2old

France just passed a law concerning the derestricting of e-bikes. Now punishable by a fine up to $30,000 euros (about $35,000) and one year (individual) or two years (company) in jail.

Lawrence Rhodes

This is happening in San Francisco. Guys putting together or buying commercial bikes and scooters capable of 100 mph.

jgjulio

People that do that will earn a Darwin Award. It really is stupid!

MarcusT

The problem is, many times, they take someone innocent with them

jgjulio

Very good point. The other problem is that you can't fix stupid.

Moe Zhoost

My sense is that France is mostly concerned about owners tweaking to allow speeds over the legal limit (15 mph) to the higher limit allowed in the US (28 mph), not to control wacko hot-rodders. Imposing such an onerous fine is crazy. Why don't they just cite cyclists riding imprudently.

MarcusT

Because there have already been a number of deaths attributed to ebikes going far in excess of the speed limit. It's not so much riding on the road, but these adrenaline freaks ride on bike paths, trails and other paths where pedestrian traffic is a constantly present.
The law of the land is 25 kph, if they want faster then they register it as a motorcycle.

Moe Zhoost

Yep, so punish the dangerous outlaw riders, not the people that want to tweak for more power for ascending hills or carrying greater loads.

jgjulio

Before law enforcement can do anything to those that are dangerous outlaw riders there has to be a law making that behavior illegal. The problem always is in the interpretation of that law by local law enforcement. The enforcement can be logical and appropriate or it can be motivated by other biases that make it a problem.

unterhausen

It's a bit crazy, I'm sure motorists kill in much greater numbers, and nothing is done about them

2old

The bikes are checked to some degree in various countries, but not the US. Bicycles are designed to be safe for a certain power level and speed; otherwise there's nothing wrong with mopeds or motorcycles. The positive aspect is that motorcycles and mopeds are licensed and insured in the US AFAIK so the riders are tested and have coverage.

MarcusT

So, I understand that these tricked bikes need to hurt or kill someone first before they can be punished. Is that what you're saying?

unterhausen

I read it to say that they should be punished if they are caught speeding, but if you want to escalate it all the way to killing people, I think that's on you

Moe Zhoost

No, that is not what I am saying. Sorry you don't understand the concept of controlling bad behavior directly. It's not the bikes that hurt or kill, it's those who ride them in a dangerous manner.

cudak888 

He's saying that there are some legitimate reasons to modify a power-assist system that do not inherently compromise the safety of the public - yet laws like these could adversely affect such modifications.

He's not defending those who hot rod their e-bikes for the express purpose of hotdogging it through a city like an idiot.

-Kurt

MarcusT

Glad to read that. Then let's get back to the law. Any Joe Blow with no experience, training or moral compass can own a legal E-bike because of it's limitations. Now, if Joe Blow wants a power monster so he can go faster, he will need to get training, a motorcycle license, register the bike and insurance.
I see nothing wrong with that

SClaraPokeman

I'm actually surprised that the e-bikes in the US are still not requiring insurance/licensing. In the late 70s mo-peds were similarly regulated as e-bike are today: they could use bike lanes, no license or insurance required, and their speed was limited to about 30 mph (a 50cc engine). With the price of gas relatively high at the time--they were very popular with young people (I had a Vespa). Then insurance and licensing requirements were put into place and this drove them to near extinction within a couple of years. All it will take IMO, is a spate of incidents involving e-bikes for similar regulations to be enacted. Where will this segment of the bike industry be then?

unterhausen

ebikes can't go that fast.

MarcusT

Check out this video. Just one of many

Lawrence Rhodes

Ebikes and small scooters are now capable of 100 mph. It should be illegal to sell them but the loophole is they're for off road use. Another problem is they look like the legal device.You can see ads for them on this forum.
https://minimotorsusa.com/products/d...0aApM9EALw_wcB This one has a 50 mph specification. Limited to 15 mph but has a speed limiting wire that is not to be tampered with...wink, wink.
ad

2old

50 mph on one of those scooters, hit a bump and you've got an airplane (momentarily).

fly135

It's good to know that there have never been any non ebike deaths attributed to going over the speed limit.

unterhausen

seems so obvious to limit car speeds, but no, they can go as fast as the carmakers want.

MarcusT

Really? I know of many. Do you need some references?

fly135

It was sarcasm. The idea that ebike riders that go over 15mph should be punished severely, yet non-powered bikes can go as fast as they want with maybe a small fine.