High speed blowout
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 10
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
High speed blowout
While looking over my bike to try and locate a barely audible intermittent noise I discovered a bulge and small slit on the side of my rear tire. I'm glad I found it, have ordered a new tire and plan a closer inspection before I ride in the future. I weigh about 200lbs and ride a heavy steel touring bike, a Salsa Marrakesh, on what I consider a hilly route. I enjoy the downhills and usually just let gravity take over, top speed according to my Cyclemeter app around 30mph. I don't have the gears to go faster if I wanted to. I ride pretty much the same route all the time, which includes a bridge on the steepest downhill with sharp bumps at each end. I unweight the bars and saddle in anticipation of the bumps but still experience considerable jarring. I plan to ease off on the speed in the future. Here's my question: how would you handle or attempt to handle your bike if you had a high speed blowout?
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 12,904
Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder
Mentioned: 129 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4806 Post(s)
Liked 3,928 Times
in
2,553 Posts
If your tire stays on and the road only sees rubber, not the rim CF or aluminum. it is just a matter of slowing to a stop, (Do not use that wheel for your braking if on clinchers.) If the rim contacts the road, you are effectively riding on ice and those skills will be needed to stay upright. If the tire comes off the rim, things are going to h*** and a hand basket very fast. That tire will not make it through the stays or fork, locking up that wheel.
I hare had a clincher come off the rim. Rear, First I was riding on the rim. Did my best to gently steer the bike around the slight bend and stay away from the curb. Managed to slow a few MPH to probably low 20s. I had my weight forward and a gentle grip on the bars. (Remember - riding on ice and trying to stay off a curb.) Suddenly rear wheel locked up and I was tossed over the bars. Hard helmet hit, broken collarbone and ribs and an acre of bruises and road rash on both sides.
I've stopped riding old clinchers to save money and utilize the tread miles. When my current rims wear out I am going to replace them with tubular rims and go that route. (Well glued tubulars do not come off, even if you shoot them to shreds with a 50 mm machine gun. I rode tubulars 25 years. I've done routine stops from over 40 MPH after full blowouts.)
You don't hear this said, but I am certain one of the reasons that so many pro teams still ride tubulars is because the riders would rather be on them when they flat on mountain descents. A wheel change vs perhaps an ambulance ride and maybe a shortened career.
I hare had a clincher come off the rim. Rear, First I was riding on the rim. Did my best to gently steer the bike around the slight bend and stay away from the curb. Managed to slow a few MPH to probably low 20s. I had my weight forward and a gentle grip on the bars. (Remember - riding on ice and trying to stay off a curb.) Suddenly rear wheel locked up and I was tossed over the bars. Hard helmet hit, broken collarbone and ribs and an acre of bruises and road rash on both sides.
I've stopped riding old clinchers to save money and utilize the tread miles. When my current rims wear out I am going to replace them with tubular rims and go that route. (Well glued tubulars do not come off, even if you shoot them to shreds with a 50 mm machine gun. I rode tubulars 25 years. I've done routine stops from over 40 MPH after full blowouts.)
You don't hear this said, but I am certain one of the reasons that so many pro teams still ride tubulars is because the riders would rather be on them when they flat on mountain descents. A wheel change vs perhaps an ambulance ride and maybe a shortened career.
#3
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 10
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Thanks 79p. Just the kind of information I was looking for. I have fewer worries a flat on the front but my guess is that everything gets more problematic. Bill
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: Maryland
Posts: 1,380
Bikes: 1982 Bianchi Sport SX, Rayleigh Tamland 1, Rans V-Rex recumbent, Fuji MTB, 80's Cannondale MTB with BBSHD ebike motor
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 668 Post(s)
Liked 529 Times
in
355 Posts
I've had a front tire instantly depressurize while doing maybe 30 mph when I rolled the sidewall over a rock. Bike instantly got squirrelly. Like said above pretend you are on ice, don't try to steer and gently brake to a stop. Just no sudden movements or maneuvers.
If it happens in a turn it would be bad.
If it happens in a turn it would be bad.
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Valley Forge: Birthplace of Freedom
Posts: 1,299
Bikes: Novara Safari, CAAD9, WABI Classic, WABI Thunder
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 366 Post(s)
Liked 457 Times
in
240 Posts
What size tires are you using?
