kisarid

Hi All,

I know there are many threads like this, but couldn't find an answer after searching.
Hope you can help me decide, I cannot try any of these bikes except for the Tern which I already did.

These are all the bikes that I can get in my country without paying ridiculous shipping fees and are within my budget.
I listed them from cheapest to most expensive. The Tern costs over 60% more than the Btwin. The Btwin has some better parts on paper (e.g. shimano sora), so these prices are a bit confusing. Is there such a difference in quality? Also about the Dahons, I cannot really find the differences between these models (despite quite a difference in price), their website didn't help much.

I'm 72kg/175cm, would use it for commute/fun ride on asphalt roads, mostly in city. Nothing crazy.

Btwin Tilt 900
Dahon Hit
Dahon Vybe D7
Dahon Mariner D8
Tern Link C8

Thank you.

Edit: actually, the Mariner might be the most expensive, apologies - the shop I was originally looking at has terrible reputation.

KC8QVO

I am not much for being able to tell you the overall difference in the build qualities. I've had my Dahon for a couple years and really like it. I have not had any problems with it being a decent bike mechanic wasn't able to work out. The frame is solid and has held up to some loaded day tours.

Something I would bring your attention to, which you mentioned so I am hoping you are tuned in to it already, is component quality and features.

When you are buying "complete" bikes (I quote that because I wouldn't trust any bike to be out-of-the-box ready to ride - you should still go through things with a fine tooth comb) there can be a lot of variabilities with component sets and the quality of those, which I don't think is as much of a concern as the core bike - frame and fork. If a frame set is poorly engineered or there are typical defects then that would be a no-go for me. All the other components, though if they don't work correctly would be a nuisance to deal with, can be replaced.

From that standpoint - a perspective that might alleviate some of your concerns would be to take what ever model you end up with as a building block, not necessarily the "end all, be all". I don't think there is such a thing for the vast majority of us - I have never taken a factory complete bike and not changed it up from the factory form factor in some way.

For a good bike to use as a starting point - figure what is important to you. For me, having gears, fenders, and racks was important. So I went with the Mariner D8. I did not care for the color at the time, but I prioritized function and features and the Mariner D8 was the better starting point. I added my accessories to make it mine. There are drivetrain changes I want to do at some point, but it is a very ridable bike with the stock drivetrain. I am glad I made the decision to get it.

For what it is worth, I have heard (on the forums here researching folding bikes myself) that there have been some frame failures of Tern. However, Dahon has, likewise, had some frame failures. So it is a bit of a coin toss there.

KC8QVO

Another thought because I am looking at parts here and a new Dahon Piazza -

If braze-ons are important to you for accessories and you aren't wanting to fabricate/modify your things - carefully consider your options and try to figure out what works before you order. That might take some correspondence with a reputable vendor that can guide you on what you can and can't do.

Case in point - our front racks we got are sold by ThorUSA as fitting all Dahon 20" folding bikes. The racks don't easily fit our bikes. If you keep the front reflecter against the frame the bolt hole in the rack mount does not line up. If you try to put the rack on in front of the reflector (between reflector and frame) the rack frame does not clear the steer tube.

Racks and Mudguards

The Piazza also does NOT have bottle mount braze-ons. It DOES have rear rack braze-ons on the large single combo chain stay/seat stay frame members.

My point - the front rack and bottle mounts need some work to make work. We'll have to come up with another way to mount the bottle mounts - I am not going to drill/modify the frame - the only method on the frame tube I would entertain is bands wrapped around with threaded holes on the top or sides. There is too much risk in modifying these light alloy frames, in my view, to be comfortable with something like the threaded rivet style braze-on insert doohickeys a l of people use, for example.

anga

It is worth considering Tilt 900. Btwin makes quality bikes and offers lifetime warranty on frame and fork. Two year warranty on parts. Bike has been around for a few years, so all kinks have been worked out. As you pointed, it comes with excellent components.
In fact, it is on my shortlist.

stelpa

I think it's rather heavy.
And it doesn't stay folded cause the magnet wears out (that's what I read on the decathlon page).

I'm thinking about a dahon...
facing the same problem (no dahons here in shops)

kisarid

Thank you for the replies!

KC8QVO - I'm not really a bike enthusiast, just looking for a reliable ride. I would like a rack, fenders and gears, that's pretty much it - the models I listed all come with those. I agree, the most important thing is the "core", frame and fork, especially with a folding bike. This is why I hesitate about the Tilt, good price and great parts and I wouldn't mind if some accessories turn out to be cheap, I could replace a fender or something. But if the frame itself is subpar, I would be stuck with a bad bike with a good drivetrain..

anga - Yes, there are some mixed reviews, but overall on the good side. The lifetime warranty does make a good selling point.

stelpa - I read those reviews too, but not that worried about the magnets. I guess it depends on how you want to use it, I plan to not carry it around a lot, just when storing it in the apartment. You can always use some velcro strap for reinforcement. Why do you say it's heavy? It's 11.9 - 12.2 kg (varies by website, I guess with or without racks/fenders?), I could not find a lighter bike in this price range. Tern C8 is 12.8kg

stelpa

Yes you're right, I mixed up the weight.
And also you cannot rely on dahon's weight announcements either because they are very often only correct for the naked bike (that's what I read and I found a shop site where the vybe should be the same weight with and without rack... which is impossible of course...).

