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Man loses 56 pounds after eating only McDonald's for six months

Old 07-24-16, 08:57 AM
  #101  
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Originally Posted by sprince
Rant? Hardly. Was trying to point out that the two lines can't both be true. But then, doesn't your own weight loss prove that?
Maybe, which means you might take a second thought about whether your interpretation of the first line is what I really meant.

The tendency to gain weight is genetic and nearly universal.
Most people don't keep it under control.
Some do.
A few of those do it rather easily when they try.
Some of those have to work very hard, fail and try different things until they find something that works.
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Old 07-24-16, 09:10 AM
  #102  
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Originally Posted by Machka
How are those problems?

Neighbourhood cookout ... eat the salad and eat the rest in moderation. Eat less during the rest of the day. Go for a long, long bicycle ride.

Work summer picnic ... eat the salad and eat the rest in moderation. Eat less during the rest of the day. Go for a long, long bicycle ride.

Birthday ... well, personally, I don't "feast" at any time. On my birthdays we usually find a place that serves Mexican food and have a normal-sized restaurant meal for dinner. Then we might have chocolate cheesecake for dessert. The calories are higher than what I'd normally eat, but because I'm a cyclist, I ride my age on my birthday or a day close to my birthday as the larger part of my celebration. So I burn off the dinner and cheesecake before I have them.

Easily solvable problems.
Those are fine suggestions that may work for some people.

For me they're like asking a 20 year alcoholic to go to happy hour and have one beer.

btw-
The cookout was extreme bordering on comical.
3 meats all high fat. Big white rolls, lots of all condiments.
Potato salad with lots of real mayo and boiled eggs.
Baked beans with sugar and ground meat and bacon.(delicious)
That's it.
None of the 'healthy' or veg*n options which are common these days.
Everybody encouraging everybody to eat to failure.
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Old 07-24-16, 09:22 AM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by kzin
Everybody encouraging everybody to eat to failure.
yep and if you have a different opinion, you'll be attacked. Of course these people have internet links showing all this crap is actually good for you
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Old 07-24-16, 10:34 AM
  #104  
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Originally Posted by kzin

btw-
The cookout was extreme bordering on comical.
3 meats all high fat. Big white rolls, lots of all condiments.
Potato salad with lots of real mayo and boiled eggs.
Baked beans with sugar and ground meat and bacon.(delicious)
That's it.
None of the 'healthy' or veg*n options which are common these days.
Everybody encouraging everybody to eat to failure.

That looks like some delicious food...Meat, potatoes, spices, salad, beans, bacon, buns, I don't see anything wrong with that... I would just eat till failure and not even worry about my caloric intake...Next day just go and do a nice intense ride and burn it all off. You won't even need any energy gels or sports drink because all that food which you've eaten the previous day would be enough to fuel up your ride the next day.
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Old 07-24-16, 10:42 AM
  #105  
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Originally Posted by kzin

Everybody encouraging everybody to eat to failure.

Maybe you should start to hang out around the cico crowd, they encourage everybody to practice severe caloric restriction and use starvation tactics to control their weight.
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Old 07-24-16, 11:36 AM
  #106  
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Originally Posted by kzin
Those are fine suggestions that may work for some people.

For me they're like asking a 20 year alcoholic to go to happy hour and have one beer.
Food addiction is real and it is hard to overcome, just like alcohol addiction. Food addiction can be worse in that you must eat, unlike alcohol which your body does not need. However, most people can overcome food addiction although it will take some people more time than others. People who use excessive eating as self-medication will have a really difficult time unless they address underlying issues.
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Old 07-24-16, 11:44 AM
  #107  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Maybe you should start to hang out around the cico crowd, they encourage everybody to practice severe caloric restriction and use starvation tactics to control their weight.
I hang out with the CICO crowd. There are very few people that promote severe caloric restriction and starvation, and the rest of the CICO crowd calls them out on it.

Actually, short women get accused of this very frequently because of the common belief that everyone needs 2000 calories (thanks, food labels) and that eating "too much" lower than that is starvation. The number that get tossed around as "healthy" intake are usually numbers appropriate for men. Women have less lean mass than men and are shorter on average and require far fewer calories.

