Importance of foot retention
#126
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 1,995
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2700 Post(s)
Liked 486 Times
in
351 Posts
The ex racer who owns the bike store I frequent does the whole "pull up" thing to train, says his russian coach had them do that. I felt like my pedal stroke was NOT smooth at all once I hit my max cadence (probably above 130) and ended up pulling something in my groin so maybe even if foot retention isn't needed or doesn't give me extra watts, it could teach me how to pedal smoothly. Maybe put some foot retention on my 42x18 single speed and turn it into a fixie and bomb some hills. Thats one way to force high cadence.
The girl asked if I have time to go to their house this afternoon, says she has something for me and wants to see my bike. Maybe its an old pair of his cleats. If its a jersey imma be salty
The girl asked if I have time to go to their house this afternoon, says she has something for me and wants to see my bike. Maybe its an old pair of his cleats. If its a jersey imma be salty
Likes For LarrySellerz:
#127
Habitual User
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Altadena, CA
Posts: 7,975
Bikes: 2023 Niner RLT 9 RDO, 2018 Trek Procaliber 9.9 RSL, 2018 Storck Fascenario.3 Platinum, 2003 Time VX Special Pro, 2001 Colnago VIP, 1999 Trek 9900 singlespeed, 1977 Nishiki ONP
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4941 Post(s)
Liked 8,081 Times
in
3,822 Posts
#128
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,952
Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace
Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10421 Post(s)
Liked 11,882 Times
in
6,088 Posts
The ex racer who owns the bike store I frequent does the whole "pull up" thing to train, says his russian coach had them do that. I felt like my pedal stroke was NOT smooth at all once I hit my max cadence (probably above 130) and ended up pulling something in my groin so maybe even if foot retention isn't needed or doesn't give me extra watts, it could teach me how to pedal smoothly. Maybe put some foot retention on my 42x18 single speed and turn it into a fixie and bomb some hills. Thats one way to force high cadence.
The girl asked if I have time to go to their house this afternoon, says she has something for me and wants to see my bike. Maybe its an old pair of his cleats. If its a jersey imma be salty
The girl asked if I have time to go to their house this afternoon, says she has something for me and wants to see my bike. Maybe its an old pair of his cleats. If its a jersey imma be salty
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."
"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."
"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
Likes For genejockey:
#129
Dead but dreaming
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Bay Area, CA (East Bay - Contra Costa County)
Posts: 423
Bikes: 2020 Santa Cruz Stigmata, 2022 Cannondale Synapse
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 171 Post(s)
Liked 326 Times
in
186 Posts
Then yes.
Likes For KJ43:
#130
Expired Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: TN
Posts: 11,526
Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3662 Post(s)
Liked 5,408 Times
in
2,747 Posts
Likes For shelbyfv:
#131
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2021
Posts: 4,083
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2333 Post(s)
Liked 2,097 Times
in
1,314 Posts
If by honorable pursuit of a girl you mean pursing a woman that appears to be in a happy relationship with someone else but just happened to be kind to Larry so he decided to creep on her and insult her boyfriend by telling him that his girlfriend has a daddy fixation.
Then yes.
Then yes.
All's fair in love and war.
Likes For GhostRider62:
#132
bike whisperer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Posts: 9,545
Bikes: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=152015&p=1404231
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1528 Post(s)
Liked 718 Times
in
510 Posts
Yep, just ask Genghis Khan, or one of his billions of descendants.
__________________
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
#133
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 1,995
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2700 Post(s)
Liked 486 Times
in
351 Posts
How am I creeping on her, and I didn't mean to offend him or suggest anything wrong about her, heck i'm all for girls with a daddy thing. It was just locker room guy talk, I wasn't trying to insult either of them, I was like damn thats sick that you bagged a girl half your age, good stuff man. Also im not pursuing her, how could I when her BF is so much faster than me. Real talk though I'm avoiding flirting with women on the group rides because there aren't many of them and im sure they get way more of that than they want anyways.
Last edited by LarrySellerz; 07-29-21 at 03:45 PM.