__________________
Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong. Let all that you do be done in love.
Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong. Let all that you do be done in love.
#7
Thread Killer
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 12,435
Bikes: 15 Kinesis Racelight 4S, 76 Motebecane Gran Jubilée, 17 Dedacciai Gladiatore2, 12 Breezer Venturi, 09 Dahon Mariner, 12 Mercier Nano, 95 DeKerf Team SL, 19 Tern Rally, 21 Breezer Doppler Cafe+, 19 T-Lab X3, 91 Serotta CII, 23 3T Strada
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3136 Post(s)
Liked 1,704 Times
in
1,029 Posts
79pmooney strange for a rear wheel lockup to send you over the bars, but sometimes those things happen so fast, we can’t really tell what the
exact was.
Anyway, the term “blowout” evokes a sudden,
total loss of pressure, and it rarely happens like that. I prefer to think of it as simply flatting, which mentally sets us up for a more manageable situation! Also, I’ve been riding
for around 35 years, and I cannot recall ever having a catastrophic flat experience or to have been riding with anyone who did. I’ve had or seen pedals snap off, cranks break, handlebars break, dropouts break, fork legs slip in the crown, wheels taco, spokes break, derailleurs jam in spokes and downtubes bend and break, but I’ve never seen a flat put anyone on the
floor, so just a little perspective on the threat level there.
Usually leaks are slow, and you can feel or hear them before they’re totally flat. In that scenario, as suggested by others, I unweight the bum tire, slow as gently and quickly as possible in a straight line. If you’re at high speed and flat, there really are no tricks to managing it, I don’t think, and you’ll just have to rely on your sense of balance and handling skills to manage whatever happens. Stay cool, stay relaxed...think good thoughts. Most
likely it’ll be non-traumatic.
If you’ve got a “doomsday prepper” mindset, ride tubeless for sure.
exact was.
Anyway, the term “blowout” evokes a sudden,
total loss of pressure, and it rarely happens like that. I prefer to think of it as simply flatting, which mentally sets us up for a more manageable situation! Also, I’ve been riding
for around 35 years, and I cannot recall ever having a catastrophic flat experience or to have been riding with anyone who did. I’ve had or seen pedals snap off, cranks break, handlebars break, dropouts break, fork legs slip in the crown, wheels taco, spokes break, derailleurs jam in spokes and downtubes bend and break, but I’ve never seen a flat put anyone on the
floor, so just a little perspective on the threat level there.
Usually leaks are slow, and you can feel or hear them before they’re totally flat. In that scenario, as suggested by others, I unweight the bum tire, slow as gently and quickly as possible in a straight line. If you’re at high speed and flat, there really are no tricks to managing it, I don’t think, and you’ll just have to rely on your sense of balance and handling skills to manage whatever happens. Stay cool, stay relaxed...think good thoughts. Most
likely it’ll be non-traumatic.
If you’ve got a “doomsday prepper” mindset, ride tubeless for sure.
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 7,877
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6963 Post(s)
Liked 10,962 Times
in
4,688 Posts
I’ve had that happen while traveling downhill at over 30 mph… Not a big deal, as long as it is the rear tire. Hit your brakes, focus on your balance, and stop.
Likes For Koyote:
#9
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 8,688
Mentioned: 46 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1074 Post(s)
Liked 295 Times
in
222 Posts
I’ve had a steel bead break once. That caused - for the purpose - instant shredding and deflation of the tire. But it was a rear. And the other bead held the tire on the rim long enough for me to bring the bike to a halt.
Regarding tubulars staying on while deflated - maybe that’s a kinda-sorta argument for tubeless setups? They’re often a tight fit, which should improve chances of the tire staying on.
Regarding tubulars staying on while deflated - maybe that’s a kinda-sorta argument for tubeless setups? They’re often a tight fit, which should improve chances of the tire staying on.
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 7,569
Mentioned: 54 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1851 Post(s)
Liked 678 Times
in
429 Posts
79pmooney strange for a rear wheel lockup to send you over the bars, but sometimes those things happen so fast, we can’t really tell what the
exact was.
exact was.