My maintenance at 5' 3" with a small frame (compared to other women my height) is about 1450 when sedentary and 1650 when lightly active. I love it when people scream about how I'm in starvation mode and my metabolism will shut down and I'm going to manifest fat out of nowhere.
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Old 07-24-16, 01:05 PM
  #108  
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Originally Posted by RandomEncounter
Food addiction is real and it is hard to overcome, just like alcohol addiction. Food addiction can be worse in that you must eat, unlike alcohol which your body does not need. However, most people can overcome food addiction although it will take some people more time than others. People who use excessive eating as self-medication will have a really difficult time unless they address underlying issues.
There is another important distinction. Crap foods can be replaced with healthy foods, whereas replacing Mad Dog with an expensive Chianti would do nothing for the alcoholic. Once you break the junk food habit completely (7 servings of vegetables every day, no sugar, low sodium, no processed foods) your taste for those things will go away. Food can't be an addiction since it is required to survive. The addiction is to the refined sugar, saturated fats, excessive salt, chemicals, processed meats and other stuff that is mislabeled as food.
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Old 07-24-16, 04:59 PM
  #109  
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Originally Posted by sprince
There is another important distinction. Crap foods can be replaced with healthy foods, whereas replacing Mad Dog with an expensive Chianti would do nothing for the alcoholic. Once you break the junk food habit completely (7 servings of vegetables every day, no sugar, low sodium, no processed foods) your taste for those things will go away. Food can't be an addiction since it is required to survive. The addiction is to the refined sugar, saturated fats, excessive salt, chemicals, processed meats and other stuff that is mislabeled as food.
Wrong. Food can be an addiction. Addiction can be hormonal. Love is an excellent example. I think there are songs about that.

Food is another example of a hormonal addiction. There's a decent primer about it, that's relatively short and easy to understand, here:
Appetite Hormones - Today's Dietitian Magazine

I know a few ex food addicts who resolved their addiction by always thinking of food as fuel, nothing more. Fueling rather than eating is a much simpler and more productive way to think about it.

Food Addicts Anonymous is a real organization with structure and rules similar to other Anonymous orgs.
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Old 07-24-16, 06:15 PM
  #110  
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy
Food can be an addiction.

Only if it's loaded with sugar and artificial flavours.
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Old 07-24-16, 07:56 PM
  #111  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Only if it's loaded with sugar and artificial flavours.
Wrong too. Try reading. It's good for you. It's especially good for one to read things one doesn't agree with, or thinks one won't agree with. That's what folks with an open mind do. Lubricates the brain. Of course having an open mind is looked down upon in some circles.
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Old 07-24-16, 08:34 PM
  #112  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Only if it's loaded with sugar and artificial flavours.
I have to agree. Try getting addicted to raw vegetables and sardines. Maybe not too hard if you like those foods, but then try eating enough of that to become overweight. Show me one 300 pounder (human, not bovine) that eats mostly raw vegetables and continues to gain weight. That theory fails the common sense test.
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Old 07-24-16, 08:36 PM
  #113  
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Really? Really? People get addicted to drinking water. To the point where they drink themselves to death. Must be all the sugar and flavors in plain water.

Please do not conflate the mechanism of addiction with the addiction itself. Human beings can become addicted to anything. It's what sets us apart from the other beasts. Wink.
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Old 07-24-16, 08:44 PM
  #114  
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Originally Posted by RandomEncounter
My maintenance at 5' 3" with a small frame (compared to other women my height) is about 1450 when sedentary and 1650 when lightly active.
And investing all the money you save on food? That would actually be kind of cool to eat on 25 bucks a week.
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Old 07-24-16, 08:44 PM
  #115  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Maybe you should start to hang out around the cico crowd, they encourage everybody to practice severe caloric restriction and use starvation tactics to control their weight.

No ... no the CICO crowd does not do that at all. Nowhere close to that.


In fact being aware of what we're eating (Calories In) and what we're burning off (Calories Out) can be very useful when doing things like cycling long distances. It can help us eat enough on those long rides to ensure that we've got the energy to keep going.

Take yesterday, for example. Rowan and I cycled 100 km and I (well, we, probably) ended up eating about 3000 calories. And yet, I was still within my calorie limit for the day. That's hardly "severe caloric restriction" or "starvation tactics".

Last edited by Machka; 07-24-16 at 08:49 PM.
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Old 07-24-16, 08:45 PM
  #116  
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Originally Posted by carbonfiberboy
wrong too. Try reading. It's good for you. It's especially good for one to read things one doesn't agree with, or thinks one won't agree with. That's what folks with an open mind do. Lubricates the brain. Of course having an open mind is looked down upon in some circles.
+1
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Old 07-24-16, 08:53 PM
  #117  
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope
Please do not conflate the mechanism of addiction with the addiction itself.
I'm not. But the addiction must be in some way detrimental in order to be a problem. So explain to me how being addicted to breathing harms your health, much less makes you fat. Drinking enough water to kill yourself is an extreme and very rare example, hardly comparable to the relatively common problem of eating too much junk food and getting fat as a result.
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Old 07-24-16, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by sprince
I'm not. But the addiction must be in some way detrimental in order to be a problem.
On the fantabulous TV program My Strange Addiction, a young lady would eat at least one box of Crayola Chalkboard Chalk a day. And had been doing so for years. She was checked over by a physician, who advised her to stop, because you know, it's not normal to eat a box of chalk a day. She said, "If it's not hurting me, I'm not going to stop." And it wasn't hurting her, so she didn't stop.

