So how did my bike build get to $119?
#26
Banned
@ PDX airport
https://www.portofportland.com/Notic...bly_01_BLT.htm,,
But you came by Amtrak? or that just the return plan?
https://www.portofportland.com/Notic...bly_01_BLT.htm,,
But you came by Amtrak? or that just the return plan?
#27
Every day a winding road
Thread Starter
@ PDX airport
https://www.portofportland.com/Notic...bly_01_BLT.htm,,
But you came by Amtrak? or that just the return plan?
https://www.portofportland.com/Notic...bly_01_BLT.htm,,
But you came by Amtrak? or that just the return plan?
Coll but I would still rather pre ship. So much easier.
#28
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Yep, there's that too. I've gotta drop the wife off at the departures hall with our bikes and bags, let her sit there for a half hour watching the stuff while I go park, and then deal with hauling boxes through to oversize luggage screening, v. dropping the boxes off at FedEx and being done with it. And, do all that in reverse when we get back. Unfortunately, shipping abroad is prohibitively expensive and filled with its own customs issues, so airlines are the only option for me.
#29
Banned
Flying into Gatwick (LGW) I found If I left my bike in the carton,
I could have used the Victoria St Station Left Luggage for safekeeping,
But not as I did , putting it together at the airport
Proper train between the 2 , not 'the Tube', so more Space for bike or box.
........................................
FWIW Bike Fridays being suitcase sized packed, is easier to cope with, thru airports and busses, that's the whole Idea...
...
I could have used the Victoria St Station Left Luggage for safekeeping,
But not as I did , putting it together at the airport
Proper train between the 2 , not 'the Tube', so more Space for bike or box.
........................................
FWIW Bike Fridays being suitcase sized packed, is easier to cope with, thru airports and busses, that's the whole Idea...
...
Last edited by fietsbob; 06-26-18 at 02:00 PM.
#30
Every day a winding road
Thread Starter
Yep, there's that too. I've gotta drop the wife off at the departures hall with our bikes and bags, let her sit there for a half hour watching the stuff while I go park, and then deal with hauling boxes through to oversize luggage screening, v. dropping the boxes off at FedEx and being done with it. And, do all that in reverse when we get back. Unfortunately, shipping abroad is prohibitively expensive and filled with its own customs issues, so airlines are the only option for me.
Yeah international you are pretty much stuck.
My return on this trip will be easy.
1. Hand the guy in Eugene my bike.
2. Get the bike from the guy in Sacramento.
3. Hand the guy the bike in Sacramento.
4. Get the bike from the guy in Chicago.
5. Hang the bike myself in Chicago.
6. Get the bike from the rack in Pittsburgh.
I just hope I don't forget one of the gets.
#31
Full Member
XXX gave me an initial quote of $65 to build my bike. Somehow that got to $119. Mechanic claims he had to replace a rear spoke, a rear straddle cable for the brakes, true the front wheel and do a basic tune up.
I did notice the straddle cable and really should have replaced it before it left. A bit frayed but it really wasn't that bad IMHO. Never noticed a broken spoke. I guess it could have happened during shipping or maybe while packing but I don't see how in either case since the wheel stayed on the bike. Front wheel true seemed OK for me. I did notice the rear wheel being a bit out on my test ride right before shipping. Maybe the spoke was broken and I just wasn't seeing it. Lesson learned go over your spokes regularly.
Still not sure how that bill got to $119. I would think a basic tune up would be included with a build?
I did notice the straddle cable and really should have replaced it before it left. A bit frayed but it really wasn't that bad IMHO. Never noticed a broken spoke. I guess it could have happened during shipping or maybe while packing but I don't see how in either case since the wheel stayed on the bike. Front wheel true seemed OK for me. I did notice the rear wheel being a bit out on my test ride right before shipping. Maybe the spoke was broken and I just wasn't seeing it. Lesson learned go over your spokes regularly.
Still not sure how that bill got to $119. I would think a basic tune up would be included with a build?
The person who can explain in more detail is the guy in the shop - but you haven't spoken to him yet.
But you've named his business on an online forum. And someone has told you that he's bilked you! Their conduct has been described as unprofessional.
I think that's appalling!
The first thing you should do is remove the name of the bike shop.
If you decide after talking to the man himself that you have received inferior service, then by all means go nuclear on social media. But at this stage???
If it was my bike shop and I read your posts your bike would be waiting for you, alright - packed up in its box! No charge!
Your $119 is not worth it.
If I had given instructions that nothing extra was to be done to my bike without my say so, I'd be annoyed if my instructions weren't followed. However, I would have sorted that out in my correspondence, not by leaving a note on top of a box. The note might get lost in transit, or thrown out in unpacking the box.
Your other thread is about your misgivings for your tour.
I can sympathise with nerves. I'd be nervous too heading off with a cable that was frayed and a wheel that wasn't true that I hadn't checked thoroughly enough to know if all the spokes were intact.
