pstock

I know this has been asked hundreds of times but....
I am trying to advise a friend on modifying her touring bike to have easier/lower gearing.
It is a Marinoni Turismo currently setup with 3X9 speed Campagnolo, with a triple front chain ring and biggest rear cog of 26t.

I would suggest a Long cage rear derailleur and a fatter cassette (something north of 30t) but A) LC campy RDs are quite expensive and B) I cannot find a Camapagnolo cassette with a biggest cog bigger than 28t.

(I don't know whether small front chain ring is, but apparently it plus the 26t is leaving her struggling on some hills.)

did campagnolo even/ever make cogs bgger than 28t?
if not, What is the point of a long cage campagnolo RD if there is no campy cassette bigger than the range (28t I believe)that a regular short cage derailleur will handle)
So, am I missing something?

my other suggestion was to just use a Shimano Long cage RD. But ideally she would like to also not have to swap out her current Campagnolo setup wheelset for shimano.
but as above, I cannot even find a 9 speed campagnolo cassette with larger than 28t.

and even if I could, I cannot figure out the compatibility of a mixed setup - 9S Campagnolo Ergo shifter + 9S Campagnolo cassette + 9S Shimano long cage RD

I have read this article on Shimergo several times and I cannot figure it out whether the above mix would work or not.

https://www.cyclinguk.org/cyclists-l...gears/shimergo

can anyone help me read these charts?
I assume that buried in them somewhere is an answer for RD X + Cassette Y + Shifter Z.
But I cannot figure out where I"d find the color score for:9S Campagnolo Ergo shifter + 9S Campagnolo cassette + 9S Shimano long cage RD


Peter

Andrew R Stewart 

A few comments- IIRC Campy offered a 29T cassette way back. But of course it's likely long gone. The reason for a long cage der isn't about max rear cog size but chain wrap. You should check out J Tech Shiftmate "converters".

The solution I have used for tears is a Shimano compatible freehub and cassette (you choose the cog count) which opens you up to a lot of current and future replacement options. Then convert the Campy Ergo.rear der (or Ergo and Shimano rear der) to working with the Shimano spec cassette with the proper Shiftmate adapter. I have 5 bikes using the Shiftmates and have used them for many years and miles with no issues. Most shops will poopoo this arrangement but with the correct Shiftmate mixed systems are very possible. Andy

pstock

thanks Andy.
outside of Mavic Ksyrium wheels (which seem to have easy and obvious interchangeability - and I had several sets of Ksyrium wheels I was able to canabalize easily to experiment with), I have never delved into swapping Campy for Shimano freehubs on other brands of wheels.
are freehubs generally Hub Brand specific?

I'll find out what make of hub Nicola (my friend) has and start searching.

Peter

HillRider

One easy and low-cost way to get lower gearing is to swap out the current 30T smallest chainring for a 24T or 26T. Campy uses the common 74 mm bolt circle for their smallest chainrings and replacement chainrings are readily available. I made this change to a 10-speed Chorus crank several years ago and it worked perfectly.

Andrew R Stewart 

Hillrider makes a good suggestion. However as Campy uses a 135mm bolt diameter pattern for the middle and large rings one ends up with a huge jump from that 24/6T inner to the (usual) 39T middle. My solution is to run any one of the many 110/74mm bolt patterned cranks found on millions of MtBs during the 1980s and 1990s. My bikes have 24/34/44 or 26/36/46 rings. I also mix to match the ft der with what ever shifts best, as the Ergo LH shifter is not indexed it can work with any ft set up. Andy

pdlamb

9 speed was from the halcyon days when Campy and Shimano cassettes were close enough to be interchangeable. I'm running a Campagnolo shifter and (long cage) derailer with Shimano 11-34 cassette and it works fine. So if you don't mind changing the rear wheel, you might look into a Shimano wheel + cassette.

HillRider

Actually, my middle to granny jump on the Chorus crank was even worse as it was from a 42T middle to a 26T granny ring. It was a bit sluggish shifting back from the granny to the middle but it did go reliably and I was never in a rush for that shift anyway. My current cranks are Shimano FC-5703 triples geared 50/39/26 and the 39/26 shifts are actually pretty good.

