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'78 Raleigh Super Course build ~ SACRILEGE?

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'78 Raleigh Super Course build ~ SACRILEGE?

Old 08-04-22, 09:11 AM
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tjfastback66
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'78 Raleigh Super Course build ~ SACRILEGE?

So I picked up this 1978 Raleigh Super Course a few months ago and just got done with the frame cleaning.
Patina is not too bad and the frame is beautiful IMHO. The problem was that the wheelset did not match
Then I ran across an interesting wheelset for $20.00 and proceeded to clean them up.
Would it be Sacrilege to put Schwinn wheels on a vintage Raleigh?

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Old 08-04-22, 10:18 AM
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I think it's fine if they fit. They certainly don't have to be the last wheels on there. My supercourse has a three speed rear hub.
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Old 08-04-22, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by tjfastback66 View Post
So I picked up this 1978 Raleigh Super Course a few months ago and just got done with the frame cleaning.
Patina is not too bad and the frame is beautiful IMHO. The problem was that the wheelset did not match
Then I ran across an interesting wheelset for $20.00 and proceeded to clean them up.
Would it be Sacrilege to put Schwinn wheels on a vintage Raleigh?

No sacrilege per se but I really don't don't care for deep V's or modern spoking on any C+V, or much of anything else so.....
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Old 08-04-22, 12:35 PM
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Hey, I'm using Dura Ace on a Cinelli, so who am I to say what's sacrilegious? Use what you got. If you don't like 'em down the road, they're easy enough to change out.
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Old 08-04-22, 12:51 PM
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What would be crazy is to try and build up a Super Course with all OEM components. Search through our archives and you'll find them built up as fixies, triple cranks, 3 speed, upright or drop bars, etc.
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Old 08-04-22, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by smd4 View Post
Hey, I'm using Dura Ace on a Cinelli, so who am I to say what's sacrilegious? Use what you got. If you don't like 'em down the road, they're easy enough to change out.
Change is good!

Originally Posted by merziac View Post
No sacrilege per se but I really don't don't care for deep V's or modern spoking on any C+V, or much of anything else so.....
I get that - but want to judge for myself and follow thru with it..

Originally Posted by gugie View Post
What would be crazy is to try and build up a Super Course with all OEM components. Search through our archives and you'll find them built up as fixies, triple cranks, 3 speed, upright or drop bars, etc.
that is what my "fresh canvas" was to start with $80 Craigs find:

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Old 08-04-22, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by tjfastback66 View Post
I get that - but want to judge for myself and follow thru with it..
No worries, all good, full speed ahead.

I don't think there is a better platform for such a thing, they punch so far above their weight limit that anything goes and almost always goes very well.
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Old 08-04-22, 03:08 PM
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1936 silver king converted to 5 speed with an ultegra RD!
if you end up in hell, you will have lots of company from the folks on this forum!

mid 70's austro daimler

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Old 08-04-22, 07:59 PM
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Super Course Rebuild

Well, maybe I need to go to confession. About 20 years ago I rebuilt an early 70s Carlton Super Course
with flat bars and old DuraAce components. I kept the original Weinmann CP calipers. The bike was great for
the flat, gravel trails in my area. My daughter would ride it when she came home to visit, so I sent the bike
to her in California. She gets a few comments on the bike from those who know. The bike was pretty beat
up when I bought it for probably $20 at a community bike sale, so I didnt feel too bad about rebuilding it.

Bill
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Old 08-04-22, 08:29 PM
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A gold, 1978 Raleigh Super Course was my first "good" bicycle (much like yours, but sized for a human ). I had it for only 3 years before it was stolen from me about a week before I went into the navy, but it took me on a couple epic adventures. As far as I'm concerned, bar-ends are a must, Cyclone derailleurs are hard to beat, and while I was never a huge fan of the concave Weinmann rims, it just ain't right with aero or semi-aero or low spoke count wheels.

Obviously, it's your bike and nobody's going to send the C&V style police out to write you an infraction (as thankfully I've not suffered outright ostracism for any of my several heresies), but that's what section 49 of the peanut gallery has in response to your question.

Obligatory Super Course heresy pictures:



Dig all the crazy cables. Set for 81 speeds on a good day.

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Old 08-05-22, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by tjfastback66 View Post
Change is good!



I get that - but want to judge for myself and follow thru with it..



that is what my "fresh canvas" was to start with $80 Craigs find:

Are these the wheels you started with? You said the wheels "did not match", but I think they are better matches to the frame than the deep-Vs with odd spoking. that you showed.
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Old 08-05-22, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Road Fan View Post
Are these the wheels you started with? You said the wheels "did not match", but I think they are better matches to the frame than the deep-Vs with odd spoking. that you showed.
I think he meant the wheels the bike came with didnt match each other.
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Old 08-05-22, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by smd4 View Post
I think he meant the wheels the bike came with didn’t match each other.
Yes, they were not a matching wheelset. I have a number of wheelset pairs with which to swap out. The original idea was to clean this wheelset up and give it a try.
I generally am a purist especially when it comes to Raleigh I sold them for a local shop back in the '80's. In fact I still have an '83 Raleigh Prestige GS (sold it to myself for $450) LOL.
Our shop absolutely hated Schwinn (pronounced "Schwine" back then). So that is the Sacrilege reference in the OP.