Maybe if you were in a better frame of mind a bike shop that was proactive and fixed a spoke, replaced a cable and made sure a bike was in tip-top order before the (nervous) rider headed off on tour in a strange part of the country, far away from home, would be worth $54 extra.
I hope you've a great tour!
Your bike is ready to rock'n'roll! Are you?
#32
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Southwest does not fly into my community airport. If I want to fly Southwest, that airport is 90 miles away.
The last trip I did, the other two guys I was traveling with shipped their bikes to the motel. We took Southwest, being able to carry my bike in the S&S case makes it so much easier. I checked my bike in the S&S case so that it was on the plane. Southwest Air, 2nd checked bag is free, so my bike got to the motel with me for free. Only extra hassle was hauling around an extra bag in the airport and on the shuttle bus to the motel, shuttle to the airport parking lot, etc.
But any other airline, I would have shipped the bike to the motel too. At the cost of taking a bike on the plane, it does not make much sense. The three of us in that group are all retired, so we have the time to do our own bike assembly, etc. Thus, doing our own assembly at the motel made sense.
***
International, by having a bike in an S&S case, that saved me $150 each way ($300 round trip) to and from Iceland. I figure I need to take one more flight with a bike to finish paying for the S&S couplers and case.
Full size bike box would have been a major hassle. Flying back into USA, they first have you pick up your luggage, then go through customs, then check your luggage again for connecting flight(s). A full size bike box at that stage would again have been a major hassle. Plus of course not being able to get a full size bike box into a taxi to get home at the end, etc.
My luggage from my Iceland trip in the photo, I wore my helmet onto the plane instead of packed it, that is why it is out.
Last edited by Tourist in MSN; 06-26-18 at 04:35 PM.
#33
Senior Member
Just me, but I look at these same decisions in quite a bit different way. Obviously, there are plenty of different approaches and the one that works for you is the way to go. Here is what has worked well for me...
True. OTOH, I have found that when packing ultralight I can actually carry my bike (in a soft case with a shoulder strap) and all my luggage (typically <50# including the bike, gear, and soft case). Even when packing a little or even a lot heavier I never found it to be a major hassle to move my stuff. Heading from home to the airport I am usually dropped off by someone at the curb maybe a couple hundred feet from the baggage drop off. At the start of the tour I have generally dragged the box about 30-50' away from the baggage carousel, assembled the bike, and rode out of the airport within 20 minutes or so. For me riding out of the airport is easier than finding my way to a bike shop that may or may not be open when I arrive. It helps that I get a kick out of riding right out of the airport without going to a room or bike shop first.
True, but I never considered flying with my bike to be that major of a risk or hassle. If the bike were to be damaged, lost, or delayed I'd be looking for a bike shop and maybe a room and my tour would be delayed a day or more, but in all my travels that has never happened
I do tend to often use a bike shop to pack and ship my bike home at the end of the trip. At that point it always seemed nice to just drop the bike and have someone else worry with shipping it avoiding the logistics of packing the bike in a strange town.
I do tend to often use a bike shop to pack and ship my bike home at the end of the trip. At that point it always seemed nice to just drop the bike and have someone else worry with shipping it avoiding the logistics of packing the bike in a strange town.
#34
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Oh, I imagined it when I was planning on going to Iceland alone. The place I park in Toronto has the full size Ford vans as transport, so it was going to involve a nice tip to the driver for folding down the seats and helping me shove it in there
#35
Senior Member
The last trip I did, the other two guys I was traveling with shipped their bikes to the motel. We took Southwest, being able to carry my bike in the S&S case makes it so much easier. I checked my bike in the S&S case so that it was on the plane. Southwest Air, 2nd checked bag is free, so my bike got to the motel with me for free. Only extra hassle was hauling around an extra bag in the airport and on the shuttle bus to the motel, shuttle to the airport parking lot, etc.
But any other airline, I would have shipped the bike to the motel too. At the cost of taking a bike on the plane, it does not make much sense. The three of us in that group are all retired, so we have the time to do our own bike assembly, etc. Thus, doing our own assembly at the motel made sense.
But any other airline, I would have shipped the bike to the motel too. At the cost of taking a bike on the plane, it does not make much sense. The three of us in that group are all retired, so we have the time to do our own bike assembly, etc. Thus, doing our own assembly at the motel made sense.
I generally do all my own bike work, and I prefer it that way, so while i can see where flying into town and having your bike ready to go would be nice, it's not something I seriously consider. However the amount of disassembly required for the S&S bike is extreme, and I've found that the smartest thing is to allow for a couple of hours to put it together, just to be safe. Not big deal if you plan for it. But my mini tour with the bike disassembled started with me assembling the bike, finding a place to ship my case home, loading the bike, and then biking 60 miles. I only made it 45. The next time I just allowed for the first day to have minimal riding and be mostly reserved for bike assembly.
