gauvins

Anything to be concerned about?

We plan to ride and hike. There would be 3 possibilities:

1. Carry frameless backpacks in out panniers. Wasted space and not great on the trail
2. Use the Ortlieb's carrying system. Same downsides as above
3. Use our backpacks (36L Osprey Stratos) instead of panniers. Ideal on the hiking trail, but not sure that they'll travel well on the bike.

The idea would be to tie both backpacks together with a short length of webbing and to put them on the rear rack. That would give something that would look like horse riding saddle bags (pictured below, if the force is with me). We'd add horizontal straps tied to the lower section of the rack in order to prevent fore-aft motion.

We'd probably have to put something (tent?) on the rear rack, first, and the pair of backpacks on top to have enough clearance for the derailleur.

If I've missed an obvious no-no, please educate me.

acantor

I tour with two rear panniers and a daypack bungee corded to the top of the rear rack. I store bulky, lightweight stuff in the daypack – a sweater, sandals, paperback books, and so on.

I use two bungee cords to secure the daypack. I am careful to ensure that it doesn't move – otherwise, road vibration could cause it to come loose. It's never happened to me.

Bungee cords are not ideal for the task. Bungee cords are actually dangerous, particularly if stretched too tightly and/or they fail by, for example, a cord breaking, or the hook disengaging by accident or straightening out. The free end reaches a speed of nearly 100 km/h (about 60 mph), with the potential to cause serious injury, particularly to the eye.

Tourist in MSN

I think you should strap them on top of the rear rack after you put your rear panniers on the bikes. If you have some stuff to put in them but not enough to fill them, use one of those bunge cord nets to compress them down so that the stuff inside the packs are held firmly in place so that things in the packs do not move around and allow it to become loose.

I am not familiar with that exact pack, the large rucksacks that I have used that had no frames would have worked ok to strap stuff on top of a rear rack.

Just don't do what the rider is doing in the photo, that did not look too stable which is why I took a photo of it.

jefnvk

Think you'd probably be better just strapping your own to the top. Higher weight, but secured there is far less chance of something coming loose and working its way into a spinning wheel.

In any case, in the worst case, you have to take them off and wear them on your back.

CliffordK

I've carried a daypack backpack on my rack at times. Just tied it to the top of the rack.

My old Blackburn rack doesn't have a center strip above the tire, and hangs quite low. So, I think I managed to wear a spot in the pack due to tire rubbing.

There are some pannier sets advertised as pack/pannier convertible. Some are pretty simple, and probably don't do either well. Others look quite nice.

https://www.cyclingabout.com/list-of...-back-or-bike/





https://www.pannierbackpacks.com/pro...nier-backpack/

gauvins

I realize that I wasn't clear -- we'd use the backpacks instead of panniers. You can take a look at the Stratos by following this link.

The backpacks are too large to fit reasonably well on top of the rack. And I very much doubt that there is a risk of them getting loose -- Ortlieb's mounting system is convenient but not complex: two points at the top and a bracket to prevent fore-aft motion.

I am more concerned by friction-induced wear -- it might be a good idea to add some kind of sacrificial layer. Anyway. Will think about it.

Thanks for your thoughts.

gauvins

Yes, that's exactly what concerns me. Hmm... do you think you'd been able to tell that there would be a problem by looking at the rig before taking off? I suspect that your backpack could tilt left to right --- if properly secured to the rack's vertical section, that would prevent this behavior, right? (My backpacks have internal frames giving them a concave shape -- so your back can breathe. I'd think that the packs' tops and bottoms would fit snugly against the rack, while the mid section will have much clearance).

The annoying thing about chafing is that it is often difficult to notice. And if it occurs for hours on end, you end up with equipment that can no longer be used...

gauvins

agree.

The Stratos, hung vertically, would sit quite low. Something like the tops would be 6 inches above the rack and the bottoms would reach the hubs.

I'll try to stuff them both, this week and take a pic (no way I'll ride with the kind of weather we are having... until April? )

Tourist in MSN

You were clear, I was suggesting using your backpack as a racktop bag, although it would be an extra long one.

***

Before you try to hang a pack on your drive side, look at the dimensions so that you can keep the bag above your dérailleur. Last thing you need is a bag that messes with your shifting. That might be the reason that rear panniers never go too far below the axle on the rear when they go much further below the axle on front when low rider racks are used.

Tourist in MSN

I do not know if you are interested in carrying backpacks without a waist belt or not. At 35 liters, your packs can't be too heavy. You might be able to find some packs that do not have frames and weigh very little that you can either use as rack top bags or shove them into the bottom of a pannier. Decades ago I used some rucksacks that were in the 25 to 30 liter range, they were not very comfortable but the shoulder straps that come on new packs today are much more comfortable than those old ones were.

