Vintage handlebars - drops too short
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,486
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1080 Post(s)
Liked 681 Times
in
438 Posts
Vintage handlebars - drops too short
I finished my winter project, a 1987 Trek Elance 400T, and have ridden it less than 20 miles so far. I kept it as original as possible (except the aero brake levers) and decided to keep the narrow, stock handlebars. So far it's not the narrow width of the bars that bothers me, it's the short drops. I ride mostly on the hoods but I use the drops a lot too.
My other two drop bar bikes have bars with longer drops, plus bar-end shifters so there's an extra inch. With these, there's nothing there and it seems short, feeling almost like my hands might slip off. I know they won't, but I just don't feel secure. I'm half thinking about putting a set of bar end shifter plugs in there and taping over them, just to provide a bit of a "knob" at the end. Is this unusual? Will I eventually get used to having such short drops? I really don't want to swap bars, more just for the hassle of retaping two layers. Any ideas?
My other two drop bar bikes have bars with longer drops, plus bar-end shifters so there's an extra inch. With these, there's nothing there and it seems short, feeling almost like my hands might slip off. I know they won't, but I just don't feel secure. I'm half thinking about putting a set of bar end shifter plugs in there and taping over them, just to provide a bit of a "knob" at the end. Is this unusual? Will I eventually get used to having such short drops? I really don't want to swap bars, more just for the hassle of retaping two layers. Any ideas?
#2
aka: Dr. Cannondale
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 7,852
Mentioned: 234 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2151 Post(s)
Liked 3,380 Times
in
1,198 Posts
Two words: Nitto Noodles.
__________________
Hard at work in the Secret Underground Laboratory...
Hard at work in the Secret Underground Laboratory...
Likes For rccardr:
#4
SE Wis
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 10,516
Bikes: '68 Raleigh Sprite, '02 Raleigh C500, '84 Raleigh Gran Prix, '91 Trek 400, 2013 Novara Randonee, 1990 Trek 970
Mentioned: 40 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2731 Post(s)
Liked 3,361 Times
in
2,034 Posts
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 4,457
Mentioned: 102 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1629 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 814 Times
in
527 Posts
Holy cow!, are you sure you have enough stem in the steerer tube to be safe?
I know they (Nitto?) made long necked stems, but did not think they came that long.....
I know they (Nitto?) made long necked stems, but did not think they came that long.....
Likes For Chombi1:
#7
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,486
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1080 Post(s)
Liked 681 Times
in
438 Posts
Controltech Terminator MTB Bike Handlebar Bar End Extension Plug
Likes For Jeff Neese:
#9
two wheels only
Jeff, I have experienced exactly the same issue on some handlebars and it seems to me more common on the "ergo" shaped bars. I have wondered if the "short drops" bars were made as a way for the handlebar manufacturers to shave some weight and thus appeal to the weight weenies and also use less tubing in the fabrication process, i.e. cut costs. My solution is to just change out the handlebars, As rccardr suggests, Nitto bars have a good extension on the drops and I have always liked the vintage Cinelli bars (models 64 and 66). You just have to be careful on matching the stem clamp diameter.
Likes For T.W.O.:
#10
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,486
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1080 Post(s)
Liked 681 Times
in
438 Posts
I've had a set of Noodles but I prefer the Nitto Randonneur, which I have on two bikes. If I swap handlebars on this thing it will be another set of Randonneurs, but I was really trying to use existing components. And now that it's taped, I really don't feel like changing the handlebars.
#11
Edumacator
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Goose Creek, SC
Posts: 7,429
Bikes: '87 Crestdale, '87 Basso Gap, '92 Rossin Performance EL-OS, 1990 VanTuyl, 1980s Losa, 1985 Trek 670, 1982 AD SLE, 1987 PX10, etc...
Mentioned: 56 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2385 Post(s)
Liked 2,931 Times
in
1,862 Posts
__________________
1987 Crest Cannondale, 1987 Basso Gap, 1992 Rossin Performance EL, 1990ish Van Tuyl, 1985 Trek 670, 1982 AD SLE, 2003 Pinarello Surprise, 1990ish MBK Atlantique, 1987 Peugeot Competition, 1987 Nishiki Tri-A, 1981 Faggin, 1996 Cannondale M500, 1984 Mercian, 1982 AD SuperLeicht, 1985 Massi (model unknown), 1988 Daccordi Griffe , 1989 Fauxsin MTB, 1981 Ciocc Mockba, 1992 Bianchi Giro, 1977 Colnago Super
1987 Crest Cannondale, 1987 Basso Gap, 1992 Rossin Performance EL, 1990ish Van Tuyl, 1985 Trek 670, 1982 AD SLE, 2003 Pinarello Surprise, 1990ish MBK Atlantique, 1987 Peugeot Competition, 1987 Nishiki Tri-A, 1981 Faggin, 1996 Cannondale M500, 1984 Mercian, 1982 AD SuperLeicht, 1985 Massi (model unknown), 1988 Daccordi Griffe , 1989 Fauxsin MTB, 1981 Ciocc Mockba, 1992 Bianchi Giro, 1977 Colnago Super
#12
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Fredericksburg, Va
Posts: 9,580
Bikes: '65 Frejus TDF, '73 Bottecchia Giro d'Italia, '83 Colnago Superissimo, '84 Trek 610, '84 Trek 760, '88 Pinarello Veneto, '88 De Rosa Pro, '89 Pinarello Montello, '94 Burley Duet, 97 Specialized RockHopper, 2010 Langster, Tern Link D8
Mentioned: 73 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1601 Post(s)
Liked 2,187 Times
in
1,092 Posts
Very nice-looking bike!