The only additional hassle is dealing with that case. When I wasn't touring and had a ride to and from the airport, no big deal. Last year when I biked from Cleveland to Cumberland, I just mailed the bag back home because the bike and I were going to ride the train at the other end of the trip. Last month I flew into Cleveland and out of Columbus, but I was able to pass it off to people who driving, and it was waiting for me at a friend's house when I got to Columbus. When I ride the Katy Trail this fall, I'll have to see if the hotel in St. Louis will hold the bag for me.
Apart from dealing with the bag, having the S&S bike has been great. And even with a full sized bike, you still have to deal with packaging in some form or another.
I definitely sympathize the OP, and I don't think I'd appreciate a shop doing all that extra work without checking with me, but I also try not to let the shop have my bike. I'm sure they know their stuff, but I like to deal with my own bike.
#36
bicycle tourist
Many of the spots where I need to carry a box are also places where others are also bringing their luggage. So in some cases:
- they are short distances, e.g. from a curbside to a checkin; if absolutely necessary I'll shuttle things in multiple trips, sometimes short distances at a time
- accommodations exist, e.g. carts between baggage claim and customs
- local transport has capabilities to carry luggage, e.g. photo below shows taxi in Delhi with roof rack and two bike boxes on top (*); though it often costs more
- on arrival, I can bicycle from the airport; on departure this is more difficult,when boxes aren't available so I'll more often box the bike before coming to the airport
The net combination is over a number of international trips, almost always one or more of the above has applied and other than extra $$ it hasn't been a big deal.
(*) Photo below is one small part of a longer journey I took with that box:
- had a local bike shop pack it up, so it was well secured for travels
- wheeled the box ~1.5 miles down the road with a hand truck to my home
- had an airport shuttle take it to the airport; checked in and flew to Bangalore
- worked in Bangalore for a few weeks, kept this bike in the box (had another bike I was using there for local commutes and weekend rides)
- brought the bike to the airport with shuttle/taxi and flew to Delhi
- wheeled the bike on a cart from domestic terminal to international terminal; met my brother flying in from USA
- arranged the taxi below; biggest issue was finding some rope so the boxes wouldn't fly off in Delhi traffic
- took the taxi to the bus station; shuttled the bike box to the appropriate departure bus
- took the bus to Manali
- unboxed the bike and started bicycling...
So yes there were a few steps involved and it did cost me some extra $ (mostly the international flight costs). However, local transport worked fine with the box. There were a few spots to carry the box, but they weren't long and if necessary it made two trips. What I gained from all that is the bike traveled with me and if there had been an adjustment in plans there was a high probability the bike was still with me.
#37
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... They had some reservations when we told them my luggage would include my bike, but the S&S case fit in the trunk along with my wife's bag nicely.
I generally do all my own bike work, and I prefer it that way, so while i can see where flying into town and having your bike ready to go would be nice, it's not something I seriously consider. However the amount of disassembly required for the S&S bike is extreme, and I've found that the smartest thing is to allow for a couple of hours to put it together, just to be safe....
The only additional hassle is dealing with that case. ....
I generally do all my own bike work, and I prefer it that way, so while i can see where flying into town and having your bike ready to go would be nice, it's not something I seriously consider. However the amount of disassembly required for the S&S bike is extreme, and I've found that the smartest thing is to allow for a couple of hours to put it together, just to be safe....
The only additional hassle is dealing with that case. ....
Agree on doing my own work. I built up most of my bikes, I am not intimidated by disassembling and re-assembling the bike. But it is additional time. My last trip was not with my S&S bike, I had my folding bike in the S&S case. But that takes as much time as packing an S&S bike because the folder is not that small of a folder.
My trips so far were loops, left the case at the motel or in the hostel luggage room. But if I do a route that is not a loop, I will have to figure out how to deal with the case.
The photo is of me leaving the airport a couple months ago when I did a trip in Texas. I am wearing the S&S backpack case on my back.
#38
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<Sigh> So this guy ships a bike in a box to be put together by the shop. We charge $75 because that's the price of a tune up. Sure, you can bolt the parts on, BUT THEN IT DOESN"T WORK CORRECTLY. So the charge for a build is for the cost of a tune up. There's a busted spoke and a busted cable. We're in the busiest part of the year and I have bikes out the yin yang and your voice mailbox is full, or you don't return my voicemail or answer the phone. To expedite the process, I do the work otherwise my schedule is screwed and my 12 hour day will turn into a 14r, because you're gonna tell me to do it anyway.
Yes, it's crappy the shop did the tack on, they should've gotten in touch. Generally when I take in a job I'll say, "Hey, if I find something else and it's less than $20, I'm not going to chase you down for approval, I'll just do it. If it's more than that, I'll call. I'll leave a message, give you time to respond, but if I don't hear from you, the bike WILL NOT BE DONE WHEN PROMISED." Then detail the call history on the work order. But sometimes, I will just do the work. It's on the stand and I just want it in the done pile. We're booked out 3 weeks for service now. Your mechanic, who is barely making a living wage, does not have time to hold your hand while you decide whether or not to spend $50 extra because your bike was banged up coming out of the box. If it bugs you, learn how to do it yourself. BTW, Bike Gallery in Portland does good work.