I recently bought a 70 liter Sealline Black Canyon backpack/drybag to use for canoeing. No frame, no waistband, very light. This is much larger than you are interested in, I only mention it for the concept. I fold my shorty foam pad into thirds and put that against the back so that sharp pointy objects in the pack are cushioned instead of stabbing me in the back.

CliffordK

I had the pack tied on top of the rack (small day pack). I probably could have noticed the rubbing, but it is possible that the pack shifted and bulged some while riding.

Any new rack I buy has a center strip to prevent stuff from falling down onto the tire, as well as being a rudimentary mud guard. For a while I had cut a piece of that corrugated plastic cardboard to fit the old Blackburn rack, but I must have been taken it off a while ago for some reason.

As far as floppy on the sides of the rack, I've only encountered that with panniers. Some newer racks are long in the rear section to prevent flopping. I've added pegs to a couple of my racks to prevent the flopping too. Again, one can often notice it before taking off, or one can hear the pinging of the spokes pretty quickly.

Happy Feet

For what it's worth this is a 20L MEC dry packsack

zzzzPC040060 by dc460, on Flickr

I use a Filzer PR-4 rack https://www.filzer.com/products/pr-4...-rack/#details which is quite wide so the backpack is stable with a couple of bungees. In it I carry my sleeping bag, air matt, clothes, my solar panel when not in use and a book.

P1050145 (2) by dc460, on Flickr

saddlesores

how much hiking do you plan to do?
will you need to carry all your stuff with you?
perhaps one of you (at least) can use a lightweight
rolls up size of a softball daypack.

larger backpacks not so fun on a bike. never
really fit/mount properly, and the stuff you need
now is always way at the bottom.

one of you could pull a trailer with one backpack
and your 10-15 liters of water.

where will you be? i axe 'cause when cycling in
new zealand, could always find a sporting goods
rental (or hostel) to rent a backpack for a week
on the many tracks.

BikeLite

36L backpacks would seem too big/long to be put together over a single rear rack. In the link, a guy carried his backpack sideways on the rear rack.
https://www.montaguebikes.com/foldin...ontague-bikes/

gauvins

Fantastic picture

wrt to the backpack model -- I'd like to try with what we have before shelling more money for something else. Also because we found the Stratos to be excellent for our needs.

We hope to be able to get a permit to sleep at Bright Angel (bottom of the Grand Canyon). Nothing challenging, really, and one backpack would be more than enough. I am considering attaching both for the sake of symmetry.

saddlesores

you could get by with a couple $5 school backpacks from wallyworld.
easy hiking on established and maintained trails.
no real need to design your bike/bag system around this.

i hiked down and back up in a day, using one of wally's backpacks,
carrying 2 gallon jugs of water snacks sunscreen, camping up top.

• The General Store at Grand Canyon Village Marketplace – (928) 638-2262 Convenient location, the camping section of the Canyon Village Marketplace rents and sells equipment and backpacking supplies. Delaware North is the concession, and they have a page showing what they rent, prices and rental policies.

check the site above, per the PDF they rent internal frame backpacks at $12/night.

also hiking boots at $10/day. you really want some real hiking shoes. it's only a mile
straight down, but 8-10 miles along the switchbacks.

gauvins

Thanks for the detailed info. This is indeed an option. I'll still try to mount our backpacks instead of paniers, in part because I am stubborn as a mule, but also because their might be several opportunities to camp in more remote areas in Zion, Red Canyon and Bryce.

But rental at GCNP is certainly a possibility

fietsbob

Zip tie a basket on the rear rack to put your small pack in..?

Nashbar used to carry a backpack with a hidden pannier hook set.

Tow a cargo bike trailer for your full back country back pack, your panniers become redundant then.






....

stardognine

I kinda like that setup, with the sideways approach. I just scored a North Face Badlands 75 today, for $15 at a Goodwill. Didn't realize I needed it, till I found it. 😁
Anyways, I use a big sleeping bag, and thinking of carrying a second, and this pack makes a 3rd large item. So re-structuring the load sideways makes a lot of sense.
Or I could just carry the pack, with down & other light stuff. 😎

CliffordK

Ahhh... a photo of the trip where I had some issues of the pack riding low showed up.



Just a small pack tied to the top of the fairly low rack.

I rarely tie packs to the rack on that bike, although I do, on occasion tie it to the rack on the cargo bike, still generally tied to the top of the rack (all I have is one pack at a time).

NicolaMcLean

I don't like such massive backpacks.

saddlesores

nor do i.
yet sometimes necessary.

in the possible post-apocalyptic world, you may need more tools.
slaying demons and zombies takes more than a mere popcan stove.