1974 Raleigh International
07-14-21, 09:43 AM
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Le savonnier
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1974 Raleigh International
This popped up locally, good looking Raleigh, appears to be mostly original and in very good condition. Seller states that it's Reynolds 501, which is wrong, should be 531. Also has "original Zefal pump" which I believe should actually be a Silca Imperio. But anyway, what do folks have to say regarding valuation? They are asking $725.
07-14-21, 09:54 AM
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That's an aggressive price but you live in the Pacific NW and bike prices are high there. The bike looks good and the parts look to be all original campy stuff with a brooks saddle. I'd value it closer to $600 though.
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07-14-21, 12:16 PM
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frame pump shown on bicycle is the same AFA product shown in the manufacturer's catalogue illiustration for the U.S. market of 1974
it appears someone has replaced the original AFA pump holder Nr. 34 with either a Campag Nr. 632 or a Zeus Nr. 115; angle of images does not permit one to tell which
perhaps they employed an Impero with the cycle in the past and wish to retain it...or maybe the Impero fell to misadventure and the owner put the AFA back into service...
-----
frame pump shown on bicycle is the same AFA product shown in the manufacturer's catalogue illiustration for the U.S. market of 1974
it appears someone has replaced the original AFA pump holder Nr. 34 with either a Campag Nr. 632 or a Zeus Nr. 115; angle of images does not permit one to tell which
perhaps they employed an Impero with the cycle in the past and wish to retain it...or maybe the Impero fell to misadventure and the owner put the AFA back into service...
-----
Last edited by juvela; 07-14-21 at 02:26 PM. Reason: addition
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07-14-21, 12:38 PM
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What are your plans for it?
07-14-21, 12:45 PM
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Thanks guys. A tad too big for me at 59cm (which I think would be 23.5" in the catalog). The 22.5" inch (about 57cm) would be better. Still, tempted to check it out and go for a test spin to see if it would work for me, seller permitting.
07-14-21, 01:10 PM
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07-14-21, 01:16 PM
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07-14-21, 02:32 PM
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the copper flambouyant is a good colour
when persons look for these they tend to seek the copper over the green
if you were to purchase it and kept it in this same fine nick it would appreciate for you
of course if the size is unworkable then not much else matters
as you may know, these Raleigh catalogue sizes are nominal and are measured c-t-t
the actual c-t-c size of a nominal 23 1/2" is likely to be in the vicinity of 57.5cm
happy shopping
-----
the copper flambouyant is a good colour
when persons look for these they tend to seek the copper over the green
if you were to purchase it and kept it in this same fine nick it would appreciate for you
of course if the size is unworkable then not much else matters
as you may know, these Raleigh catalogue sizes are nominal and are measured c-t-t
the actual c-t-c size of a nominal 23 1/2" is likely to be in the vicinity of 57.5cm
happy shopping
-----
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07-14-21, 02:34 PM
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I live in the PNW as well and that is about as low $$$ as I've seen a Raleigh International priced that is in that condition. It wouldn't surprise me if there was a buyer at $725 out there for this bike.
07-14-21, 02:59 PM
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the copper flambouyant is a good colour
when persons look for these they tend to seek the copper over the green
if you were to purchase it and kept it in this same fine nick it would appreciate for you
of course if the size is unworkable then not much else matters
as you may know, these Raleigh catalogue sizes are nominal and are measured c-t-t
the actual c-t-c size of a nominal 23 1/2" is likely to be in the vicinity of 57.5cm
when persons look for these they tend to seek the copper over the green
if you were to purchase it and kept it in this same fine nick it would appreciate for you
of course if the size is unworkable then not much else matters
as you may know, these Raleigh catalogue sizes are nominal and are measured c-t-t
the actual c-t-c size of a nominal 23 1/2" is likely to be in the vicinity of 57.5cm
I would definitely keep it as is. Thanks for the tip on sizing, I didn't know that. That makes it doable. A test ride will confirm, if nothing else.
07-14-21, 03:17 PM
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I think these bikes are on the rise, they were second only to the Professional and are actually very ride able, i have one, i paid more than that for in similar condition, this forum is knowledgeable but like someone said to me we all want it to be priced what we want to pay, i think in that condition its easily worth that, mine rides fantastic, i cant comment on the Weinman brakes which were original spec, as mine were upgraded to Campy...