However, it looks too small a frame with the extended post and stem. Do you like the short reach?
I recently swapped bars from the Cinelli 64 to a more ergo style. I don't like the current set up and may return to the Cinelli.
Wrapping and unwrapping tape with Ergos is significant and is to be avoided. I reused my tape, and it looks bad which is motivation to change the tape and bars.
However, it looks too small a frame with the extended post and stem. Do you like the short reach?
I recently swapped bars from the Cinelli 64 to a more ergo style. I don't like the current set up and may return to the Cinelli.
Wrapping and unwrapping tape with Ergos is significant and is to be avoided. I reused my tape, and it looks bad which is motivation to change the tape and bars.
__________________
Bikes don't stand alone. They are two tired.
Bikes don't stand alone. They are two tired.
#13
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 4,672
Bikes: 82 Medici, 2011 Richard Sachs, 2011 Milwaukee Road
Mentioned: 54 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1924 Post(s)
Liked 1,954 Times
in
1,086 Posts
The sooner you change those bars, the easier it will be to re-use the same bar tape. You will never be happy with those bars so get going on the switch.
__________________
I don't do: disks, tubeless, e-shifting, or bead head nymphs.
I don't do: disks, tubeless, e-shifting, or bead head nymphs.
Likes For Classtime:
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Stillwater, OK
Posts: 8,128
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1871 Post(s)
Liked 689 Times
in
467 Posts
Rotate the bars down like they were designed to be and you will have more of the "drop" part of the bar.
__________________
2014 Cannondale SuperSix EVO 2
2019 Salsa Warbird
2014 Cannondale SuperSix EVO 2
2019 Salsa Warbird
Likes For shoota:
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 20,323
Mentioned: 129 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3449 Post(s)
Liked 2,800 Times
in
1,974 Posts
When in the drops, it really translates to in the hooks.
rotate them a bit.
check to make sure the stem is at least the minimum insertion line. Just looks marginal.
if for some reason no mark, 55-60 mm inside the steerer.
even better to make sure that the expander is below the threaded portion of the steerer.
rotate them a bit.
check to make sure the stem is at least the minimum insertion line. Just looks marginal.
if for some reason no mark, 55-60 mm inside the steerer.
even better to make sure that the expander is below the threaded portion of the steerer.
#16
Klaatu..Verata..Necktie?
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 17,658
Bikes: Litespeed Ultimate, Ultegra; Canyon Endurace, 105; Battaglin MAX, Chorus; Bianchi 928 Veloce; Ritchey Road Logic, Dura Ace; Cannondale R500 RX100; Schwinn Circuit, Sante; Lotus Supreme, Dura Ace
Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10245 Post(s)
Liked 11,599 Times
in
5,945 Posts
Yeah. How's the reach to the brake levers when you're in the drops?
__________________
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."
"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
"Don't take life so serious-it ain't nohow permanent."
"Everybody's gotta be somewhere." - Eccles
#17
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Maryland, USA
Posts: 2,414
Bikes: Drysdale/Gitane/Zeus/Masi/Falcon/Palo Alto/Raleigh/Legnano
Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 967 Post(s)
Liked 615 Times
in
394 Posts
Hmm, ramps in same plane as stem extension, and drops pointed at rear axle; just how I was trained to install drop bars. Maybe there's a different rule for stepladder-height stems?
__________________
Larry:1958 Drysdale, 1961 Gitane Gran Sport, 1974 Zeus track, 1988 Masi Gran Corsa, 1974 Falcon, 1980 Palo Alto, 1973 Raleigh Gran Sport, 1974 Legnano. Susan: 1976 Windsor Profesional.
Larry:1958 Drysdale, 1961 Gitane Gran Sport, 1974 Zeus track, 1988 Masi Gran Corsa, 1974 Falcon, 1980 Palo Alto, 1973 Raleigh Gran Sport, 1974 Legnano. Susan: 1976 Windsor Profesional.
#18
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Stillwater, OK
Posts: 8,128
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1871 Post(s)
Liked 689 Times
in
467 Posts
Straight from the catalog, almost pointed at the rear axle like you say, but much lower stem height. They could be tweaked a little bit up or down depending on rider preference from here.