#11
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,960
Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace
Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10424 Post(s)
Liked 11,896 Times
in
6,094 Posts
So far, I've been lucky. The closest I've come to disaster was on a fast descent where I hit God's Own Pothole hiding in the dappled sunlight right before a turn. I hit the pothole (*WHAM!*), the bike stabilized and turned perfectly, THEN the front tire blew out. I braked with the rear brake to a stop without problems.
The worst part was that I was only 1 mile into a 4 mile descent and the casing was damaged, and this was before cell phones. I had to nurse the tire to the bottom of the hill and into town to find a phone booth for The Call Of Shame.
The worst part was that I was only 1 mile into a 4 mile descent and the casing was damaged, and this was before cell phones. I had to nurse the tire to the bottom of the hill and into town to find a phone booth for The Call Of Shame.
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."
"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."
"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
#12
Senior Member
Those are good, reliable tires and well suited to a Marrakesh. Good work spotting the problem before it happened. It would be impossible to inspect tires too often.
I have witnessed a front blowout at 50mph. The rider kept the bike up. Everyone present was amazed. One in the group got on his knees and said a little prayer. So it it can happen and you could be fine. It was a tubular. Hope I am never tested that way and hope you aren’t either.
I have witnessed a front blowout at 50mph. The rider kept the bike up. Everyone present was amazed. One in the group got on his knees and said a little prayer. So it it can happen and you could be fine. It was a tubular. Hope I am never tested that way and hope you aren’t either.
#13
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: NWNJ
Posts: 3,704
Bikes: Road bike is a Carbon Bianchi C2C & Grandis (1980's), Gary Fisher Mt Bike, Trek Tandem & Mongoose SS MTB circa 1992.
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 722 Post(s)
Liked 353 Times
in
226 Posts
While looking over my bike to try and locate a barely audible intermittent noise I discovered a bulge and small slit on the side of my rear tire. I'm glad I found it, have ordered a new tire and plan a closer inspection before I ride in the future. I weigh about 200lbs and ride a heavy steel touring bike, a Salsa Marrakesh, on what I consider a hilly route. I enjoy the downhills and usually just let gravity take over, top speed according to my Cyclemeter app around 30mph. I don't have the gears to go faster if I wanted to. I ride pretty much the same route all the time, which includes a bridge on the steepest downhill with sharp bumps at each end. I unweight the bars and saddle in anticipation of the bumps but still experience considerable jarring. I plan to ease off on the speed in the future. Here's my question: how would you handle or attempt to handle your bike if you had a high speed blowout?
very scarey. tube blew tire toast....bad day. but never fell.
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Central Fl
Posts: 137
Bikes: Argon 18 Gallium, GF 29er, old Trek Madone
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 31 Post(s)
Liked 47 Times
in
29 Posts
A rear tubeless tire blew off the rim of my bicycle at 25 mph on level tarmac. Managed to stay in the bicycle lane and stopped ok. Destroyed the rim, but frankly, since I didn’t biff, I as ok with that.
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: northern Deep South
Posts: 8,901
Bikes: Fuji Touring, Novara Randonee
Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2604 Post(s)
Liked 1,928 Times
in
1,210 Posts
All my blowouts (so far) have been on level ground or gentle slopes. The worse, a couple months ago, was just after a good hill, so I was doing 25-30 mph when the front blew. I was able to keep it tracking straight until the rear brake could stop me. It's a bit disconcerting any time it blows, because if you lean the bike you'll hit (slick) aluminum rim and then you'll need good bike handling skills to stay up.
I've had advanced notice on less than half of the blowouts I've had -- tires with a bubble, or a cut, or a nasty large puncture once. I did have a batch of bad tires, where all three I'd bought at once delaminated after a couple hundred miles. Overall, having a blowout is unlikely, but it does happen.
I've had advanced notice on less than half of the blowouts I've had -- tires with a bubble, or a cut, or a nasty large puncture once. I did have a batch of bad tires, where all three I'd bought at once delaminated after a couple hundred miles. Overall, having a blowout is unlikely, but it does happen.
#16
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Valley Forge: Birthplace of Freedom
Posts: 1,299
Bikes: Novara Safari, CAAD9, WABI Classic, WABI Thunder
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 366 Post(s)
Liked 457 Times
in
240 Posts
I had one massive blowout I recall. This last Spring I had just finished a large downhill and headed up a long hill. Going about 5 mph the front tube exploded blowing the tire off the rim. Definitely would have been catastrophic if it happened a minute before.