Likes For LarrySellerz:
#134
bike whisperer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Posts: 9,545
Bikes: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=152015&p=1404231
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1528 Post(s)
Liked 718 Times
in
510 Posts
Just wait till they cock a snook at you in some bike shorts, man
__________________
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
#135
Dead but dreaming
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Bay Area, CA (East Bay - Contra Costa County)
Posts: 423
Bikes: 2020 Santa Cruz Stigmata, 2022 Cannondale Synapse
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 171 Post(s)
Liked 326 Times
in
186 Posts
How am I creeping on her, and I didn't mean to offend him or suggest anything wrong about her, heck i'm all for girls with a daddy thing. It was just locker room guy talk, I wasn't trying to insult either of them, I was like damn thats sick that you bagged a girl half your age, good stuff man. Also im not pursuing her, how could I when her BF is so much faster than me. Real talk though I'm avoiding flirting with women on the group rides because there aren't many of them and im sure they get way more of that than they want anyways.
Lol. Just kidding around and doing some smack talking man. You know...."locker room talk".
Likes For KJ43:
#136
bike whisperer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Posts: 9,545
Bikes: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=152015&p=1404231
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1528 Post(s)
Liked 718 Times
in
510 Posts
Whoops, just googled that and it didn't mean what I thought: cop a squiz
__________________
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
Likes For Kimmo:
#137
Senior Member
Chicks always go for the old guy on a real road bike, wearing bike-specific attire.
*****
I much prefer riding with foot retention, either pinned flats or toe clips and straps or clips, straps, and cleats. I suspect it's easier to learn to pedal smoothly without foot retention, though, because you almost have to pedal smoothly if the alternative is losing contact with the pedals.
#138
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 1,995
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2700 Post(s)
Liked 486 Times
in
351 Posts
Ugh they are giving me cleats and pedals in my size, now I have no excuse. Darn it. I was enjoying sandbagging. my ride is like low-key sponsering me lol, people offering to give me kit, shoes, bike, etc.
Last edited by LarrySellerz; 07-29-21 at 05:00 PM.
#139
bike whisperer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Posts: 9,545
Bikes: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=152015&p=1404231
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1528 Post(s)
Liked 718 Times
in
510 Posts
I had a Giant CFR1 BITD. That noodle taught me a smooth spin; it'd soak up anything more.
__________________
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
#140
Super-duper Genius
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Muskrat Springs, Utah
Posts: 1,713
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 768 Post(s)
Liked 984 Times
in
508 Posts
Just be cool, man. You should have stopped at “She asked if I have time to go to their house this afternoon, says she has something for me and wants to see my bike.” Then you add a thumbs up emoji, or a winking grin emoji, and leave it there.
Likes For Broctoon:
#141
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Mich
Posts: 7,380
Bikes: RSO E-tire dropper fixie brifter
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked 2,966 Times
in
1,915 Posts
takes a special person to want to see another person's pedal stroke & waiving abilities.
__________________
-Oh Hey!
-Oh Hey!
#142
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: TC, MN
Posts: 39,520
Bikes: R3 Disc, Haanjo
Mentioned: 354 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20810 Post(s)
Liked 9,456 Times
in
4,672 Posts
Take up all of the offers - you'll be crushing it in Spandex™ before you know it!
Likes For WhyFi:
#143
Advanced Slacker
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 6,210
Bikes: Soma Fog Cutter, Surly Wednesday, Canfielld Tilt
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2762 Post(s)
Liked 2,537 Times
in
1,433 Posts
I think the foot retention comment that girl made was bondage reference. She was totally hitting on you, man. Be careful when you go over to her place.
Likes For Kapusta:
#144
just another gosling
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Everett, WA
Posts: 19,528
Bikes: CoMo Speedster 2003, Trek 5200, CAAD 9, Fred 2004
Mentioned: 115 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3886 Post(s)
Liked 1,938 Times
in
1,383 Posts
Here's how I look at it, and no I'm not drunk (just yet). But imagine a scenario where you only pedaled with one leg and the other leg contributed nothing. Doesn't actively resist or participate. This means the active leg on the downstroke must not only overcome the inherant drivetrain resistance but also the resistance of the non-participating leg, having to help propel it up on its upstroke.
The real power is in the downstroke. I would agree with others here that trying to actively propel the bike through upward pressure could lead to injuries in the hip flexors and possibly other areas. However any assistance the leg on the upstroke side can give to the leg on the downstroke side should be positive. What I mean is that when a leg gets to the bottom and begins the upstroke just remembering to pull the leg up without exerting any upward pressure on the pedal (not trying to feel like you are pulling the cleat out of the pedal), but rather just trying to unload that side should allow the leg on the downstroke to feel less resistance.
I regularly practice this on my regular morning rides and find that when I focus on it that I feel I am spinning a bit easier in whatever combination I'm in and can sometimes move to a smaller cog. But the problem for me is remembering to do it. It requires a lot of concentration and since I usually find myself thinking about work and solving the worlds problems I frequently forget and find myself back to the same leg on the upstroke not contributing as much. As long as I'm not trying to exert force on the pedal on the upstroke I am fine. Its just hard to be consistent with it.