So here is what I got so far:

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Old 08-05-22, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by tjfastback66 View Post
Our shop absolutely hated Schwinn (pronounced "Schwine" back then). So that is the Sacrilege reference in the OP.
And I worked for a Schwinn dealership. We avoided talking about Raleigh altogether. Mostly because we couldnt figure out the right way to pronounce it.
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Old 08-05-22, 06:51 PM
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The essence of a 70's road bike is beautiful to me, adding modern components like those deep V rims with odd spoking pattern ruins it and shouts "look at me", so it's really a matter of "taste". Then there's performance. Would those modern components perform better on a modern frame? Is the mod technology wasted when used on a low tech frame like the S.C.? Are you going to keep the cheap swaged SR crankset?

Is the mish-mosh of parts a matter of convenience or a matter of asserting ones free will? In either case, why ask for opinions and then do it anyway?
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Old 08-05-22, 06:56 PM
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I had Wolber aero rims in 1988. They were pretty deep for the day.
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Old 08-05-22, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by smd4 View Post
And I worked for a Schwinn dealership. We avoided talking about Raleigh altogether. Mostly because we couldnt figure out the right way to pronounce it.
From the late 60s to early 80s, my uncle had a rather successful shop that sold Raleighs, but also some Peugeots and Moultons and even some Frejus. He passed far too early in 1979, and a few years later it was fini. Consequently, I grew up liking Raleighs, and disdaining Schwinns. Years later, while conversing with his business partner (the chief "wrench") about the decision to go with Raleigh, I learned that while they didn't have a negative view of the bicycles, and they actually had a more reliable supply chain (Raleigh USA was always diverting part of his orders to Stuyvesant Cycles), the chief reason was because Schwinn insisted on managing all the stocking and ordering of inventory. That may have been something that less-certain shop owners may have considered beneficial, but that was a deal breaker for my uncle.

To this day, I wear my mild prejudice as a badge of honor, but Schwinn lightweights are ok in my book.
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Old 08-05-22, 07:52 PM
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Originally Posted by USAZorro View Post
Consequently, I grew up liking Raleighs, and disdaining Schwinns. Years later, while conversing with his business partner (the chief "wrench") about the decision to go with Raleigh, I learned that while they didn't have a negative view of the bicycles, and they actually had a more reliable supply chain (Raleigh USA was always diverting part of his orders to Stuyvesant Cycles), the chief reason was because Schwinn insisted on managing all the stocking and ordering of inventory. That may have been something that less-certain shop owners may have considered beneficial, but that was a deal breaker for my uncle.
The Schwinn rep gave the owners (my bosses) untold grief every week when he came by because we also carried Diamondback/Centurion and Mongoose bikes. It was like the rep was pissed every time he stepped through the door. It was a very contentious relationship. I believe there were threats to forbid us from using Schwinn in the store name (we were Agoura Schwinn).
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Old 08-05-22, 08:39 PM
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Sacrilege, I don’t think so. I had a nos 78 Supercourse frame, that was never built up, yours actually looks better. I found the peeling decals and flakey paint unacceptable. So I had it redone, wasn’t a real fan of the gold paint anyway, but aside from the paint and wheels, stayed pretty true to the original. I did have the lugs accented with gold paint though. You got a great deal for 80 dollars!
Tim





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Old 08-07-22, 06:29 AM
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Originally Posted by branko_76 View Post
The essence of a 70's road bike is beautiful to me, adding modern components like those deep V rims with odd spoking pattern ruins it and shouts "look at me"..........Are you going to keep the cheap swaged SR crankset?

Is the mish-mosh of parts a matter of convenience or a matter of asserting ones free will? In either case, why ask for opinions and then do it anyway?
With half a dozen bikes to ride and living out in the country nobody is going to care if any bike that I ride shouts "look at me".
I like to think that this project is a work in motion right now and subject to change- but Barcons and a little T & A are top on my list.



As far as the "cheap swaged SR crankset" it appears to be in excellent condition not all beat up.
Why ask for opinions?

Because we can I guess.

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Old 08-07-22, 06:44 AM
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For me, I'd rather have a matched set of wheels than a mismatched set. As others have said, it isn't a permanent alteration and easier undone than chopping off a derailleur hanger or shifter bosses.
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Old 08-07-22, 09:07 AM
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This has nothing to do with C&V purity, but I like the look, strength, tunability, and reliability of 32 or 36 spoke wheels with a traditional 3X pattern. (Make that 3X or 4X in the case of 36 or 40 spokes and a high flange hub.) I detest the trends toward radial spoking and reduced spoke counts, neither of which make any mechanical engineering sense, although I do understand the air resistance and weight arguments.
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Old 08-07-22, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by tkamd73 View Post
Sacrilege, I don’t think so. I had a nos 78 Supercourse frame, that was never built up, yours actually looks better. I found the peeling decals and flakey paint unacceptable. So I had it redone, wasn’t a real fan of the gold paint anyway, but aside from the paint and wheels, stayed pretty true to the original. I did have the lugs accented with gold paint though. You got a great deal for 80 dollars!
Tim




Are those 27-1/2"?
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Old 08-07-22, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by tjfastback66 View Post
With half a dozen bikes to ride and living out in the country nobody is going to care if any bike that I ride shouts "look at me".
I like to think that this project is a work in motion right now and subject to change- but Barcons and a little T & A are top on my list.



As far as the "cheap swaged SR crankset" it appears to be in excellent condition not all beat up.
Why ask for opinions?

Because we can I guess.
Are those crank arms the same length? Quite possibly an optical illusion, but I felt an obligation to ask.
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Old 08-07-22, 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by USAZorro View Post
Are those crank arms the same length? Quite possibly an optical illusion, but I felt an obligation to ask.
Yeah they kind of do look off a bit - but nope they are a match set (170):


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