A few hours later at work the maintenance man came in. The rear exploded the same way.
A few days before I replaced 50c tires with 38c Marathon Supremes. I used the larger tubes in the smaller tires. Best I can tell, it was due to using the larger, and older, tubes. Or older plastic rim strips which were hardened. Replaced the rim strips with cloth and have had no problems since.
A few hours later at work the maintenance man came in. The rear exploded the same way.
A few days before I replaced 50c tires with 38c Marathon Supremes. I used the larger tubes in the smaller tires. Best I can tell, it was due to using the larger, and older, tubes. Or older plastic rim strips which were hardened. Replaced the rim strips with cloth and have had no problems since.
#17
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Lebanon (Liberty Hill), CT
Posts: 8,473
Bikes: CAAD 12, MASI Gran Criterium S, Colnago World Cup CX & Guru steel
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1743 Post(s)
Liked 1,281 Times
in
740 Posts
I've had a front tire instantly depressurize while doing maybe 30 mph when I rolled the sidewall over a rock. Bike instantly got squirrelly. Like said above pretend you are on ice, don't try to steer and gently brake to a stop. Just no sudden movements or maneuvers.
If it happens in a turn it would be bad.
If it happens in a turn it would be bad.
Last edited by bruce19; 12-09-20 at 10:34 AM.
#18
Full Member
While looking over my bike to try and locate a barely audible intermittent noise I discovered a bulge and small slit on the side of my rear tire. I'm glad I found it, have ordered a new tire and plan a closer inspection before I ride in the future. I weigh about 200lbs and ride a heavy steel touring bike, a Salsa Marrakesh, on what I consider a hilly route. I enjoy the downhills and usually just let gravity take over, top speed according to my Cyclemeter app around 30mph. I don't have the gears to go faster if I wanted to. I ride pretty much the same route all the time, which includes a bridge on the steepest downhill with sharp bumps at each end. I unweight the bars and saddle in anticipation of the bumps but still experience considerable jarring. I plan to ease off on the speed in the future. Here's my question: how would you handle or attempt to handle your bike if you had a high speed blowout?
#19
Junior Member
Last September a man died while riding the Big Dam 100 ride in Little Rock AR. Had a flat on a down hill section and lost control. He was the president of a local cycling club.
#20
Senior Member
Thinking about this one some more. What to do?
Several in the thread have survived this. I saw it. So we know it can turn out OK. Remember that. Don’t panic. Also don’t try to accomplish much. Mostly you need to rely on the inherent stability of your bike. Let your bike find that stability.
Most of what you can do is preventative. You are already on top of good tires and good inspection. That Marrakesh is made for carrying a lot of load. If loaded keep it balanced and snug. Also if loaded your 30mph is quite fast, maybe use the brakes a lot, stop to let them cool off. If it is to be a long and challenging descent consider using the manual dropper post - get off and lower the saddle. If you are not likely to do that, learn the technique of hanging your butt out behind the saddle on the steep stuff. It is way more stable that way. However you go downhill ride within your capabilities. There are days for pushing the envelope and most days safety first. Only push the envelope when the bike is unladen, the weather is perfect, you feel fresh and fantastic. 30mph is not all that fast, a lot of us do that on the flat, or did when young. Most of us can do it on little tiny hills. Downhill crashes are always worse, the likely case is still only you break a collarbone. Which heals quick and is not that big a deal. Whatever you do avoid high speed crashes in traffic. If such a thought worries you, slow down.
When you slow down remember that prolonged heavy braking heats the rim and will contribute to the blowout you were hoping to prevent. Stop once in a while and enjoy the view while the rims cool. Feel the rim and get an idea what sort of braking does this. Discs? They overheat too.
Several in the thread have survived this. I saw it. So we know it can turn out OK. Remember that. Don’t panic. Also don’t try to accomplish much. Mostly you need to rely on the inherent stability of your bike. Let your bike find that stability.