__________________
2014 Cannondale SuperSix EVO 2
2019 Salsa Warbird
2014 Cannondale SuperSix EVO 2
2019 Salsa Warbird
#19
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,486
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1080 Post(s)
Liked 681 Times
in
438 Posts
Fine. I normally optimize brake position for riding on the ramps/hoods but when I'm in the drops I can grab a handful of brake if I need to.
Like anything, that's just a general rule, a starting point. Those bars were designed to have the flat part of the hooks parallel to the ground, more or less. But yeah, the stem height is exaggerating the "point at the rear axle" a lot.
Straight from the catalog, almost pointed at the rear axle like you say, but much lower stem height. They could be tweaked a little bit up or down depending on rider preference from here.
Straight from the catalog, almost pointed at the rear axle like you say, but much lower stem height. They could be tweaked a little bit up or down depending on rider preference from here.
#20
Sunshine
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 16,538
Bikes: '18 class built steel roadbike, '19 Fairlight Secan, '88 Schwinn Premis , Black Mountain Cycles Monstercross V4, '89 Novara Trionfo
Mentioned: 123 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10902 Post(s)
Liked 7,391 Times
in
4,148 Posts
Shoota nailed it- rotate your bars downward. The brake levers are at a really high angle right now and also effectively high up on the bars. Those bars were not designed to have the ramps be flat, they were designed to have the ramps angle down at 12deg or so. Rotating the bars down will effectively push the drop ends towards you and give you more room on the drops. Also, your wrist angle wont be wonky when it the drops and reaching for the brake levers if you rotate the bars down.
Likes For mstateglfr:
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Oakland, CA
Posts: 3,291
Bikes: '82 Univega Competizione, '72 Motobecane Grand Record, '83 Mercian KOM Touring, '85 Univega Alpina Uno, '76 Eisentraut Limited
Mentioned: 57 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1088 Post(s)
Liked 1,204 Times
in
700 Posts
I hate to say it, but this is why I don't wrap bars until I've test ridden a few times to dial in the fit. Like shoota said above, though, you may have a noticeable difference by simply rotating the bars down slightly, and since this is the least invasive thing to do, it's worth a shot. The bar tops will be angled downward a bit more (you may or may not find that tolerable), but the drops will be a bit flatter and extend a bit further back. Again, worth a shot.
Likes For noobinsf:
#22
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: Wake Forest, NC
Posts: 5,641
Bikes: 1989 Cinelli Supercorsa
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3431 Post(s)
Liked 2,824 Times
in
1,723 Posts
Centurion 1986
Last edited by smd4; 04-20-22 at 10:31 AM.
#23
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Maryland, USA
Posts: 2,414
Bikes: Drysdale/Gitane/Zeus/Masi/Falcon/Palo Alto/Raleigh/Legnano
Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 967 Post(s)
Liked 615 Times
in
394 Posts
Good point there (oops, a pun). Hmm, never having ridden on a bike with a stem remotely that high, on modern bikes with bars so much higher in relation to the saddle than I am used to, maybe using the ramps is not a common hand position anyway due to the rotation of the wrists needed?
__________________
Larry:1958 Drysdale, 1961 Gitane Gran Sport, 1974 Zeus track, 1988 Masi Gran Corsa, 1974 Falcon, 1980 Palo Alto, 1973 Raleigh Gran Sport, 1974 Legnano. Susan: 1976 Windsor Profesional.
Larry:1958 Drysdale, 1961 Gitane Gran Sport, 1974 Zeus track, 1988 Masi Gran Corsa, 1974 Falcon, 1980 Palo Alto, 1973 Raleigh Gran Sport, 1974 Legnano. Susan: 1976 Windsor Profesional.
#24
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Menomonee Falls, WI
Posts: 1,850
Bikes: 1984 Schwinn Supersport, 1988 Trek 400T, 1977 Trek TX900, 1982 Bianchi Champione del Mondo, 1978 Raleigh Supercourse, 1986 Trek 400 Elance, 1991 Waterford PDG OS Paramount, 1971 Schwinn Sports Tourer, 1985 Trek 670
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 601 Post(s)
Liked 1,054 Times
in
530 Posts
Really nice job on the build, love the tape job. I’ve got two 400s and put Nitto Noodles on both. If you go to the Nitto website, they make a lot of drops, and they also post the dimensions of each, including the drop. That might be a good place to start if replacing the bars, I would wince at undoing that tape job though.
Tim
Tim
#25
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Stillwater, OK
Posts: 8,128
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1871 Post(s)
Liked 689 Times
in
467 Posts
Good point there (oops, a pun). Hmm, never having ridden on a bike with a stem remotely that high, on modern bikes with bars so much higher in relation to the saddle than I am used to, maybe using the ramps is not a common hand position anyway due to the rotation of the wrists needed?
If you set up bars/levers with the ramp in mind then you wind up with what the OP has. Nothing wrong with that per se, but it can create other issues, as we see here.
__________________
2014 Cannondale SuperSix EVO 2
2019 Salsa Warbird
2014 Cannondale SuperSix EVO 2
2019 Salsa Warbird