Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Folding Bikes
Reload this Page >

Disk brakes too strong? Tern Verge P10

Notices
Folding Bikes Discuss the unique features and issues of folding bikes. Also a great place to learn what folding bike will work best for your needs.

Disk brakes too strong? Tern Verge P10

Old 01-20-22, 11:07 PM
  #1  
uaru
Newbie
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2022
Posts: 1
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Disk brakes too strong? Tern Verge P10

Last year I bought Tern Verge p10.

Unfortunately, soon I had the accident in which I broke my right hand. The reason was, in unexpected situation I hit the brakes, the bike stopped immediately and I did not. Classic.

Just before the accident, my speed was about 17 kph, which I know because of Strava. I do not think it is very high.

This is my first bike with disc brakes, with only one other experience, so I am inexperienced as to how they should behave.

Should not they be more loose? On my previous bikes an accident like this would be much more difficult because the brakes were not so tight. I sometimes feel uncomfortable when the bike is rolling slowly 1-2kph - it feels too easy to completely stop.

My boss has a normal size cross bike with disc brakes, which I use occassionally during lunch breaks. Those brakes are not so immediate, too - I feel much more comfortable with controlling the braking power.

It was set this way by the shop that sold the bike, so if they got it wrong, I do not feel I can trust them.
uaru is offline  
Old 01-21-22, 01:25 AM
  #2  
Joe Remi
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: NorCal
Posts: 1,453

Bikes: Haibike Sduro Trekking SL, Rivendell Appaloosa, Concinnity singlespeed, KHS mini velo (Japan market), Trident Spike trike

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 651 Post(s)
Liked 91 Times in 74 Posts
Hydraulic discs are very powerful with good modulation. They should work well for you but you definitely have to relearn braking from older systems, especially if you're used to caliper road brakes. A light touch is all you need.
Joe Remi is offline  
Old 01-21-22, 05:26 AM
  #3  
base2 
I am potato.
 
base2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 3,074

Bikes: Only precision built, custom high performance elitist machines of the highest caliber. 🍆

Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1765 Post(s)
Liked 1,579 Times in 911 Posts
Classic user error.
I see that the Tern Verge p10 has IS standard brakes. That is post mount brakes on a rotor size adaptor. The smaller wheels will afford a significantly stronger braking force at a given rotor size due to the proportional relationship between the two. It would be tempting to go for a smaller rotor to reduce the leverage that could be exerted & this have a more spongy/ progressive system that would be easier to modulate.

What you don't get is a lower need for heat dissipation. A smaller rotor will overheat & fade sooner, greatly increasing the risk of failure when you need them the most.

The bright side here is the rotors on Tern's website for your bike look like some super light weight ones that couldn't absorb much of a heat load anyway. You might be ok with a smaller road bike specific rotor with more capacity than the OEM one you have. Something such as a Shimano IceTech. Some of them have riffled cooling fins, others have so much material they look almost solid. You would also need a new IS mount adaptor to accommodate the smaller rotor diameter.

I don't know that I'd make that trade. I'm just saying that based on what the website shows in the pictures, that such a thing could be done.
__________________
I shouldn't have to "make myself more visible;" Drivers should just stop running people over.

Car dependency is a tax.
base2 is offline  
Likes For base2:
Old 01-21-22, 07:55 AM
  #4  
Sardines
Full Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Posts: 263
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 102 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 55 Times in 48 Posts
Yes. That is the one pitfall of lightweight two wheeled transport, especially small wheels, the center of mass is high and continues forward, as rapid deceleration occurs, so you tend to tip forward. An experienced rider would lean back when braking hard, but for normal riders, the reflex is to lean on the front bar, which exacerbates the weight transfer and the moment of inertia goes over the braking force.
As your recover, learn to lean back and actuate your rears first, without locking the wheel if possible, before hitting your fronts hard, and of course, learn to lean back quickly as a reflex to emergency hard braking.
Sardines is offline  
Old 01-21-22, 08:14 AM
  #5  
Pinigis 
Senior Member
 
Pinigis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Henrico, VA
Posts: 1,480

Bikes: Origami Gazelle, Origami Crane 8, Origami Cricket 7

Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 452 Post(s)
Liked 405 Times in 241 Posts
It sounds like the brakes work fine, but the rider needs to modulate them properly to stop safely. Disc brakes are great because they work well even when they are wet, and they concentrate the braking force neat the axle. If you slam on the brakes in a moving car (without ABS), you lose control and slide, so you modulate the brakes. The same applies to bikes.
__________________
Paul Pinigis
Owner of Origami Bicycle Company
Pinigis is offline  
Old 01-25-22, 03:45 AM
  #6  
akbejeepin
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2022
Posts: 10
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
the brakes work fine
akbejeepin is offline  
Likes For akbejeepin:
Old 01-27-22, 03:16 PM
  #7  
Ogsarg
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Hollister, CA (not the surf town)
Posts: 1,724

Bikes: 2019 Specialized Roubaix Comp Di2, 2009 Roubaix, early 90's Giant Iguana

Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 636 Post(s)
Liked 1,490 Times in 543 Posts
You just need to get used to the braking force and apply pressure accordingly. If you have any sort of modern car, likely it has the ability to lock up the brakes without much force but you don't worry about that as you're used to it.

