Newbie-brake fade question
10-26-22, 10:33 AM
#1
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Newbie-brake fade question
Just purchased a new Trek Verve 2 Disc and when applying full pressure to the rear brake handle the bike stops quickly but the rear wheel doesn't lock up. Is this normal or should the brakes be rechecked or bled? It is impossible to make the rear tire skid....
Last edited by mdo53; 10-26-22 at 10:37 AM.
10-26-22, 10:46 AM
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Have the brake pads and discs been bedded in properly?
10-26-22, 10:54 AM
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That depends. How much do you weigh?
10-26-22, 10:55 AM
#4
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This is not normal. The rear wheel should be extremely easy to skid even with rim brakes, let alone discs. Since you just bought the bike it should be the bike shop's responsibility to look at it for you.
Even the most whale fattie should be able to easily skid the rear wheel.
Even the most whale fattie should be able to easily skid the rear wheel.
10-26-22, 11:27 AM
#5
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6' and 227#... the tech I spoke with didn't seem to think it was an issue. I'll take it back and have them make it right.
10-26-22, 11:47 AM
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The rear wheel locks up easier than the front. That's partly because the majority of your weight is dynamically shifted to the front wheel when you brake. So it takes much more effort to lock up the wheel.
Try not to lock your back brake up. That'll only make your rear wheel have less braking force and in a rapid deceleration your bike might try to swap ends as the frame rotates around the steerer tube because the front now has more braking force. I know about this from experience. I think I bounced twice if not three times after coming unstuck from the bike. The child in me said "do it again"! The old person in me was thankful all I had to do was get back on the bike and finish the next 20 or so miles of the ride
Try not to lock your back brake up. That'll only make your rear wheel have less braking force and in a rapid deceleration your bike might try to swap ends as the frame rotates around the steerer tube because the front now has more braking force. I know about this from experience. I think I bounced twice if not three times after coming unstuck from the bike. The child in me said "do it again"! The old person in me was thankful all I had to do was get back on the bike and finish the next 20 or so miles of the ride
10-26-22, 03:15 PM
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Unless you are descending some big hills and only using the rear brake you don't have brake 'fade'. You should be able to lock up the rear at will. The 'tech' is clueless if he says your brake is normal. The only 2 reasons are either contamination on the pads/rotor or the brake needs to be bled. I'm guessing that this bike came out of the box and was slapped together without the brake lines being shortened or the system bled. I'd bring it back and not leave with it til the rear brake easily locks up the wheel. Is this a Trek owned store or an IBD that's a Trek dealer?
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10-26-22, 03:28 PM
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Still, you don't want to lock your wheel up on purpose if your intention is to stop as quickly as possible.
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10-26-22, 05:32 PM
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Unless you are descending some big hills and only using the rear brake you don't have brake 'fade'. You should be able to lock up the rear at will. The 'tech' is clueless if he says your brake is normal. The only 2 reasons are either contamination on the pads/rotor or the brake needs to be bled. I'm guessing that this bike came out of the box and was slapped together without the brake lines being shortened or the system bled. I'd bring it back and not leave with it til the rear brake easily locks up the wheel. Is this a Trek owned store or an IBD that's a Trek dealer?
See your dealer and ask for a better mechanic
You are not experiencing brake fade
Last edited by alcjphil; 10-27-22 at 09:51 AM.
10-26-22, 09:45 PM
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Being as blunt as possible.
A bike whose brakes cannot lock and skid the rear wheel is practically, and LEGALLY, an unsafe bike.
------
The accepted standard, and law in most states, is that the rear brake can lock the rear wheel and cause a skid.
This isn't an invitation to skid and kill your tires, but having the ability means that you can stop as short as traction allows. Then it's up to you to modulate and use your brakes effectively, up to the limits of traction.
To be clear, the front brake provides more actual stopping power, but that doesn't free the rear brake from doing what's called for.
Consider the legal implications. A "couldn't stop in time" accident had 4 possible contributing factors. Traction, braking power, rider error, or the time element. If there are injuries, the first thing to check are the brakes, and rule them in or out as a contributing factor.
IMO any mechanic that dismisses this is useless because he's unable or unwilling to do right by his customer.
