Trekker-1701

Hi All,

I need a little help. I am a fairly serious recreational road cyclist (2,500 miles a year) and due to a case of persistent bursitis in my left elbow now find myself seriously considering the purchase of a recumbent for the first time. I am 48 years old and consider myself an A/B (18-20mph) group rider, and would like to continue riding at this level on a bent with my cycling friends. What I am looking for are recommendations of bikes to consider. Based on my admittedly limited research on the subject, I have come to the impression that I should probably be looking at a tall short wheel base bike such as the Bacchetta Strada or Corsa, or the Rans F5. Am I on the right track? What are your impressions of any of these bikes in a fast group ride including some pace line riding? Any other ideas for bikes I should consider for this type of riding?

Thanks for your input.

Regards,

Jay

Trsnrtr

Highracers work pretty well in pacelines once the uprights get over the "oddity" of it. As for helping your elbow, I wouldn't know.

Regardless, highracers are your best bet if you are interested in "fitting in" with uprights. If you want to be your own speed demon, then you might want to consider lowracers, too.

Trekker-1701

Thanks for the feedback. I really appreciate it. And as far as helping the bursitis in my elbow goes, I think switching from a diamond framed bike to a recumbent will really help since I would not be placing any weight on my arms any longer. Most of my elbow pain issues went away over the off season when I was not on a bike as much. For much of the winter I just did spin classes, and did not ride out of doors. However, now that good cycling weather has finally returned here to the north country and I'm putting in some miles, my elbow pain is back with a vengeance.

You mentioned lowracers for consideration as well. What are the characteristics of bikes that would be considered lowracers? Do you have any examples?

Another bike that caught by eye was the Rans V-Rex or Ti-Rex. They look somewhat like a SWB highracer but with a smaller front wheel. What are the advantages/disadvantages of say the Rans F5 highracer vs. the V-Rex? Are heal strike issues reduced with the use of the smaller front wheel? I'm just trying to get my mind around what needs to be considered when shopping for a recumbent.

Thanks again for your input.

Regards,

Jay

Northwestrider

I have a the Bacchetta Strada, and like it very much. If I were to buy again, I think I'd pick up the Corsa. As for characteristics, very comfortable, not as maneuverable as a DF bike IMO. They go up hills ok , but likely not quite as well as your used to, oh and did I mention they are very comfortable.... I would suggest that a head rest will be found useful.

Retro Grouch 

I think that for a first recumbent seat height and bottom bracket height are biggies. The value of visiting a recumbent specialty shop where you can see, sit on and ride the various styles of recumbents can't be overstated.

Trekker-1701

Thanks for the advise, and I certainly plan on test riding several makes and styles of recumbents before I make a decision. For that matter, I am pretty lucky to live in one of the better cycling cities in the US, the Twin Cities area of Minnesota. We have lots of bikes shops in the area, and one in particular (Calhoun Cycles) that carries a lot of recumbents. I realize that as with any bike, the only way to truly tell if a particular one is "right for you" is to test ride it, recumbent or not. I'm just trying to gain a little knowledge on the subject before I go shopping and test riding.

Thanks again for the advise.

Jay

Trsnrtr

Sure, do a search on Velokraft, Optima Baron, M5 recumbents, Challenge Fujin or the slightly higher Catbike Musashi. Those are just a few of the lowracers available. Here's a pic of my Velokraft VK2:

JanMM

Another type of go-fast bike to consider is a long wheelbase like the RANS X-Stream. https://www.ransbikes.com/Xstream-N.htm

Might not work so well in a paceline, though. I loves my V3, which was replaced by the X-Stream. I'm generally not fast enough to worry about fitting in with a paceline.

defjack

If you already have a good road bike think about the Cruzbike Silvio. I have 8000 miles on mine and its still going strong. Jack

Steamer

The higher the BB is in relationship to the seat the more aerodynamic the bike is. The F5 is a pretty fast bike, the V-Rex - not so much.

JanMM

2 big wheels not only get an aero benefit but also roll over imperfections in road surfaces more easily than the small/big wheel combo on the V-Rex.

Trekker-1701

Thanks for that insight. I remember reading about the benefits of bigger wheels being able to roll over imperfections easier, but it was more in the context of the advantages of 29" vs. 26" wheels on mountain bikes. Another question. Is one of the trade offs is that you end up with more heal/tire interference in a bent with a big front wheel?

I did look at the Optima High Baron on their web site and found it pretty interesting. (Thanks for the suggestion.) I am a tall guy (6'5.5") with a long 37" inseam. I found the fact that they claim no crank / tire overlap for us long legged folks an interesting (desirable?) feature. Too bad they don't have any dealers in my area of the county. I would love to take one for a test ride.