So by your definition, she does not have an addiction. Just like, a weird hobby or something.
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Old 07-24-16, 09:13 PM
  #119  
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope
On the fantabulous TV program My Strange Addiction, a young lady would eat at least one box of Crayola Chalkboard Chalk a day. And had been doing so for years. She was checked over by a physician, who advised her to stop, because you know, it's not normal to eat a box of chalk a day. She said, "If it's not hurting me, I'm not going to stop." And it wasn't hurting her, so she didn't stop.

So by your definition, she does not have an addiction. Just like, a weird hobby or something.
Back to the original post. Did the chalk make her fat?
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Old 07-24-16, 09:26 PM
  #120  
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So weight gain is the sole determining factor for addiction, then. Not cancer, or nerve damage, or death by hyponatremia.

Sugar doesn't make people fat. Overeating and inactivity makes people fat. Addiction isn't about the mode of addiction. People don't get hooked on sugar, or cigarettes, or heroin, or even exercise-- those are just the means to the end, which is whatever random thing is going on in their brain, and releasing enough endorphins to manage it. People chase feeling. Donuts make them happy. Alcohol makes them forget... and makes them happy, maybe. Food is an easy addiction because it's readily available, and it works on everybody. My wife could never become a heroin addict, she has a severe reaction to any opiate.

I got fat by being lazy. Not doing is easier than doing. I got not fat by riding the hell out of a bicycle-- to the point that my wife would like to point out-- I'm probably addicted to it. I feel uneasy if I take a day off of the bike. Other forms of exercise don't suppress this feeling. I get up at 4-5am to ride some days, despite having gone to bed at 1-2am. My legs are pretty much sore all the time. But as I'm not gaining weight, must not be addicted.
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Old 07-25-16, 02:46 AM
  #121  
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Originally Posted by sprince
I have to agree. Try getting addicted to raw vegetables and sardines. Maybe not too hard if you like those foods, but then try eating enough of that to become overweight. Show me one 300 pounder (human, not bovine) that eats mostly raw vegetables and continues to gain weight. That theory fails the common sense test.
I bet you could get addicted to porterhouse steak, bacon and no additive ice cream.
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Old 07-25-16, 10:10 AM
  #122  
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Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest
There are a couple things going on here. I'm not disputing any of what you say. But there's an important distinction that's getting lost here.

Under the rules of reality, the only way to lose fat/weight (without surgery) is to maintain a calorie deficit.

In practice, there are many ways to go about doing that. Some are going to be more successful than others, depending on the person doing it.

Carbs aren't what make people fat, it's calories. But a lot of people really enjoy carbs, and for some people, it's easier to reduce total calories with a blanket restriction, similar to what you've done. Just like some people need to swear alcohol off entirely, while others can have it in moderation. But this is highly individual and, unlike calories in calories out, doesn't apply to all people as a blanket rule.

I lost the weight I had been slowly putting on more than a year ago, and have kept it off pretty effortlessly. I did that eating a high carb diet. At this point I'm deliberately trying to put weight on, I started counting macros yesterday to make sure my protein intake is what it should be. I ate 5,000 kCals yesterday and it was a struggle. I'm tired of eating and don't know how I'm going to do this for the next three months.

For me personally, I find satiety comes from protein and carbs, in that order. Fat does little to contribute. Other people have different results.
Good post.

To summarize:
Weight loss is achieved by consuming fewer calories than you burn.
There are many ways to achieve this and individual people may have different optimal approaches.
Weight loss, while correlated with improvements in health, is not the same as being healthy.
Thus, a strategy like eating a low-calorie McDonald's diet may cause to you to lose weight (and possibly gain some health benefits), but affect your health negatively in other different ways.
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Old 07-25-16, 06:51 PM
  #123  
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope
So weight gain is the sole determining factor for addiction
No, but it if the addiction is [junk] food, it is likely the primary reason you gained weight. Being sedentary doesn't help. But without junk food it becomes much harder to overeat, and doesn't suppress the normal reaction of eating less when expending less energy.