The real power is in the downstroke. I would agree with others here that trying to actively propel the bike through upward pressure could lead to injuries in the hip flexors and possibly other areas. However any assistance the leg on the upstroke side can give to the leg on the downstroke side should be positive. What I mean is that when a leg gets to the bottom and begins the upstroke just remembering to pull the leg up without exerting any upward pressure on the pedal (not trying to feel like you are pulling the cleat out of the pedal), but rather just trying to unload that side should allow the leg on the downstroke to feel less resistance.
I regularly practice this on my regular morning rides and find that when I focus on it that I feel I am spinning a bit easier in whatever combination I'm in and can sometimes move to a smaller cog. But the problem for me is remembering to do it. It requires a lot of concentration and since I usually find myself thinking about work and solving the worlds problems I frequently forget and find myself back to the same leg on the upstroke not contributing as much. As long as I'm not trying to exert force on the pedal on the upstroke I am fine. Its just hard to be consistent with it.
Once a week, put the bike in a really low gear and attempt to spin up the cadence to 115-120, while keeping your effort below VT1 or hard breathing anyway. It that's too much effort, try an even lower gear. You want to hold a very high cadence for at least 15', with practice 45'. If you can't spin that fast, at least take it up to the edge of bouncing and hold it here. You're trying to eliminate bouncing at any cadence, 150+ being entirely doable once one gets the skill. If one can pedal continuously like that, one's legs are doing the right thing. As the downstroke leg goes down, the force morphs into pulling back, Pulling back morphs into bending the knee with pressure on the heel cup. When one runs out of knee bend, the leg has momentum and comes over the top. Doing this exercise, imagine that there's a cushion of air between the bottom of your foot and the insole. Wiggle your toes. Pedal with the uppers.
__________________
Results matter
Results matter
Likes For Carbonfiberboy:
#145
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 7,872
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6958 Post(s)
Liked 10,959 Times
in
4,686 Posts
I can often make it through a red light on my SS or a multi-geared bike without removing my feet from the pedals. I stop a few feet shy of the next car's bumper, since the best I can manage is to inch forward slightly, a tiny bit at a time, using the front brake to keep me mostly in place. 'Course, on a fixie, a good trackstander can pretty much sit immobile indefinitely.
#146
bike whisperer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Posts: 9,545
Bikes: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=152015&p=1404231
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1528 Post(s)
Liked 718 Times
in
510 Posts
I can often make it through a red light on my SS or a multi-geared bike without removing my feet from the pedals. I stop a few feet shy of the next car's bumper, since the best I can manage is to inch forward slightly, a tiny bit at a time, using the front brake to keep me mostly in place. 'Course, on a fixie, a good trackstander can pretty much sit immobile indefinitely.
__________________
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
#147
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 7,872
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6958 Post(s)
Liked 10,959 Times
in
4,686 Posts
I'm just wondering how long I should be able to do it on a freewheel bike...I can regularly hold a position for 3-4 seconds before I have to release the front brake slightly and creep forward a couple inches in order to regain/maintain my balance. That's the best I can manage after casually working at it for about 15 years.
#148
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 23,208
Mentioned: 89 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18883 Post(s)
Liked 10,646 Times
in
6,054 Posts
They're trying to get in on the ground floor. They know you're going to be crushing races soon and they want to leech off your fame and wealth. Also, have you ever thought about being an influencer? I bet you can make a good salary posing in your dress riding a smart trainer in all kinds of exotic hotels. And with your dress crumpled up on the floor! They're screaming your name, Larry!
#149
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 23,208
Mentioned: 89 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18883 Post(s)
Liked 10,646 Times
in
6,054 Posts
I'm just wondering how long I should be able to do it on a freewheel bike...I can regularly hold a position for 3-4 seconds before I have to release the front brake slightly and creep forward a couple inches in order to regain/maintain my balance. That's the best I can manage after casually working at it for about 15 years.
#150
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 1,995
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2700 Post(s)
Liked 486 Times
in
351 Posts
yeah so after getting the cleats I realize Ive been pedaling wrong this entire time, feel like im on a rocket ship. I was super bouncy when going my max cadence (they were giving me crap for it when giving me stuff tonight) and I think this will fix it.
Last edited by LarrySellerz; 07-29-21 at 10:34 PM.