Most of what you can do is preventative. You are already on top of good tires and good inspection. That Marrakesh is made for carrying a lot of load. If loaded keep it balanced and snug. Also if loaded your 30mph is quite fast, maybe use the brakes a lot, stop to let them cool off. If it is to be a long and challenging descent consider using the manual dropper post - get off and lower the saddle. If you are not likely to do that, learn the technique of hanging your butt out behind the saddle on the steep stuff. It is way more stable that way. However you go downhill ride within your capabilities. There are days for pushing the envelope and most days safety first. Only push the envelope when the bike is unladen, the weather is perfect, you feel fresh and fantastic. 30mph is not all that fast, a lot of us do that on the flat, or did when young. Most of us can do it on little tiny hills. Downhill crashes are always worse, the likely case is still only you break a collarbone. Which heals quick and is not that big a deal. Whatever you do avoid high speed crashes in traffic. If such a thought worries you, slow down.
When you slow down remember that prolonged heavy braking heats the rim and will contribute to the blowout you were hoping to prevent. Stop once in a while and enjoy the view while the rims cool. Feel the rim and get an idea what sort of braking does this. Discs? They overheat too.
#21
Thread Killer
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 12,435
Bikes: 15 Kinesis Racelight 4S, 76 Motebecane Gran Jubilée, 17 Dedacciai Gladiatore2, 12 Breezer Venturi, 09 Dahon Mariner, 12 Mercier Nano, 95 DeKerf Team SL, 19 Tern Rally, 21 Breezer Doppler Cafe+, 19 T-Lab X3, 91 Serotta CII, 23 3T Strada
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3136 Post(s)
Liked 1,704 Times
in
1,029 Posts
I'll remind everyone that the term "rolling a tire" comes from the tubular days. For flat security, tubeless is absolutely the best. If a tubeless doesn't seal, it'll slow the leak and it won't roll the tire.
#22
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 8,688
Mentioned: 46 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1074 Post(s)
Liked 295 Times
in
222 Posts
Tubes have - compared to tires - ”no” structural strength. They’ll expand until the tire stop them. Try inflating one outside the tire and see how big it goes at no discernible resistance at the pump. It’s not that a bigger tube allows more pressure on the tire.
Too big tubes can cause trouble though. Mainly through being more prone to getting trapped under the bead, but also by ending up in folds or creases that can lead to punctures. The typical failure mode of a tube getting trapped under the bead isn’t that the tube lifts the bead off the rim, but that the tube herniates out from under the bead and ruptures.
Once the pressure goes it may not take much to ride the tire off the rim.
While bad rim strips can certainly cause issues, it seems unlikely that both would fail so nearly simultaneously. Maybe If both were technically already overdue, and the tire swap caused them to shift around enough to expose a spoke hole, spoke nipple.
Likes For dabac:
#23
Grupetto Bob
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Seattle-ish
Posts: 6,214
Bikes: Bikey McBike Face
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2581 Post(s)
Liked 5,636 Times
in
2,920 Posts
See the thread Top Speed on the road bike forum if you want to see some crazy speeds. A blowout or flat at those speeds would give you a lifetime of road rash if you survived.
__________________
Road 🚴🏾♂️ & Mountain 🚵🏾♂️
Road 🚴🏾♂️ & Mountain 🚵🏾♂️
#24
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 5,972
Bikes: 2015 Charge Plug, 2007 Dahon Boardwalk, 1997 Nishiki Blazer, 1984 Nishiki International, 2006 Felt F65, 1989 Dahon Getaway V
Mentioned: 54 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1364 Post(s)
Liked 1,677 Times
in
827 Posts
I'm 58, but the 12-year-old in me wants to grab a bunch of old tires and inner tubes, and some long-fuse firecrackers and practice recovering from front and rear blowouts at speed.
#25
Dirty Heathen
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: MC-778, 6250 fsw
Posts: 2,182
Bikes: 1997 Cannondale, 1976 Bridgestone, 1998 SoftRide, 1989 Klein, 1989 Black Lightning #0033
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 889 Post(s)
Liked 906 Times
in
534 Posts
The ( most often) rear wheel goes flat, or otherwise looses traction and slides out from under the bike; if it never regains grip, the bike just slides out until it flops down on the ‘low side’
If the tire slides out to the side, but then suddenly regains traction, momentum will try to stand the bike up right, often violently, and can easily pitch the rider off the ‘high-side’.
It’s not exactly an over-the-bars ‘endo’ but you’re still gonna get flung.