I d buy another just because they are stunning in person.... id have one in every color...
Gary
I d buy another just because they are stunning in person.... id have one in every color...
Gary
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07-14-21, 04:40 PM
#13
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Is it true that these run 27" wheels (this is what is listed in the ad, if it isn't a mistake)? Doesn't specify in the catalog specs. If they are 27", has anyone converted to 700c without too much modification?
07-14-21, 05:16 PM
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stock wheels were tubs
specification cross table states "sprint rims" - this is Brit terminology for tubs
---
frame geometry and clearances on these are forgiving
know you can easily run 35c tyres and may be able to do 38c
remember that as you go up in tyre cross section you are slightly raising the standover height; might be a consideration in your case
you may wish to read up on the concept of "french fit" if you are unfamiliar with it
---
should the combination of a 144mm BCD and a 28T limit on the NR stern mech not be adequate to your gearing requirements do not hesitate to convert to a three plateau drive train
you can mount a Rally on the stern
if you make such changes it would be best to retain the original fittings so that you, or a future owner, could put the machine back into stock configuration if wished
-----
stock wheels were tubs
specification cross table states "sprint rims" - this is Brit terminology for tubs
---
frame geometry and clearances on these are forgiving
know you can easily run 35c tyres and may be able to do 38c
remember that as you go up in tyre cross section you are slightly raising the standover height; might be a consideration in your case
you may wish to read up on the concept of "french fit" if you are unfamiliar with it
---
should the combination of a 144mm BCD and a 28T limit on the NR stern mech not be adequate to your gearing requirements do not hesitate to convert to a three plateau drive train
you can mount a Rally on the stern
if you make such changes it would be best to retain the original fittings so that you, or a future owner, could put the machine back into stock configuration if wished
-----
Last edited by juvela; 07-14-21 at 05:25 PM. Reason: spellin'
07-14-21, 06:26 PM
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4 mm adjustment down to 700c. Should be easy with those center pull brakes. Take a look at them. They likely have that much adjustment. But why would you want to give up on those campy hi flange hubs? I'd stick to 27 inch unless you plan on rebuilding the wheels.
07-14-21, 06:35 PM
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that I would be really surprised if it is a 23.5" as Raleigh measured way back to the top.
If you ride a 22.5", too big, I have one and the head tube is considerably shorter.
I think the asking is actually Market, at least in Southern California.
appears low miles, If I wanted an International, buy it, take it apart, as you should do anyway for a bike of this age, sell the frame and look for another International, My guess you could end up even.
the only downside I see is what appears to be 27" wheels. The schrader valves...
If you ride a 22.5", too big, I have one and the head tube is considerably shorter.
I think the asking is actually Market, at least in Southern California.
appears low miles, If I wanted an International, buy it, take it apart, as you should do anyway for a bike of this age, sell the frame and look for another International, My guess you could end up even.
the only downside I see is what appears to be 27" wheels. The schrader valves...
07-14-21, 06:39 PM
#17
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...it's worth that much in that condition, and equipped as it is, where you state you are located. I wouldn't sell this one for less than that. It does have long stays and more of a touring geometry, if that matters to you. So it's not especially quick handling, but it does have a nice road feel. I put fenders on this one a couple of years ago. Tyre and fender clearance is not an issue with these.
This one is a 23 1/2" model, so I think that one is too big for you.
