Not really sure how I feel about this...
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LBKA (formerly punkncat)
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Not really sure how I feel about this...
Here in the ATL we have a group called the Atlanta Bicycle Coalition (among other groups) that have been pushing this initiative called "Complete Streets". The basics of the idea are that they want protected bike lanes around key streets that they deem unsafe and high traffic, certainly for cars and so far as I know by some metric for bikes. I have not seen a report that shows they have any real metrics on the bike traffic, however the roads they are pushing for this on (this go round) are key arterials into the city from each quadrant.
As part of a precursory agreement there was a road coming in from the Decatur area called Dekalb Ave that the city had initially agreed to look into adding to the SPLOST fund for working towards this vision. I am unsure why, but it got taken off the master plan and will have to be "rolled again", so to speak to have it added back when and if another of these initiatives come around.
These several groups have started what they are calling a slow roll protest. A few weeks ago they got together 100 some odd bikes with the only goal to be to ride very slowly up that road into Atlanta at 8AM rush hour in order to "raise awareness" for the program. They have another planned tomorrow and future ones planned at a regular interval until they force some dialog.
Now, I see what they are trying to do. But, at the same time they are creating a false sense of need by calling in activists to inflate perceived use and traffic during one of the most inopportune moments of the day. They are making drivers angry interfering with their day and creating hostility. As I mentioned above I do not know that they have any solid metrics on actual bicycle traffic along this route. They have spewed some numbers about numbers of crashes and fatalities over a long period of time, but even those have no factual information to indicate if it happened during a commute, night time, poor rider or driver judgement, etc. It's just a shock value.
The changes they are proposing are, in essence an entire other lane alongside an already narrow roadway and properties with very little frontage in most cases. (Google Map Dekalb Ave, Atlanta) It isn't even close to a "just add some road" situation. It would involve imminent domain and acquisition of private properties along the right of way.
In light of what the automotive industry has done over the last 100 years to make drivers feel entitled to roadway, created crimes out of walking in or across the road, light sentences being passed down to drivers who negligently strike cyclists....it only makes sense to me that rather than create more expensive infrastructure to fund the upkeep for, without a concern for the real need of it. Why don't we just turn to education at a driver level to let them know and understand that the current roadways that are already built, already in use, are actually there for a variety of conveyance and also increase fines and penalties to a meaningful point for striking pedestrians or riders with your vehicle? I think alongside that, roadways of this nature should have reduced speed limits and signage to indicate that it's a shared roadway.
I see this current plan as wasteful foolishness and a bad way to win over drivers.
As part of a precursory agreement there was a road coming in from the Decatur area called Dekalb Ave that the city had initially agreed to look into adding to the SPLOST fund for working towards this vision. I am unsure why, but it got taken off the master plan and will have to be "rolled again", so to speak to have it added back when and if another of these initiatives come around.
These several groups have started what they are calling a slow roll protest. A few weeks ago they got together 100 some odd bikes with the only goal to be to ride very slowly up that road into Atlanta at 8AM rush hour in order to "raise awareness" for the program. They have another planned tomorrow and future ones planned at a regular interval until they force some dialog.
Now, I see what they are trying to do. But, at the same time they are creating a false sense of need by calling in activists to inflate perceived use and traffic during one of the most inopportune moments of the day. They are making drivers angry interfering with their day and creating hostility. As I mentioned above I do not know that they have any solid metrics on actual bicycle traffic along this route. They have spewed some numbers about numbers of crashes and fatalities over a long period of time, but even those have no factual information to indicate if it happened during a commute, night time, poor rider or driver judgement, etc. It's just a shock value.
The changes they are proposing are, in essence an entire other lane alongside an already narrow roadway and properties with very little frontage in most cases. (Google Map Dekalb Ave, Atlanta) It isn't even close to a "just add some road" situation. It would involve imminent domain and acquisition of private properties along the right of way.
In light of what the automotive industry has done over the last 100 years to make drivers feel entitled to roadway, created crimes out of walking in or across the road, light sentences being passed down to drivers who negligently strike cyclists....it only makes sense to me that rather than create more expensive infrastructure to fund the upkeep for, without a concern for the real need of it. Why don't we just turn to education at a driver level to let them know and understand that the current roadways that are already built, already in use, are actually there for a variety of conveyance and also increase fines and penalties to a meaningful point for striking pedestrians or riders with your vehicle? I think alongside that, roadways of this nature should have reduced speed limits and signage to indicate that it's a shared roadway.
I see this current plan as wasteful foolishness and a bad way to win over drivers.
Last edited by Juan Foote; 05-09-19 at 10:06 AM.
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The changes they are proposing are, in essence an entire other lane alongside an already narrow roadway and properties with very little frontage in most cases. (Google Map Dekalb Ave, Atlanta) It isn't even close to a "just add some road" situation. It would involve imminent domain and acquisition of private properties along the right of way.
A Tactical Solution for Dekalb Ave
Originally Posted by "Kronberg Wall
By and large, our approach stays within the existing curbs – using only paint [emphasis mine] to create a buffered two-way cycle track on the south side of the road. Limited modifications [emphasis mine] would be necessary at three key intersections to allow for left turn lanes: Oakdale/Whitefoord, Clifton and Arizona.
-mr. bill
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I invite you to "take a stroll" down Dekalb Ave. Whereas this plan may work for the section bordering the MARTA line, the entirety of the path they propose does not. This is a glossing over of the realities involved.
I invite you to take a look at the map and both "walk" it using street view. I also invite you to pan out and note all the side streets and corridors available for use as an alternate route. Use the "bicycling" view to see all the bike routes.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/De...422453!5m1!1e3
You will note that on the western section, the end where most of the MARTA line runs alongside this road, that Edgewood Ave is already improved and available for use one block away. To the East, where there are more houses there are multiple back streets available both to the North and South, one block away.
Additionally the MARTA route offers a safe, viable, and cheap alternative to riding your bike exactly on that road, with those side street conveyances being almost direct access behind and across from the stops.
Just as a side note @mr_bill I actually live here and have ridden those streets. I am not opining from my armchair a thousand miles away.
I invite you to take a look at the map and both "walk" it using street view. I also invite you to pan out and note all the side streets and corridors available for use as an alternate route. Use the "bicycling" view to see all the bike routes.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/De...422453!5m1!1e3
You will note that on the western section, the end where most of the MARTA line runs alongside this road, that Edgewood Ave is already improved and available for use one block away. To the East, where there are more houses there are multiple back streets available both to the North and South, one block away.
Additionally the MARTA route offers a safe, viable, and cheap alternative to riding your bike exactly on that road, with those side street conveyances being almost direct access behind and across from the stops.
Just as a side note @mr_bill I actually live here and have ridden those streets. I am not opining from my armchair a thousand miles away.
Last edited by Juan Foote; 05-09-19 at 11:02 AM.