Originally Posted by DrIsotope
Sugar doesn't make people fat
Honestly, would you have gotten fat in a world without sugar and processed foods? Would you have gotten as fat?

Originally Posted by DrIsotope
I got fat by being lazy. Not doing is easier than doing. I got not fat by riding the hell out of a bicycle-- to the point that my wife would like to point out-- I'm probably addicted to it. I feel uneasy if I take a day off of the bike. Other forms of exercise don't suppress this feeling. I get up at 4-5am to ride some days, despite having gone to bed at 1-2am. My legs are pretty much sore all the time. But as I'm not gaining weight, must not be addicted.
You are not doing your body any good by going without sleep. It only slows down your metabolism, makes things more difficult for the brain and compromises your immune system. I hope you find a better way.
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Old 07-26-16, 12:21 AM
  #124  
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Originally Posted by sprince
No, but it if the addiction is [junk] food, it is likely the primary reason you gained weight. Being sedentary doesn't help. But without junk food it becomes much harder to overeat, and doesn't suppress the normal reaction of eating less when expending less energy.


Honestly, would you have gotten fat in a world without sugar and processed foods? Would you have gotten as fat?


You are not doing your body any good by going without sleep. It only slows down your metabolism, makes things more difficult for the brain and compromises your immune system. I hope you find a better way.
It doesn't matter what you eat.

If you want to gain weight ... CI>CO. Eat more calories than you burn.

If you want to lose weight ... CI <CO. Eat fewer calories than you burn.

If you want to maintain your weight ... CI=CO. Eat the same number of calories you burn.


You can eat a heap of sugary foods (let's say 4000 calories a day) ...
but if you exercise a lot (using the formula 100 cal for every 5 km cycled ... if you cycled 250 km/day, which some of the year-long-time-trial people are doing, you'd burn 5000 cal/day) ...
you would lose weight. You'd be in a 1000 cal/day deficit. You'd probably lose weight quite quickly.

You can eat a diet of all veggies and lean meats (let's say 2000 calories a day) ... but if your basal metabolic rate is 1500 cal, and you sit around and do absolutely nothing all day ... you will gain weight.



Yes, of course it is easier to gain weight on higher calorie foods. But gaining weight while eating high calorie foods isn't a guaranteed thing. Between about 2000 and 2005, when I was cycling 10,000 km/year + walking + cross-country skiing + snowshoeing + weightlifting ... I look for the highest calorie foods I could find just to slow the weight loss I experienced each summer.

It's all a balance ... what you eat vs. what you burn. CICO.
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Old 07-26-16, 12:37 AM
  #125  
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Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest
There are a couple things going on here. I'm not disputing any of what you say. But there's an important distinction that's getting lost here.

Under the rules of reality, the only way to lose fat/weight (without surgery) is to maintain a calorie deficit.

In practice, there are many ways to go about doing that. Some are going to be more successful than others, depending on the person doing it.

Carbs aren't what make people fat, it's calories. But a lot of people really enjoy carbs, and for some people, it's easier to reduce total calories with a blanket restriction, similar to what you've done. Just like some people need to swear alcohol off entirely, while others can have it in moderation. But this is highly individual and, unlike calories in calories out, doesn't apply to all people as a blanket rule.

I lost the weight I had been slowly putting on more than a year ago, and have kept it off pretty effortlessly. I did that eating a high carb diet. At this point I'm deliberately trying to put weight on, I started counting macros yesterday to make sure my protein intake is what it should be. I ate 5,000 kCals yesterday and it was a struggle. I'm tired of eating and don't know how I'm going to do this for the next three months.

For me personally, I find satiety comes from protein and carbs, in that order. Fat does little to contribute. Other people have different results.
Originally Posted by OBoile
Good post.

To summarize:
Weight loss is achieved by consuming fewer calories than you burn.
There are many ways to achieve this and individual people may have different optimal approaches.
Weight loss, while correlated with improvements in health, is not the same as being healthy.
Thus, a strategy like eating a low-calorie McDonald's diet may cause to you to lose weight (and possibly gain some health benefits), but affect your health negatively in other different ways.
+1

I also lost my 25 kg/55 lbs on a high carb diet. The bulk of my calories were carbs, next up was protein, and last but not least, fat. (Approx. 60%, 24%, 15%) And that worked for me. I lost the weight and I felt relatively comfortable doing it ... not deprived or anything. I've kept it off since just before Christmas, so that's a good start.

Other percentages work for other people.


And I hear you, Seattle Forrest, about the 5000 cal/day. I mentioned above that between 2000 and 2005, I had to eat a lot and went out seeking high calorie foods. It is really tiresome eating that much ... it gets old very quickly.
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