Jay

Trekker-1701

That makes since, but I hadn't really noticed that relationship when initially looking at the bikes on the Rans web site. Thanks for the insight!

Jay

BlazingPedals

Like Dennis, I have both a highracer and a lowracer. I'd say, if you plan on mixing it up with uprights, you're going to want a highracer. Dennis' VK2 is a beautiful machine, and fast too; but lowracers are for smoking uprights, not riding with them.

Along with my recommendation of a highracer, I'd also say you should get one with an adjustable seat. Riding reclined is a new experience, and it takes some time to get used to. You're going to want it more upright at first, and then you'll probably lower the seat angle as you get more comfortable with it. Of the 'stick bike' highracers, the Bacchettas keep getting the highest marks for stiffness and speed. I think the Corsas have a great cost/performance ratio. Of course if you want to go more exotic (carbon) they're out there. If you really want the speed, then look at the carbon shell seats, which transfer power better but aren't as airy as the mesh ones.

I can't say I recommend my M5 CHR. In addition to the difficulty of buying one in the States, it's a bit too low for taller upright riders to draft; although most of the shorter guys and women can do it. But like with the VK2, going against 3-4 of your buddies on uprights is YOU WIN: GAME OVER, because you can cruise faster than any of them can pull the paceline. In practice, what that translates to is that you're fresh at the end of the ride, and if you get 'happy feet' in the middle of the ride, they don't reel you in until you let them.

The Cruzbikes are a love-them or hate-them product. There is no in-between. Personally, after thinking they looked cool and trying one, I decided I hate them. To say they have pedal-steer from H*ll is a gross understatement. My advice there is to not even consider them unless you can do a protracted test ride.

BTW, I have a V-Rex. It's very comfortable but it's the slowest recumbent I have. At one point I had it hot-rodded with front fairing, tailbox, and wheel covers; but even then it was 1 mph slower than my Baron in a 1-hour time trial.

SesameCrunch

True enough. There's a wide range of reactions to the Cruzbike's front-wheel drive, moving bottom bracket design. I just got a Silvio as my first recumbent. For me the transition was easy. I wonder if it's harder for long-time 'bent riders to adjust to the "pedal steer" that comes with the FWD-MBB format? For me, as a newbie, maybe I didn't have any existing notions of the ride, and just went with what the bike was telling me.

A big factor in my choosing the Silvio is the 700C compatibility. I bought a frameset and built it up with components I already had.

Trekker-1701

Hi All,

Well, I went out and test rode my first bent today: a Bacchetta Corsa with the 650C wheels. This being my first time on a recumbent of any kind, I'll have to say it was a little weird at first, but after 15 minutes or so I'd say I was "adjusting" better than I thought I would so early on. I'd definitely say it felt "squirrely" in the handling department compared to my 63cm 2006 Trek 2100 road bike. But then again I have ridden my Trek for so long that I am very comfortable putting it exactly where I want it when I want it. I think I will try to go back and test ride it again when I can go out for a little longer ride of at least 30 minutes to an hour or so. I also want to find some hills and see how I feel about climbing on a bent.

Now here's a question for you long time performance bent riders. How long did it take for you to become as comfortable with your bike handling skills on your bent as you were with your bike handling skills on your upright road bike? Or do they always feel a bit "squirrely" in the handling department when compared to an upright road bike? (I am referring specifically to SWB High Racers here, as I am sure the LWB bents handle completely differently.)

Thanks for you input.

Jay

Trsnrtr

First off, the Corsa is a good choice.

Now, as for being comfortable on handling of a highracer, here are a few tips:

Make sure the seat to crank length is close to perfect. It makes a huge difference in handling. A little short or a little long on your leg reach and the handling gets pretty wonky.

Next, grip the bars with a very light touch. A firm grip on the bars can cause a lot of problems. Grip them gently.

Remember to shift down at stops. You'll probably learn this tip pretty fast especially if you stop on an uphill.

Last of all, relax! It will take some time but most people feel pretty comfortable after a couple rides.

BlazingPedals

One thing with the highracers is to make sure it's not too small for you. The seat may slide back far enough to accommodate your leg length, but also make sure your shoulders are ahead of the rear axle, even when you're fully reclined. If the weight distribution is too far back, high-speed handling goes weird in a hurry; although it may not be apparent at lower speeds.

It took me about 300 miles to feel comfortable riding next to another bike.

Trsnrtr

Yep, I probably understated that one. 300 miles is probably about right.