07-14-21, 06:52 PM
#18
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stock wheels were tubs
specification cross table states "sprint rims" - this is Brit terminology for tubs
---
frame geometry and clearances on these are forgiving
know you can easily run 35c tyres and may be able to do 38c
remember that as you go up in tyre cross section you are slightly raising the standover height; might be a consideration in your case
you may wish to read up on the concept of "french fit" if you are unfamiliar with it
---
should the combination of a 144mm BCD and a 28T limit on the NR stern mech not be adequate to your gearing requirements do not hesitate to convert to a three plateau drive train
you can mount a Rally on the stern
if you make such changes it would be best to retain the original fittings so that you, or a future owner, could put the machine back into stock configuration if wished
-----
stock wheels were tubs
specification cross table states "sprint rims" - this is Brit terminology for tubs
---
frame geometry and clearances on these are forgiving
know you can easily run 35c tyres and may be able to do 38c
remember that as you go up in tyre cross section you are slightly raising the standover height; might be a consideration in your case
you may wish to read up on the concept of "french fit" if you are unfamiliar with it
---
should the combination of a 144mm BCD and a 28T limit on the NR stern mech not be adequate to your gearing requirements do not hesitate to convert to a three plateau drive train
you can mount a Rally on the stern
if you make such changes it would be best to retain the original fittings so that you, or a future owner, could put the machine back into stock configuration if wished
-----
Last time I looked for 27" tires (for my wife's Trek 620), the widest I could find were Panaracer Paselas, I believe in 32mm.
juvela 28T has been good enough for me for several decades, no need to move up yet!
And yes, I would definitely keep the original fittings for such a fine bike.bikemig I definitely would not give up those Campy high flange hubs!
07-14-21, 06:54 PM
#19
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that I would be really surprised if it is a 23.5" as Raleigh measured way back to the top.
If you ride a 22.5", too big, I have one and the head tube is considerably shorter.
I think the asking is actually Market, at least in Southern California.
appears low miles, If I wanted an International, buy it, take it apart, as you should do anyway for a bike of this age, sell the frame and look for another International, My guess you could end up even.
If you ride a 22.5", too big, I have one and the head tube is considerably shorter.
I think the asking is actually Market, at least in Southern California.
appears low miles, If I wanted an International, buy it, take it apart, as you should do anyway for a bike of this age, sell the frame and look for another International, My guess you could end up even.
07-14-21, 07:01 PM
#20
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I'm questioning whether the 27" wheel spec is accurate. Did they even make tubulars in 27"?
Last time I looked for 27" tires (for my wife's Trek 620), the widest I could find were Panaracer Paselas, I believe in 32mm.
juvela 28T has been good enough for me for several decades, no need to move up yet! And yes, I would definitely keep the original fittings for such a fine bike.
bikemig I definitely would not give up those Campy high flange hubs!
Last time I looked for 27" tires (for my wife's Trek 620), the widest I could find were Panaracer Paselas, I believe in 32mm.
juvela 28T has been good enough for me for several decades, no need to move up yet!
And yes, I would definitely keep the original fittings for such a fine bike.bikemig I definitely would not give up those Campy high flange hubs!
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07-14-21, 07:13 PM
#21
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...it's worth that much in that condition, and equipped as it is, where you state you are located. I wouldn't sell this one for less than that. It does have long stays and more of a touring geometry, if that matters to you. So it's not especially quick handling, but it does have a nice road feel. I put fenders on this one a couple of years ago. Tyre and fender clearance is not an issue with these.
This one is a 23 1/2" model, so I think that one is too big for you.
07-15-21, 04:19 PM
#22
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Well, I went out to look at it this morning, took it for a test ride, and was sold. It's a little tall, but not a deal breaker. Wheelset is nothing to write home about other than the Campy high flange hubs: 27" Rigida clinchers with Cheng Shin tires! Otherwise in great shape and solid. Bought it for $700.
Details and more pics to come...
Details and more pics to come...
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07-15-21, 04:32 PM
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congratulations!
if you operate it with 700 wheels you will gain four mm in standover clearance
hope you enjoy
count yourself very fortunate that it is one size too small for gugie...
otherwise he might be laying plans... 
-----
congratulations!
if you operate it with 700 wheels you will gain four mm in standover clearance
hope you enjoy
count yourself very fortunate that it is one size too small for gugie...
otherwise he might be laying plans...
-----
07-15-21, 05:19 PM
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Cool.
07-15-21, 06:28 PM
#25
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Well, I went out to look at it this morning, took it for a test ride, and was sold. It's a little tall, but not a deal breaker. Wheelset is nothing to write home about other than the Campy high flange hubs: 27" Rigida clinchers with Cheng Shin tires! Otherwise in great shape and solid. Bought it for $700.
Details and more pics to come...
Details and more pics to come...
Nice score. If it looks anywhere close to as good in person as it does in the photos (and assuming there are no hidden disasters), ya done good.
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