I'll apologize in advance for the rant.
Yes, it's crappy the shop did the tack on, they should've gotten in touch. Generally when I take in a job I'll say, "Hey, if I find something else and it's less than $20, I'm not going to chase you down for approval, I'll just do it. If it's more than that, I'll call. I'll leave a message, give you time to respond, but if I don't hear from you, the bike WILL NOT BE DONE WHEN PROMISED." Then detail the call history on the work order. But sometimes, I will just do the work. It's on the stand and I just want it in the done pile. We're booked out 3 weeks for service now. Your mechanic, who is barely making a living wage, does not have time to hold your hand while you decide whether or not to spend $50 extra because your bike was banged up coming out of the box. If it bugs you, learn how to do it yourself. BTW, Bike Gallery in Portland does good work.
I'll apologize in advance for the rant.
Similar policy. First:
Doing all I can to keep the reputation of a "fair play" - never charge what isn't done, never do what isn't asked and/or necessary.
Second: with such reputation (100% of customers come by word of mouth), I spend the time to check a bike before doing any work and estimate the "worst case scenario" cost. If the customer is not happy with that, they look for another shop, or settle with a bike that is not fully functional.
On top of all that, I always make sure to leave some "room" in case something unexpected happens. Negotiate a budget under which I can fix something I find necessary without wasting time on phone calls. Do they want the cheapest parts that work OK, or high(er) end replacements if some are needed etc. Simplest example is asking for approval in advance to change the cassette, if the old one starts skipping with a new chain, and figuring whether the replacement will be budget, or high end etc.
This saves both me and the customers time and hassle.
It's tricky, like most other jobs that require working with customers, you have to be patient, listen, and try to figure out what makes people happy. I prefer taking a loss, if there's even a slightest doubt I've "damaged" the customer in any way. Still, I'm sure out of a 1000 people, there will be at least a few who will still not be happy - that's life and the business. Last "close call" was a 20 year old who's grandmother wanted to surprise by paying to have their commuting bike fixed. The bike hadn't seen any service for at least 10 years IMO. The guy found out how much the service had cost, came in angry. I told him what I had done and replaced on the bike and fortunately had the removed parts still in the shop to show the state they were in. That turned his attitude completely around and it was all good.
Last edited by Bike Gremlin; 06-27-18 at 10:02 AM.
#39
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If I was going on tour and my bike needed work I would be happy for someone to fix the bike as needed. It all sounds like a reasonable cost and nothing way out of the ordinary and relatively cheaper than my area but that is fair being it is a different area and prices can change drastically. They probably should have stopped work and called you for approval if the amount added is over a certain percentage of the total. However again it didn't seem out of the ordinary so I wouldn't worry too much. I might mention that they didn't call about the additional costs when you pick up but in a nice polite manner.
We get a lot of bikes that come in and get a short initial estimate and then when the mechanic goes to work on a bike they might notice more and while we call for additional charges a lot of customers don't get their messages phone or email and whine and complain when we haven't fixed their bike yet because we were waiting on their approval and we called them or emailed them about it. I can understand other shops just going ahead with safety stuff like that. Bar tape or replacing something more cosmetic I would certainly wait but especially for a touring cyclist trying to start their tour I would want to make sure the bike is in tip-top shape.
To the "ex-shop owner" who claims you are getting "bilked" you aren't for many of the reasons stated above. It is nice when people think they did stuff but it sounds like in reality they didn't or they did it so long ago that things have changed. If they just went ahead and charged you several hundreds of dollars for random stuff then yes but for building a boxed bike and fixing important issues they did it cheaply.
We get a lot of bikes that come in and get a short initial estimate and then when the mechanic goes to work on a bike they might notice more and while we call for additional charges a lot of customers don't get their messages phone or email and whine and complain when we haven't fixed their bike yet because we were waiting on their approval and we called them or emailed them about it. I can understand other shops just going ahead with safety stuff like that. Bar tape or replacing something more cosmetic I would certainly wait but especially for a touring cyclist trying to start their tour I would want to make sure the bike is in tip-top shape.
To the "ex-shop owner" who claims you are getting "bilked" you aren't for many of the reasons stated above. It is nice when people think they did stuff but it sounds like in reality they didn't or they did it so long ago that things have changed. If they just went ahead and charged you several hundreds of dollars for random stuff then yes but for building a boxed bike and fixing important issues they did it cheaply.
#40
Banned
Out here for $10 the box would be waiting for you when you arrive if marked
'do not assemble' in writing, on the carton.
If nothing indicated, a phone number to ask 'what do you want?', is useful..
...
'do not assemble' in writing, on the carton.
If nothing indicated, a phone number to ask 'what do you want?', is useful..
...