Trekker-1701

Thanks for the tip on the center of gravity and fore/aft weight distribution issue. I rode the XL frame size so I would hope it would be okay, but I will have to look into that when I go back for the extended test ride. I did not get going too fast last evening on my initial test ride, but the bike did start to feel a little squirrely as my speed increased. Enough so that it was becoming a little worrisome. Not too unlike how my old 27" mid '80's steel frame bike feels on a high speed decent when the noodley frames starts to wobble. (And yes, it actually is a 27" frame, not just a bike with 27" wheels. Did I mention I am 6'5"? Well, it was the largest production frame I could find back in 1984 when I bought it.)

BTW, what is generally considered proper leg length setup on a highracer? Is it similar to a setup for a DF road bike; just a slight bend in the knee at the bottom of the pedal stroke? I'm guessing the old "knee over pedal spindle" rule gets thrown out the window on a recumbent. Am I right? If so, are there any other general fitting rules of thumb that are followed for recumbents? This is a whole new world for me.

On another note, I was seriously thinking of trying to get a test ride on one of the new 700C Bacchetta Corsas. My thinking is that since I am so tall, it might fit me better. I could be off on that though. In any case, I will most likely need to go with the largest frame size any of the highracer manufacturers produce. Too bad my local Bacchetta dealer does not have any of the new 700C Corsas in stock, but I understand they are just now showing up in the pipeline anyway so he may get one in soon. I'll have to talk to him about that.

Jay

Northwestrider

Yes, you still should have a slight bend in the knee at full pedal extension. IMO opinion, slow speed handling will never match that of a DF bike, and I've quite a few miles on my bent. High speed handling however for me was never a problem. I once hit 55 mph down hill with an accurately set up computer on a very steep hill and my strada felt stable and not at all squirrelly. Make sure your grip on the bars is light and the Corsa should handle just fine at the higher speeds.

AlexZ

I don't know...."a really fast first recumbent" .......That's like a fresh, delicious, non fattening bread; ain't no such thing, in my opinion.
By the time you get your bent-legs in shape , no matter which bike you bought , you will be drooling over the next "fastest" to get.....

So why not start with something proven, something that set some records (with the right human motor) something which can be made into a rocket ship with just the addition of a sock and fairing ? And that would be a GRR (Gold Rush Replica from Easy Racers) or a Lightning P-38 ?

Going from a DF to a recumbent and immediately going into a Low Racer or even High Racer will be a drastic, painful and expensive transition which may or may not turn out well. On the other hand, there are few recumbents you would be able to resell as easily as a GRR or a P-38.....try to find a used one, it may be tough.....

BlazingPedals

Laid-back bikes are harder to learn. Thus my suggestion for one with a seat having an adjustable angle. A GRR (with fairing) is probably similar in speed to your average upright road bike; a bare P-38 maybe close. While going the faired route is OK, (and I've been down that road,) reducing frontal is more desirable to me than streamlining; because it's 'free' in the sense that it doesn't add weight, complexity, or cost. And if you're riding with upright riders, they tend to view fairings as one of the things that make recumbents 'weird.'

Steamer

I personally think this is a little over the top. This is how it goes for some folks, but I've also seen people who have never ridden a bent before go from first trying a LWB, then to a SWB, and then to a high racer in the span of less than an hour. This is in a sheltered, flat test riding environment, so sure, it would take longer for them to have total confidence in all terrain, in traffic, etc. but some folks 'get it' right away, and some folks don't. So long as a person has the opportunity to try some different bents before they buy, there is no reason to conceptually limit the thinking on what 'bent they may be happy purchasing initially.

Trekker-1701

Thanks for the encouragement. And I would have to say for me personally, I did not really feel all that uncomfortable even after only 30 minutes on the Corsa. I could definitely see myself doing this, although if mixing it up with the uprights wasn't one of my goals, I could certainly see myself looking at a low racer. They look like an extreme go fast thrill. The sense of speed must be incredible being so close to the ground. In any case, I haven't developed the "bent" legs yet of course, so I am fully expecting a ramp up period getting all the right muscles in shape if I were to make the change to any style bent.

Right now I think I may wait for a used Bacchetta Corsa or maybe a Rans Force 5, F5, or other similar bike to come up used on my local Craigslist or possibly on eBay. I would really like to keep my purchase price in the $1,000 price range, and not the $2,000 plus it would take to get into a new Corsa. Hopefully I'll get lucky and find one early in the season instead of later. That way I can test out the bent waters on the cheap before deciding to jump in with both feet and get something like a Bacchetta Carbon Arrow 2.0. ;-)

Jay