To me, the more braking power the better.
Ogsarg is offline  
Old 01-27-22, 03:28 PM
  #8  
fooferdoggie 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 2,343
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 680 Post(s)
Liked 946 Times in 553 Posts
go to a empty parking lot and practice stopping.
fooferdoggie is offline  
Old 01-28-22, 02:06 AM
  #9  
Fentuz
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 714

Bikes: Dahon Jetstream p8 (sold), customized Dahon Helios x10, customzed Dahon Smooth Hound x9,customized Dahon Hammerhead 8.0 d7, Planet X Free Ranger (mullet setup 1x11), Planet X Giovanissimi 20 (1x9), Frog 52 (1x9) and Frog 48 1s

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 249 Post(s)
Liked 221 Times in 162 Posts
Out of interest, what rotor do they have. If you consider that a gravel bike fitted 27.5” tyres is fitted with 160mm rotors, with 20”, 160mm may seem oversized.

Looking a size ratio, 140mm rotor on a 20”rim has similar ration as a 203mm rotor on mtb 29er…
Fentuz is offline  
Old 01-28-22, 10:45 AM
  #10  
Jipe
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,513
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 783 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 233 Times in 198 Posts
Another solution to have a softer braking is changing the disc brake pads to have less powerful ones.

Soft bake pads have a lot of power and wear fast, harder pads have less braking power and last longer.
Jipe is offline  
Old 01-29-22, 05:01 AM
  #11  
Jipe
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,513
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 783 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 233 Times in 198 Posts
I do not agree with this statement.

First, the TRP Spyre with 160mm disc I have on my Birdy Titanium are really OK and do not have much more power than the Ridea caliper on my Brompton. The rotor are TRP rotor but I do not know what brake pads were mounted by Pacific Cycles.

The Shimano Deore hydraulics of my Birdy III are much more powerful than the TRP Spyre with the same disc diameter of 160mm. The reason for this is the type of Shimano disc and brake pads chosen by Riese & Müller (rotor for only resin brake pads with Shimano resin pads, I think its G03S).

I have G04S semi-metal with Shimano XT Ice Tech rotor and these are much more progressive and require more power on the lever to obtain the same braking force.
Jipe is offline  
Old 01-31-22, 06:24 AM
  #12  
Fentuz
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 714

Bikes: Dahon Jetstream p8 (sold), customized Dahon Helios x10, customzed Dahon Smooth Hound x9,customized Dahon Hammerhead 8.0 d7, Planet X Free Ranger (mullet setup 1x11), Planet X Giovanissimi 20 (1x9), Frog 52 (1x9) and Frog 48 1s

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 249 Post(s)
Liked 221 Times in 162 Posts
Originally Posted by Jipe
Another solution to have a softer braking is changing the disc brake pads to have less powerful ones.

Soft bake pads have a lot of power and wear fast, harder pads have less braking power and last longer.

Not quite... I run harder enduro pads and they brake better than soft organic pads. My enduro pads need a little warm up but they stop harder and longer than the soft organic that brake from cold but cannot handle the repeated hard brake and over heat...

As others said, it is about the technic (like with car although cars have abs because many drivers can not modulate). But if the mechanical advantages are not adequate (oversized brake) then, the braking out brake the tyres and the vehicle (car, bike etc.) goes into a skid.

Originally Posted by Jipe
I have G04S semi-metal with Shimano XT Ice Tech rotor and these are much more progressive and require more power on the lever to obtain the same braking force.
Semi metal pads (on bike and car) operate at higher temperature than organic pads. they need to worm up, not more power, but more applications. Yes when you apply more power you will get them to to work but you will create more wear. If you wear to apply the brake lighty a bit earlier, the system will be "hot" and brake better.

When I raced, I used to do the warming lap left foot braking to make my metallic pads would work and once warm, no hard pedal, it was the same as cold organic. Same with my metallic pads in the rain, I clamp them a little as I start the ride to warm up and then, they brake well without excessive force and have good modulation.

Last edited by Fentuz; 01-31-22 at 06:36 AM.
Fentuz is offline  
Old 01-31-22, 07:20 AM
  #13  
Jipe
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,513
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 783 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 233 Times in 198 Posts
What I mean is that resin pads brake immediately hard even with little power on the lever. Later on, indeed they do not resist as well to long braking like in downhill or/and an heavy bike.

But the problem here with this Tern is too much power when starting braking.

Therefore, I think that moving to semi-metalic is a solution with changing the rotor if the one mounted aren't made for semi-metalic pads.
Jipe is offline  
Likes For Jipe:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.