#41
Senior Member
Yes, it's crappy the shop did the tack on, they should've gotten in touch. Generally when I take in a job I'll say, "Hey, if I find something else and it's less than $20, I'm not going to chase you down for approval, I'll just do it. If it's more than that, I'll call. I'll leave a message, give you time to respond, but if I don't hear from you, the bike WILL NOT BE DONE WHEN PROMISED." Then detail the call history on the work order. But sometimes, I will just do the work. It's on the stand and I just want it in the done pile. We're booked out 3 weeks for service now. Your mechanic, who is barely making a living wage, does not have time to hold your hand while you decide whether or not to spend $50 extra because your bike was banged up coming out of the box. If it bugs you, learn how to do it yourself. BTW, Bike Gallery in Portland does good work.
I'll apologize in advance for the rant.
I'll apologize in advance for the rant.
The person who can explain in more detail is the guy in the shop - but you haven't spoken to him yet.
But you've named his business on an online forum. And someone has told you that he's bilked you! Their conduct has been described as unprofessional.
I think that's appalling!
The first thing you should do is remove the name of the bike shop.
If you decide after talking to the man himself that you have received inferior service, then by all means go nuclear on social media. But at this stage???
If it was my bike shop and I read your posts your bike would be waiting for you, alright - packed up in its box! No charge!
Your $119 is not worth it.
But you've named his business on an online forum. And someone has told you that he's bilked you! Their conduct has been described as unprofessional.
I think that's appalling!
The first thing you should do is remove the name of the bike shop.
If you decide after talking to the man himself that you have received inferior service, then by all means go nuclear on social media. But at this stage???
If it was my bike shop and I read your posts your bike would be waiting for you, alright - packed up in its box! No charge!
Your $119 is not worth it.
For what it’s worth, I don’t think they did anything wrong other than not getting an OK before doing the work. There probably was a questionable spoke, etc, but replacing things without asking is shady and that’s exactly how people do bilk. Not a good practice even if you’re doing legitimate work.
Last edited by 3speed; 07-02-18 at 04:50 AM.
#42
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Yep. I doubt bike shops are covered the same, but in Michigan an auto shop must provide a written estimate before doing any work, and get a signed approval if that is to change more than $20 by law. Really protects the consumer AND the shop. $60 in extra work might be a breaking point on someone's finances, as much as it may be an insignificant amount to others.
#43
Senior Member
time is money, vacations aren't cheap, you only have so much time.
not knowing whether the shop owner tried to reach you and was
unsuccessful....but let's assume they tried.
and let's assume you flew into portland, taxied to the bike shop, ready to
start your vacation, but....your bike wasn't ready.
owner says they assembled your bike as requested, but found a few
problems. tried to reach you, but...well....no answer, so they couldn't
perform the needed repairs. now what?
are you going to ride off (after signing a liability waiver!) with a frayed
straddle cable and a broken spoke? or are you going to hope they'll
reschedule all the work in the shop - during the busy season - to fit
you in so you can leave now?
what are the odds there would be online complaints about a shop that
didn't have your bike ready, making you miss your first day or two of
vacation, lose deposits on the lovely B&B's you'd booked, or have to
try to reschedule the train you were going to catch that afternoon?
not knowing whether the shop owner tried to reach you and was
unsuccessful....but let's assume they tried.
and let's assume you flew into portland, taxied to the bike shop, ready to
start your vacation, but....your bike wasn't ready.
owner says they assembled your bike as requested, but found a few
problems. tried to reach you, but...well....no answer, so they couldn't
perform the needed repairs. now what?
are you going to ride off (after signing a liability waiver!) with a frayed
straddle cable and a broken spoke? or are you going to hope they'll
reschedule all the work in the shop - during the busy season - to fit
you in so you can leave now?
what are the odds there would be online complaints about a shop that
didn't have your bike ready, making you miss your first day or two of
vacation, lose deposits on the lovely B&B's you'd booked, or have to
try to reschedule the train you were going to catch that afternoon?
#44
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That certainly is the other way to look at it.
If you booked a vacation, flight, shipped a bike to be reassembled etc... perhaps the shop assumed you would want a bike that could complete the tour and would not complain that they took the initiative to have it ready to go when you arrived. In the grand scheme of things, an extra $50 was pretty reasonable for what they fixed. It would really suck to have them strictly adhere to what was agreed upon and then arrive to find a bike not in the best of shape right at the start of a tour. Just staying one extra day to have it fixed would cost at least a hotel room and a couple of meals plus the same repairs.
Part of the "blame" if such a word might be used should lay with the OP. If you are shipping a bike to a strange shop with the idea that it is to be put together for a tour either be explicit about what is to be done and ensure the bike is is good shape before hand or accept that the shop made reasonable repairs to ensure that it is. Before jumping to the gun to blame the shop for something it may be that they really had your best interests at heart and wanted you to have a safe and successful trip. No good deed goes unpunished as they say.
I would also think that if $60 bucks were that big a deal breaker for a traveler (which it do agree it may be for some) then they shouldn't/wouldn't be paying someone to do something so basic and simple as reassembling their bike in the first place. That's a luxury convenience, not a needed repair.
