mroll

Hi everyone,

I'm helping a friend fix up a Raleigh (I think from the 80s) that's been sitting in a basement or barn for many years. I foolishly didn't try it out when it came to me. Not knowing anything about Sturmey archer hubs, I was a bit curious to have a peak inside. It's an AW with 83 stamped on it (assuming that's the year). A local mechanic warned me to be careful not to get too carried away with disassembly unless I was ready to really rebuild it (here I am posting on bike forums, so you already know the punchline to this joke).

The parts I'm referring to are all here:

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/...her-parts.html

I unthreaded the indicator spindle chain (HSAl25) and removed more or less everything from the drive side of the axle all the way down to the cone - I wanted to have a peak inside the hub. I was curious! It looked pretty clean to me, but I obviously couldn't tell how it worked from this quick glance. Oh well, carry on, nothing to do here. Unfortunately, after reassembling things, I couldn't get the indicator spindle threaded back in. uh oh. Take things off again, and now go a little deeper. I removed the driver (HSA123). Oh no. I see half of an Axle Key (HSAl24) just jangling around.

I really really want to fix this, and I've got the patience to do it, but my question is:

1. I found a few places that seem to stock the part, but any recommended vendors?
2. Is this hub worth trying to save? (I think it is?)
3. If I fish out the other half of this axle key, can I reassemble the hub and have it just behave as a single speed until I can get the parts?

Yes, I know I was a little bit fast and loose with my approach to this hub. I really enjoy rebuilding 'normal' hubs but should have approached this internally geared one with a bit more caution. Any advice appreciated!
mroll

pfaustus

https://hadland.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/aw.pdf or an old copy of Glenn's Complete Bicycle Manual. Kids used to do take 'em apart and put them back together. You can too.


1. I can't recommend anybody. I remember going into one shop for something and the guy talked about the big cabinet of parts they once had and about rebuilding the hubs, then told how they threw it all out "Thank god those days are over" I never stepped foot in there again.
2. Yes. It will outlive us all with occasional squirts of 10W-40 (Yes-30 weight non-detergent is probably slightly better, but did your Dad have that in the garage when you were 12?) But put a bigger sprocket on it.
3. I don't believe so.

nlerner

Where are you located? I have lots of spare axle keys for some reason. You will have to remove the innards from the hub shell, but that's easily done with a vise, hammer, and punch. Plenty of directions online including the links above for taking these hubs apart and putting them back together. It's really not that difficult.

mroll

Oh my goodness! I was in total despair. The one lead I had ended up being a dud. I'm located in Ontario, Canada. Shall I message you directly?

I'd happily buy one or two off of you and cover shipping! heck, if you had a lot, I'd buy 5 and donate a few to my local shop so they've got some handy. Yes, I found some manuals and a nice video showing a tear down. I might be tempting fate, but I think I could get the axle key in without full disassembly. But I'll do what I need to!


Thanks! This is reassuring in many ways. I found that guide earlier today. I love when things are clearly designed to be serviced.

nlerner

I'm glad to do that, though some Canadian BFers might be a lower-cost solution. You might have a look through this thread: https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...eeds-1045.html

And @gster is in Toronto, I believe, and is deeply into the Sturmey-Archer world.

gster

Yes, I may be able to assist.
I ran a wheel once without the indicator pin attached and yes, the axle key came free and got chewed up.....
Lesson learned. I'm sure I have one. I'm in Toronto (Parkdale).

markk900

Dan Burkhart is also a BF member, located in Ontario (Oakville, near Hamilton) and an expert with SA hubs.....contact him through facebook - https://www.facebook.com/dan.burkhart.14

Lots of us Ontarions here with less than expert skills too!

Velo Mule

I thought I knew a lot about Sturmey Archer 3 speeds. And I probably do, but hanging around here, you always learn something. I never thought about it but without the indicator chain connected the key is free to move and get into trouble. I never knew that, but it makes perfect sense.

There are a few good YouTube video's on overhauling an AW three speed hub. I don't think I have seen a bad video of overhauling an Sturmey Archer three speed. They are fairly simple to rebuild. Good luck and let us know how it goes @mroll . You will become another expert or at least have the full confidence that you can do it after the job is complete.

gster

I've tried to send a PM but not sure it got through.
1976 hub on the front porch on the arm of a
Muskoka chair
188 Sorauren Ave
You'll have to disassemble but you may need other parts.
Greg

Velo Mule

I had to look it up, but now I know what a Muskoka chair is. So, I learned two things on BikeForums today.


Muskoka Chair

I nice chair to have on a porch or anywhere. So the Muskoka Chair has a curved back and the Adirondack chair has a flat back. Hmm. I would think being curved would be a bit more fitting. There may be "Adirondack" chairs that have curved backs that are perhaps miss named according to that convention.


Um, back to our regularly scheduled programming......

So, not only are these AW hubs pretty good, the people who admire them are pretty admirable themselves.

mroll

Hi all,

I managed to connect with gster, was roughly on the area, and now I've got a spare hub to work with! Really going to enjoy learning how this thing works and getting my friend's bike on the road. Thank you so much to gster and to this incredible community! I had no idea I'd get help so quickly, really thought I was SOL.

Will report back later this week with an update!

I've got some old parts myself. Maybe I'll pay closer attention for other folks needing unusual bits...

Mohan

gster

I'm glad that I could help.
The first time I tried to "fix" a hub I didn't.
I made it worse....
In general, these hubs are virtually bullet proof...
Hopefully the axle key didn't grind up anything else..
You could transfer the entire assembly (guts) into your hub
or do a strip down rebuild.
I usually watch this video as I'm working.

And yes, you should shift yourself over to the 3 speed forum
https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...l#post22515376
Over 1000 pages of bikes/projects/advice and general 3 speed info.

tcs

AWs aren't indestructible, but they're amazingly robust. This hub was returned to service, requiring only (cleaning and oiling, obviously, and) new HSA120 Pawl Springs ("R springs").

tcs

Uh, 'perhaps'. But perhaps not. Accounts differ. The seat height and arm width are similarly debated. If the curved back design needs a separate name, it should probably be called a 'Wolpin'.

gster

I really think it's which side of the border you're on....

mroll

I'm not sure if it's bad etiquette to reply in an older thread, but I wanted to report back. Everything worked out! I've reassembled the hub with the Axle key from gster! Taking the hub apart was really interesting, and they are clearly very well made. Just recabling the bike and tightening some surprisingly loose spokes and it'll be back on the road!

There's one interesting difference between a few AW hubs. I think with older hubs, there's a spring that sits on the bearings of the driver and loads the driver. On other hubs, the spring goes right through the middle of the driver and pushes the cone out. It doesn't make a difference from what I can work out, but I was quite confused for a bit. The other interesting thing is how the axle itself isn't round. Maybe this is common with older hubs, but it takes a lot of the finesse (and therefore fuss) out of getting the cones tightened just right. Close enough is all you'll get and it works great!

I also wanted to say that I've been telling everyone who will listen of my experience here. A hopeless post on a message board quickly met by many helpful responses from all over. Amazing! And now I am prepared to help the next sorry chump who takes apart an AW hub without doing any research Thank you all, and especially gster. I really, really appreciate it.

Pompiere

No worries. Only a week since the last post is not considered an "old thread" here. We are glad to see a follow up to let everyone know how things worked out, even weeks or months later. It's not unusual for us to see replies to threads that are years old.

gster

I'm glad that it worked out. My pleasure to help.
My first attempt to "fix" a 3 speed hub was less than successful.
Let me know if you need anything else.