Miele Man

I did almost the same thing on my touring bike. Veloce 9-speed Ergo levers and rear derailleur running a 9-speed Shimano cassette with a low of 32 teeth. Works a charm.

Cheers

Andrew R Stewart 

I ran half step plus granny for years on a self modified Campy NR crank. Of course the middle was a 42 and the 86mm granny (Stronglight) granny was the minimum 28T. No ramps or pins of that stuff and the Campy ft der did work well enough. But then I am pretty good at shifting (in fact at work I have to remind myself that customers don't soft pedal of spin well most often). My comments reflect this, that most riders don't shift well, don't spin, don't really soft pedal, don't anticipate their shifts well, and (sadly) many would do just fine with a 1x5 system as far as taking advantage of their gearing options. So my comments about the 24/26 to 39 shift relate to these riders. Andy (who is a little burned out from a draining day at the shop)

HillRider

Andy, your comments are well taken. That big jump does require a bit of finesse to do right. My first "adult" bike was an '85 Bridgestone 400 that came with a 6-speed freewheel and an SR 110/74 BCD crank with 52/42 chainrings. I added a 26T granny and half-stepped it to 46/42. As you mentioned all of these chainrings were flat and with no enhancements so I had to develop a relatively refined shifting technique. I guess I still have it.

conspiratemus1

Campagnolo Centaur in 10-speed offers a 30-tooth large sprocket, but in 9-sp, 28 is as big as you get.
Bellati Sport in Switzerland sells the Marchisio line of sprockets, sold singly as well as made-up cassettes. In Campag pattern, 30 is the largest 9-sp. Even though they don’t advise mixing them in with Campag sprockets — the ramps don’t match — in practice the chain does shift onto the 30 quite well, even on our tandem. Marchisio has closed up production, though, so best move quickly while Bellatisport still has inventory. Even with Covid, they ship promptly and reasonably cheaply by Swiss-post.

But your best bet is to get a Shimano 9-sp hub with a 32- or 34- tooth max, a Shimano long-cage derailer, and a #3 Shiftmate. I’m not sure if any Shiftmate will allow keeping the Campag derailer, but for sprockets >28 she’ll need a long-cage mech. anyway. My usual source of Shiftmates has been SJS Cycles in the UK. With Covid they are shipping to North Am by courier only, which is expensive. But they are a great shop. Peter White in New Hampshire usually has them too. Shiftmates rock.

Edit: The SJS Cycles website reproduces the chart that shows what combos of shifter, derailer, and cassette will work with the various Shiftmates. I think there are 9 now, covering SRAM, too. I share Nicola’s soft spot for Campag gear, but if 26-26 doesn’t cut it, it’s Shimano time. At least she’ll be able to keep the Ergo shifters.

grall1126

This worked for me, no problems

Drew Eckhardt 

Swap the 30T 74mm BCDnner ring for a 26 and run a chain catcher yielding a low like 30x30,

Some people have gone down to 24T which would be like 30x33

You should probably scrounge up an old Racing-T derailleur if it really is a short cage.

That should have a B-tension screw or H tension and rack matching the old derailleur (Campagnolo changed geometry with the move to 10 cogs)

Drew Eckhardt 

Barely. They had a 30T for their 8 speed mountain groups. 10 speed brought the 13-29 then 12-30. 11 speed begat the 12-29.

Triple cranks which let you have both wide range and tight spacing.

This is a long cage 89mm between jockey wheel axles. A 3x9 setup should have a medium measuring 72.5mm. Short was 55mm.


It goes with a matching triple front derailleur:

DaveSSS 

The long cage ensures that there will be no chain slack in any gear combination. 17 years ago I was using a 53/39/28 FSA triple 10 speed crank with a 13-29 Campy cassette and long cage RD. A medium cage 72.5mm would probably have worked, but there would be some slack chain in the little ring and a few of the smallest sprockets.

Campy and shimano 9 cassettes were never a good match. 11 speed is much better.

I would suggest spending your money on a more modern drivetrain and give the 20 year old stuff the heave-ho. A complete Campy centaur group or Shimano 105 group are not that expensive.