If you booked a vacation, flight, shipped a bike to be reassembled etc... perhaps the shop assumed you would want a bike that could complete the tour and would not complain that they took the initiative to have it ready to go when you arrived. In the grand scheme of things, an extra $50 was pretty reasonable for what they fixed. It would really suck to have them strictly adhere to what was agreed upon and then arrive to find a bike not in the best of shape right at the start of a tour. Just staying one extra day to have it fixed would cost at least a hotel room and a couple of meals plus the same repairs.
Part of the "blame" if such a word might be used should lay with the OP. If you are shipping a bike to a strange shop with the idea that it is to be put together for a tour either be explicit about what is to be done and ensure the bike is is good shape before hand or accept that the shop made reasonable repairs to ensure that it is. Before jumping to the gun to blame the shop for something it may be that they really had your best interests at heart and wanted you to have a safe and successful trip. No good deed goes unpunished as they say.
I would also think that if $60 bucks were that big a deal breaker for a traveler (which it do agree it may be for some) then they shouldn't/wouldn't be paying someone to do something so basic and simple as reassembling their bike in the first place. That's a luxury convenience, not a needed repair.
Last edited by Happy Feet; 07-02-18 at 10:30 AM.
#45
Senior Member
^ I completely agree with all that you’ve said as far as them likely having the best intentions, and assuming someone already paying to have the bike put back together probably isn’t too worried about $50, etc. But at the end of the day, you just shouldn’t ever charge someone more than you said you would. It’s just poor practice, and if it’s allowed, even when intentions are good, where does it stop? Maybe OP really wanted this trip so badly he made a questionable financial decision and has already stretched the budget. Maybe OP has recently learned how to repair the spoke for just such a situation, and would have wanted the opportunity to give it a go himself and use his newly learned skills. Maybe this shop isn’t shady, but if this practice were allowed, you can surely bet all of the shady ones will damn sure take advantage of it. For so many reasons, this is something that just can’t happen. It’s very poor business practice. And it would suck if a trip were delayed due to this sort of thing(though I can assure you given the bike shop on practically every block in Portland, it could get fixed in a matter of hours), but as you said, the OP wouldn’t be blameless in that situation. He is responsible for checking over his bike and making sure it’s all in good working order before shipping it out for the tour.
#46
Full Member
First, a little humour....
Your post reminded me of this...
A guy went to see his doctor. He was very nervous and very agitated, sweat flowing from every pore on his body.
In the waiting room was one other man, looking just as nervous.
They both avoided eye contact with each other, looking nervously everywhere except at each other.
Eventually, unable to bear the tension anymore, our hero turned to his fellow man and whispered
“What are you here for?”
The stranger looked up in terror, shaking and stuttered that he’d rather not say.Silence resumed.
After a few more moments the stranger turned to our hero and asked him what he was here for.
Our hero mirrored the terror in the stranger’s eyes and whispered
“I have a green ring in a place where there shouldn’t be a ring”, looking down at this crotch.
The stranger gasped loudly and our hero cringed at his shame.
“That’s amazing! I have a red ring around mine!”
All of a sudden, the world seemed a little less scary for our hero, a problem shared and all that.
Just then the nurse called the stranger in to see the doctor. The fear returned to his face, his shuffle to the door was like a condemned man’s last steps.
Two minutes later he bounded out the door, beaming from ear to ear and literally skipped out the door. “Wiped off with a tissue!” he laughed as he left.
Our hero was called in to see the doctor and buoyed by his neighbour’s exit, walked confidently in and dropped his trousers.
“This is very serious”, said the grave faced doctor. “No medication is going to work here. It’s too far gone. If we amputate, we may be able to save your life”.
“But..... but.....but..” warbled our hero, his eyes filling with tears, “the other guy danced out of here. He said you wiped it off with a tissue!"
The doctor looked at him seriously...
“there’s a difference between lipstick and gangrene”
My point is that every case is different, and the difference is not always clear until you’re right there.
Thanks for proving my point
Based on one side of an argument you have decided that the anonymous OP is in the right and the named business is wrong.
That was exactly my point. The OP could have received the exact same responses by simply stating “A bike shop....”.
And you go on to say...
I respectfully disagree. As does just about any reasonable system of justice – the accused always should have the opportunity to present a defence. Again, especially in the case of a named business versus an anonymous poster.
With those long distance mechanical diagnosis skills do you want to come and work in my bike shop?
First of all, no need to get personal.
Second of all, I was trying to suggest to the OP that actions have consequences, that publicly calling out a business prior to attempting to solve the issue with the business could backfire.
I know where I live (not Portland, sorry!) that if I have a problem with a service and bring a case to a higher authority the very first question I will be asked will be what attempts I have made to solve the issue with the business first.
Furthermore, in the part of my post you omitted, I questioned if the matter at hand had less to do with the $54 extra charges and more to do with the attitude of the OP, given their misgivings prior to their tour.
You’ve used maybe 3 times in this post, allow me the same courtesy....
