Elimination, but I know most people like that more than I do). It seems to me that kilo the PERFECT event for an IO. a) It is a short enough to hold spectators attention (4k might as well be croquet). b) It is a sprint, but with an element of endurance. I guess they don't care, since the IO was already 100% an enduro's world.

I'm just a fan of the kilo. I think it is such a unique test.
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Old 09-29-16, 07:03 PM
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I hope they realize that this is a pretty boring schedule. Maybe instead of the Tempo, they should have included the Snowball. That at least livens things up a bit from the spectators point of view.
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Old 09-29-16, 11:00 PM
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The Glasgow World Cup has a different program ofevents
https://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/N...09_Neutral.pdf
No men's omnium
Men's individual pursuit

Perhaps venues are free to set up their own programs to some extent.
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Old 09-29-16, 11:17 PM
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Originally Posted by sarals View Post
Ignorance showing again, but does one have to do all of the events at worlds and nats? You can pick and choose, right?
For the elite world track championships each nation is allotted a certain number of entries for each event but nations and riders have to qualify.
See UCI regulation 9.2.022 for details. https://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/R...-E_English.PDF

I'm not sure if the same rules apply to world cup events.

For the masters world championships there are no restrictions on who may enter as I understand at this time. I'm a cat 4 and thinking of riding the LA world champs ITTs (cost is the primary determinant).
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Old 09-30-16, 01:43 AM
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I would be fine with this if they added back regular 1K/500m and I pursuits again.
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Old 09-30-16, 07:46 AM
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I don't like the changes for the sake of the event, but it definitely works in my favor!
I'm glad to lose the flying lap and kilo, neutral on losing the pursuit, and I'm perfectly fine with having all four events on the same day Maybe I'll sign up for the event at nationals in 2017.
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