BTW - If you want to stir the pot, email Trek, saying your brake isn't right, and the shop mechanic says that's just the way they are.
A bike whose brakes cannot lock and skid the rear wheel is practically, and LEGALLY, an unsafe bike.
------
The accepted standard, and law in most states, is that the rear brake can lock the rear wheel and cause a skid.
This isn't an invitation to skid and kill your tires, but having the ability means that you can stop as short as traction allows. Then it's up to you to modulate and use your brakes effectively, up to the limits of traction.
To be clear, the front brake provides more actual stopping power, but that doesn't free the rear brake from doing what's called for.
Consider the legal implications. A "couldn't stop in time" accident had 4 possible contributing factors. Traction, braking power, rider error, or the time element. If there are injuries, the first thing to check are the brakes, and rule them in or out as a contributing factor.
IMO any mechanic that dismisses this is useless because he's unable or unwilling to do right by his customer.
BTW - If you want to stir the pot, email Trek, saying your brake isn't right, and the shop mechanic says that's just the way they are.
Last edited by FBinNY; 10-26-22 at 09:48 PM.
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10-27-22, 09:01 AM
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(Chuckling) I'd be tempted to do this just to see what the response time is. BTW, make sure you say it's the brake on your new Trek bike that isn't right.
10-28-22, 06:51 PM
#12
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I called the store today and left a message.....within 30 minutes I received a text to bring the bike in tomorrow.
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10-29-22, 10:42 AM
#13
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Visited the bike store early this morning and told the person that greeted me that I purchased the bike two weeks ago and the brakes would not skid. This person said he never heard of any state bike laws requiring a bike's brakes to skid. I showed him SC Law Section 56-5-3490 on my iPhone and read it to him " A bicycle must be equipped with a brake that will enable the bicyclist to make the brakes skid on dry, level, clean pavement". He seemed confused so I used the example that should a careless driver fail to yield right-of-way or I wreck the unsafe and faulty bike that they sold me, resulting in injury to myself or someone else, the word attorney could possibly come into play. We have an understanding. Once the bike tech finished, the salesman asked me to test drive the bike. The brakes were much better and would skid. The bike tech approached and told me we were all newbies and explained bedding process and offered additional adjustments if I desired.
I purchased a front light and water bottle holder while waiting. The salesman installed them and included a free water bottle for my inconvenience. No need to call or write Trek, issue resolved and I am happy.
I purchased a front light and water bottle holder while waiting. The salesman installed them and included a free water bottle for my inconvenience. No need to call or write Trek, issue resolved and I am happy.
10-29-22, 03:16 PM
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Who’s “all newbies?”
10-29-22, 08:18 PM
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Visited the bike store early this morning and told the person that greeted me that I purchased the bike two weeks ago and the brakes would not skid. This person said he never heard of any state bike laws requiring a bike's brakes to skid. I showed him SC Law Section 56-5-3490 on my iPhone and read it to him " A bicycle must be equipped with a brake that will enable the bicyclist to make the brakes skid on dry, level, clean pavement". He seemed confused so I used the example that should a careless driver fail to yield right-of-way or I wreck the unsafe and faulty bike that they sold me, resulting in injury to myself or someone else, the word attorney could possibly come into play. We have an understanding. Once the bike tech finished, the salesman asked me to test drive the bike. The brakes were much better and would skid. The bike tech approached and told me we were all newbies and explained bedding process and offered additional adjustments if I desired.
I purchased a front light and water bottle holder while waiting. The salesman installed them and included a free water bottle for my inconvenience. No need to call or write Trek, issue resolved and I am happy.
I purchased a front light and water bottle holder while waiting. The salesman installed them and included a free water bottle for my inconvenience. No need to call or write Trek, issue resolved and I am happy.
10-29-22, 11:44 PM
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Actually, what it took was a bit of firmness from the customer.
But it brings up a question that maybe some who work retail might answer.
Given that all it needed was proper bedding of the pads and rotor, I wonder whether it's SOP to send new bikes without doing that, or at least giving newbies an explanation so they can do it for themselves.
But it brings up a question that maybe some who work retail might answer.
Given that all it needed was proper bedding of the pads and rotor, I wonder whether it's SOP to send new bikes without doing that, or at least giving newbies an explanation so they can do it for themselves.