Maybe this is all a big misunderstanding and when the OP arrived it turned out the bike shop got confused between some of the many bikes they had to assemble and the extra charges are for another customer who had agreed in advance.
Maybe the OP should have been a bit more switched on and understood fully what was and what was not included in the services and what to do in the event of any extra work.
Maybe the OP was a bit embarrassed when he got the message/email/smoke signal that the bike he had shipped wasn’t fit for the tour because of the frayed brake cable and the wobbly rear wheel. And rather than feel embarrassed, it’s easier to be angry at the bike mechanic.
The facts are that we don’t know all the facts. Naming a business online before even speaking to them about the issue, is, to my way of thinking, unfair.
Being unfair creates bad karma. I certainly don’t want bad karma weighing me down on my bike, even if my wheels are true.
Also, getting worked up before I even get on my bike for a tour is a sure fire way of making it more difficult to enjoy my tour.
And yes, I have run several successful businesses, one of them my own. Not bike shops, because with my mechanical skills they certainly wouldn’t be successful! But in customer service. And yes, I have refused to serve some customers who will not or can not follow normal business/social practises. I have some great stories. And sometimes, after a bit of reflection, those people, became some of my greatest customers and advocates. Go figure.
TL;DR
Off colour joke.
OP was having a bad day. I think he shouldn't have named the shop until he had spoken to them.
Your post reminded me of this...
A guy went to see his doctor. He was very nervous and very agitated, sweat flowing from every pore on his body.
In the waiting room was one other man, looking just as nervous.
They both avoided eye contact with each other, looking nervously everywhere except at each other.
Eventually, unable to bear the tension anymore, our hero turned to his fellow man and whispered
“What are you here for?”
The stranger looked up in terror, shaking and stuttered that he’d rather not say.Silence resumed.
After a few more moments the stranger turned to our hero and asked him what he was here for.
Our hero mirrored the terror in the stranger’s eyes and whispered
“I have a green ring in a place where there shouldn’t be a ring”, looking down at this crotch.
The stranger gasped loudly and our hero cringed at his shame.
“That’s amazing! I have a red ring around mine!”
All of a sudden, the world seemed a little less scary for our hero, a problem shared and all that.
Just then the nurse called the stranger in to see the doctor. The fear returned to his face, his shuffle to the door was like a condemned man’s last steps.
Two minutes later he bounded out the door, beaming from ear to ear and literally skipped out the door. “Wiped off with a tissue!” he laughed as he left.
Our hero was called in to see the doctor and buoyed by his neighbour’s exit, walked confidently in and dropped his trousers.
“This is very serious”, said the grave faced doctor. “No medication is going to work here. It’s too far gone. If we amputate, we may be able to save your life”.
“But..... but.....but..” warbled our hero, his eyes filling with tears, “the other guy danced out of here. He said you wiped it off with a tissue!"
The doctor looked at him seriously...
“there’s a difference between lipstick and gangrene”
My point is that every case is different, and the difference is not always clear until you’re right there.
Thanks for proving my point
Based on one side of an argument you have decided that the anonymous OP is in the right and the named business is wrong.
That was exactly my point. The OP could have received the exact same responses by simply stating “A bike shop....”.
And you go on to say...
I respectfully disagree. As does just about any reasonable system of justice – the accused always should have the opportunity to present a defence. Again, especially in the case of a named business versus an anonymous poster.
And really, you’re gonna pack someone’s bike back up and not do the job because they made a thread questioning a Very poor decision made by one of your bike mechanics(or maybe yourself considering your viewpoints expressed above)? Good luck running a successful business of any kind with that attitude. Hell, are you the owner of said shop?...
Second of all, I was trying to suggest to the OP that actions have consequences, that publicly calling out a business prior to attempting to solve the issue with the business could backfire.
I know where I live (not Portland, sorry!) that if I have a problem with a service and bring a case to a higher authority the very first question I will be asked will be what attempts I have made to solve the issue with the business first.
Furthermore, in the part of my post you omitted, I questioned if the matter at hand had less to do with the $54 extra charges and more to do with the attitude of the OP, given their misgivings prior to their tour.
^ I completely agree with all that you’ve said as far as them likely having the best intentions, and assuming someone already paying to have the bike put back together probably isn’t too worried about $50, etc. But at the end of the day, you just shouldn’t ever charge someone more than you said you would. It’s just poor practice, and if it’s allowed, even when intentions are good, where does it stop? Maybe OP really wanted this trip so badly he made a questionable financial decision and has already stretched the budget. Maybe OP has recently learned how to repair the spoke for just such a situation, and would have wanted the opportunity to give it a go himself and use his newly learned skills. Maybe this shop isn’t shady, but if this practice were allowed, you can surely bet all of the shady ones will damn sure take advantage of it. For so many reasons, this is something that just can’t happen. It’s very poor business practice. And it would suck if a trip were delayed due to this sort of thing(though I can assure you given the bike shop on practically every block in Portland, it could get fixed in a matter of hours), but as you said, the OP wouldn’t be blameless in that situation. He is responsible for checking over his bike and making sure it’s all in good working order before shipping it out for the tour.
