DanBF

Do I need a washer between the front rack attachment point on the frame and the bicycle rack? The bike comes with a bolt, lock washer and a washer installed because I guess it looks nicer that looking at a threaded bare hole. When I purchased the basket another washer wasn't provided so I'm assuming I don't need to go out and purchase additional washers. I want to check with you guys to make sure I am installing the washers in the correct order. I plan to install it this way: allen head bolt > lock washer > washer > backet arm > frame. Is that the correct way to attach everything?

rumrunn6

no & yes. your plan sounds good

dsbrantjr

Earn style points for greasing all threaded fasteners, they will drive easier and remove easier. Properly-torqued fasteners tend to stay put better but you should check periodically, rack hardware especially.
It looks as if the end of the strut may interfere with the weld bead, I would hit it (the strut) with a file if that was the case, so that the strut sits square against the mating surface.

dedhed

AS stated the weld looks to stand proud of the mount. You may need an additional flat washer between the frame and rack strut to gain clearance of the weld if you'd rather not file the strut.

I personally use blue loctite on rack mounting bolts as they tend to loosen on our crap roads.

zandoval 

Wow... Great observation, I did not see that. Ya might want to consider adding another washer. What ever the case I would certainly cut out a small piece of clear Gorilla tape and put it over the hole to maybe add some paint protection properties...

dedhed

I wonder why they welded it on that side instead of just top & bottom.

soyabean

The hardware and instructions supplied by big name racks like axiom, bontrager, do not indicate a washer to be sandwiched between the bike and rack.

Lock washers are usually not supplied or required.

But you can do whatever you want, there is no harm in adding extra things to the fastener, including blue loctite.

I install a lot of used racks onto bikes, and the only new fastenrs I provide are the M5 or M6 hex bolt with one washer.

pdlamb

The only thing I'd be concerned about is to make sure your bolt is long enough to have adequate threads in the frame when you've got however many washers you choose and the rack in between.

Iride01 

You can file the weld, but then you mess up the paint. I'd put as many washers as it takes on the inside of the rack arms to keep them off the weld. And buy a longer socket head cap screw if necessary.

rumrunn6

brand & model (TBD) might be a clue

1962schwinn

A year ago I put fenders and rear rack on my new bike. In places where any metal would have been touching painted parts of frame I used fiber washers in between. Pretty thin, tough and come in a variety of sizes. Home Depot has a good supply, probably the other home improvement stores too.

soyabean

Correct. One can also use hard nylon washers, also great for those that don't want any metal-2-metal contact.

I don't do this to bikes I flip, I don't bother to do this with my own personal bikes, but it definitely works and does not compromise a fastener in anyways to those that want it.

Some folks use pieces of inner tubing, but it's too thick and too soft, but works somewhat if everything is tight enough.

guy153

It looks redneck not to weld all the way around things.

soyabean

Agreed.

I was waiting for someone else to also speak up about it, so I wouldn't be the only one that was right.

guy153

Acceptable on a BBQ bought at the garden centre, or on the chassis of a Tesla car. But not on a bike frame.

dedhed

Redneck is adding unnecessary beads in a spot that interferes with the intended use.

Not seeing any unneeded braze or weld on the fleet.

soyabean

Yup.

Folks that don't do any MIG/TIG weld just never get it.

The thicker and more weld there is, the stronger. That's why it's so apparent at the tube butts.

When you can't see any welds, it may as well been glued there with epoxy.

soyabean

These are photos of eyelets used to keep rear panniers balanced, they do not take load, as it is the axle eyelet boss taking the weight.

The OP shows an eyelet for a front pannier rack which is constantly stress twisting and turning from just steering alone.

southpier

"redneck" is also stacking washers. washers have the potential to introduce slip, and sometimes that's not desirable. consider buying an assortment of spacers in plastic, nylon, or aluminum. they're helpful to have around.

Amazon.com: EEEEE 151pcs Nylon Spacers Round Plastic Spacers Wall Plate spacers for Screws Hardware spacers Standoff Assortment Kit, OD 11mm ID 6.2mm Length 3mm 4mm 5mm 8mm 10mm 12mm 15mm 18mm 20mm 25mm for M6 : Industrial & Scientific

soyabean

Completely fine for pannier racks, which is the subject.

I do it all the time when necessary.

A M5 bolt fastening a pannier rack whether with one or 4 washers isn't going to care. This isn't a crank bolt.

southpier

guess you fixed me!

guy153

Those are all steel frames where those things are usually attached with something like silver solder (or another brazing material), which just flows into wherever the braze-on is touching (or actually into any small gap less than some fraction of a millimetre). Very nice and neat. But it isn't a weld at all. You put flux everywhere, heat the whole thing up, and just touch it with the rod. The braze metal melts and flows into the joint.

OP's frame is aluminium where usually everything is just actually welded. It would be perfectly strong enough to have left gaps at the sides, but it looks a bit sloppy.

guy153

Basically yes although there is no point in excessive build-up. The joint should be a bit stronger than the rest of the tube. A good TIG weld will achieve that, with a fillet width about the same as the wall-thickness of the tube, or thereabouts (it should be a bit thicker on a steel frame as the rod is usually mild steel not Cromoly). And for something like a cap on the end of a tube you can sand it all smooth because it's mainly cosmetic anyway.

But aesthetically speaking not welding all the way around those rack mounts would look a bit Walmart to me.

soyabean

Which is what you would expect on something like outdoor steel patio chairs or the sort, just a few welds here and there.

The weld bead on the front of those eyelets are no larger than the beads on the frame of the bike, so that is acceptable.

An exceptional amount of stress will be there for this pannier rack or basket in the front because it's to be mounted entirely on the tube only, unlike the usual stays to distribute weight onto the fork as typically expected. It's basically an apartment patio that is hanging entirely on the ledger with nothing underneath.

guy153

It must surely have another attachment point? Either up on the handlebar or perhaps going down to the fork or even the fork ends. Or else the rack would just swing down (even if you did the bolt up so tight it was almost breaking or stripping the threads).