No it was the seatpost problems that were causing me concerns...
and for me it would be for commuting with train so I wouldn't want a velcro.. ( still wonder why they needed this long time to develop a locking mechanism like with the byb... the magnet seems to be a bad idea in the first place...)

kisarid

Yeah, I was a bit worried about the seatpost too. Asked someone who used the bike for some time now, they wrote the seatpost factory setting has to be adjusted, but they have been using the bike for a year without problems, on hills, rain and snow. About the magnets they wrote they hold well, but only if the two magnets are properly aligned. I'm not sure if the alignment could be adjusted somehow, or if you can fold the bike slightly differently to make the magnets meet.

wesgreen

There is a lot of adjusting you can do. I now have the magnet in a different spot on the frame from where it came installed from the factory. It's a good idea to spend a bit of time to find the ideal positions for the Dahon magnet and handle post for folding. My bike rides very comfortably, folds quickly without any adjustments, rolls easily when folded, and the magnets hold (most of the time!). But it took me quite a while to set this up right.
I also added some epoxy glue to secure the magnet, once I found the right spot for it. Before Dahon started securing them with Loctite a few years ago, people were losing them.

stelpa

Which shops did you look at? I'm searching myself that's why I ask

Fentuz

On my 2 of my classic foldable dahon, I removed the fork plate. The rear magnet always stick to the fork mount and it remains tight. However, it only works with a "out folding" handle bar (Mu SL type)

wesgreen

As long as you have a steel fork. Thanks for that idea! But I don't see why it couldn't work with an inward fold too.
P.S.: You're right. The cables get in the way. And anyway, being able to adjust the fork plate is very useful.

Fentuz

with inward stem, you can get interferences and the fork won't touch the magnet

GTA

The Dahon Mariner D8 could be your choice. It is a level-3 Dahon model and has better parts than the HIT and the Vybe D7. Level-3 is often considered as the most "practical" level among all Dahon levels (from 0 to 6). At this level, the bike is equipped with entrance level parts and able to fulfill your daily commuting and some basic riding requirements without need of upgrades. However, if you plan to modify a level-3 Dahon bike, it is not difficult at all. There are plenty of higher level parts and references available.
Relatively, the HIT is level-1, the Vybe D7 is level-2. Both are not recommended.
Then the Btwin TILT 900 is too heavy, from my point of view.
I also don't prefer the Tern Link series. (The Tern Verge series is much better, but much more expensive.)

stelpa

I have never heard about levels and could not find any information on that.
Maybe you could explain what parts are "better" and why.

I think it is quite difficult to find ones way around dahon bikes.
I personally like the vybe more because of the looks. But that's of course just optics.

GTA

Sorry, I made a mistake.
Just checked and found out the Mariner D8 is not level-3 but level-2. And the Vybe D7 is level-1.

Let me explain. If you look at the specs of any Dahon model, apart from the model name, there is a model number. This number has some meaning.
For example, Mariner D8 is KMA082.
"K"and "M" define the frame model;
"A" defines material, which is aluminum;
"0" defines the wheel size, which is 20 inches;
"8" defines number of gears;
"2" defines the level;

More examples: When you see DAHON Speed D8's model number is KAC083, you will be able to know this is a 20-inch-wheel and CroMo steel frame bike, with level-3 parts.

There is no strict definition of the above mentioned "levels", but high lever is in general better equipped:
Level-3 normally brings you a Sram x5/x7(or equivalent model) rear derailleur, a forged crank, Schwalbe tyres and so on.
Then level-4 may give you a hollow crank, a bearing wheelset, a 10 or 20 speed drivetrain...
At level-5, some interesting features could appear, . e.g. the Speed Pro (KAC045) has a SRAM DualDrive hub...

Hope this is helpful for you.

stelpa

Thank you that is really interesting!
so... a low level will have to do... due to availability and money.

Thanks for the information!

Fentuz

Just to add a more general Dahon description:

D = Deluxe (entry model)
P= Premium (tends to have better wheels seat post handle bar with std groupset)
X= Xtreme luxe or performance (P with the better groupset)
TT (suffix) = TT setup with bullhorn handle bar and road shifter
The number after the letter is the number of gear.

So D7 = Delux kit with 7 speed and P8= premium with 8 speed and X27= ultra premium with 27 speed

Tern uses a similar description with B as a budget version (lower than D)

I went through several evolution starting from one of the cheapest dahon available 10/15 years ago, helios D7
https://www.bikeforums.net/folding-b...type-tt-2.html