Maybe this is all a big misunderstanding and when the OP arrived it turned out the bike shop got confused between some of the many bikes they had to assemble and the extra charges are for another customer who had agreed in advance.
Maybe the OP should have been a bit more switched on and understood fully what was and what was not included in the services and what to do in the event of any extra work.
Maybe the OP was a bit embarrassed when he got the message/email/smoke signal that the bike he had shipped wasn’t fit for the tour because of the frayed brake cable and the wobbly rear wheel. And rather than feel embarrassed, it’s easier to be angry at the bike mechanic.
The facts are that we don’t know all the facts. Naming a business online before even speaking to them about the issue, is, to my way of thinking, unfair.
Being unfair creates bad karma. I certainly don’t want bad karma weighing me down on my bike, even if my wheels are true.
Also, getting worked up before I even get on my bike for a tour is a sure fire way of making it more difficult to enjoy my tour.
And yes, I have run several successful businesses, one of them my own. Not bike shops, because with my mechanical skills they certainly wouldn’t be successful! But in customer service. And yes, I have refused to serve some customers who will not or can not follow normal business/social practises. I have some great stories. And sometimes, after a bit of reflection, those people, became some of my greatest customers and advocates. Go figure.
TL;DR
Off colour joke.
OP was having a bad day. I think he shouldn't have named the shop until he had spoken to them.
#47
Senior Member
Thiere’s so much there and no real point to going on about it, so I’ll not. In the end, he was charged for something without prior consultation. That’s All that matters here. Speaking of the “justice system,” find me One who says it’s OK for a business to make an agreement and then decide to do extra work and charge the customer for it without authorization.
#48
Full Member
Although I agree that the Bike Shop should have first consulted the OP, I can also see it from the shop's point of view.
If the OP was on tour and day 2 the brake cable or spoke failed, resulting in injury to himself or others, the bike shop may be held liable since the bike was just put together at the shop and may be considered a faulty build or repair. Brakes and wheels are somewhat critical components.
My Question is, if the bike shop did consult the OP first, what would he have said? Yes, repair/fix it. OR. No, don't.
And, did the OP at the time ask to talk to a manager and indicate the services were not requested and perhaps come to a compromise?
If the OP was on tour and day 2 the brake cable or spoke failed, resulting in injury to himself or others, the bike shop may be held liable since the bike was just put together at the shop and may be considered a faulty build or repair. Brakes and wheels are somewhat critical components.
My Question is, if the bike shop did consult the OP first, what would he have said? Yes, repair/fix it. OR. No, don't.
And, did the OP at the time ask to talk to a manager and indicate the services were not requested and perhaps come to a compromise?
#49
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: northern Deep South
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OP tossed this turd in the punch bowl 10 days ago and went on tour. Seems like he successfully vented -- and gave us something to argue about.
Since OP apparently didn't discuss this with the mechanic or manager, it would appear he wasn't concerned about the extra money, only that he was charged extra. Since he argued a ways back that he didn't have time to put the bike together himself because he was on vacation, it seems reasonable for the shop to make sure his bike was ready to ride. OP may or may not live in a high insurance claims area (meaning juries are likely to side with a plaintiff against anyone who has insurance); without an easy way to check on this, extra service to defend against a possible legal claim seems quite reasonable for the shop to perform.
For at least a couple decades now, ever since I got back into cycling and got interested in bike touring, standard advice has been to go over your bike carefully, or have your LBS do it for you, to make sure it's in sound mechanical shape before you leave home. For all the outrage I've read over a shop making sure OP's bike was ready to ride, where's the concern that the OP did a half baked job of getting ready to go tour?
Since OP apparently didn't discuss this with the mechanic or manager, it would appear he wasn't concerned about the extra money, only that he was charged extra. Since he argued a ways back that he didn't have time to put the bike together himself because he was on vacation, it seems reasonable for the shop to make sure his bike was ready to ride. OP may or may not live in a high insurance claims area (meaning juries are likely to side with a plaintiff against anyone who has insurance); without an easy way to check on this, extra service to defend against a possible legal claim seems quite reasonable for the shop to perform.
For at least a couple decades now, ever since I got back into cycling and got interested in bike touring, standard advice has been to go over your bike carefully, or have your LBS do it for you, to make sure it's in sound mechanical shape before you leave home. For all the outrage I've read over a shop making sure OP's bike was ready to ride, where's the concern that the OP did a half baked job of getting ready to go tour?
#50
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 11,112
Bikes: 1961 Ideor, 1966 Perfekt 3 Speed AB Hub, 1994 Bridgestone MB-6, 2006 Airnimal Joey, 2009 Thorn Sherpa, 2013 Thorn Nomad MkII, 2015 VO Pass Hunter, 2017 Lynskey Backroad, 2017 Raleigh Gran Prix, 1980s Bianchi Mixte on a trainer. Others are now gone.
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