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Question about Leg Shaving

Old 07-15-21, 07:35 AM
  #51  
GhostRider62
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Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
In absolute terms, yes. Proportionally, no. If you're doing time trials and racing, you'll probably notice it. Other kinds of riding, probably not.

I really think some of this is coming down to how much leg hair you actually have, that .02 figure is an average of some sample. My leg hair is naturally very short and a bit sparse, I honestly don't think I'd see much difference if they were completely smooth.
Who notices what isn't measured. OP seems to be more of a racer-type. Most recreational riders don't notice how slow they are on Gators. Aerodynamics are everything for a racer.

If I am doing a TT, why would I care about the proportional advantages to a 50 minute racer. I only care about my modest TT result and improving my result, the simple fact is most riders mistakenly think aerodynamic benefits only make a difference when riding fast when in fact, the benefit is greater to them because they are out there longer.
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Old 07-15-21, 07:37 AM
  #52  
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I don't shave mine because the wife would think I was living life on the down low. She's ok with a little manscaping here and there, but that's about it. I also make sure I don't carry any hanky's or bandanas sticking out of my back pockets for others to see.

Last edited by seypat; 07-15-21 at 07:54 AM.
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Old 07-15-21, 07:39 AM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
Just once, I'd like to see this argument be based on figures that don't come from someone who was trying to sell a product.
Would you believe my calculations?

This is really simple math. Like 8th grade. Honestly

Here is a calculator to play around with....

https://www.gribble.org/cycling/power_v_speed.html
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Old 07-15-21, 07:43 AM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by GhostRider62 View Post
Who notices what isn't measured. OP seems to be more of a racer-type. Most recreational riders don't notice how slow they are on Gators. Aerodynamics are everything for a racer.

If I am doing a TT, why would I care about the proportional advantages to a 50 minute racer. I only care about my modest TT result and improving my result, the simple fast most riders mistakenly think aerodynamic benefits only make a difference when riding fast when in fact, the benefit is greater to them because they are out there longer.

I get the reasoning, I think it's dubious. If I'm capping out at 15 mph, it's less likely that it's wind resistance that's holding me back. I have no idea what speed OP is traveling at,

BTW, I think this is usually a bang for the buck argument because the aero versions of things tend to be much more expensive. In this instance, shaving is pretty much free, so even if the benefit is actually small proportionately, it might be worth the time to do it..
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Old 07-15-21, 07:53 AM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by Koyote View Post
Damn. I grew a beard so that I could quit shaving… Now you’re showing me this?
Damn, the beard will have to go and I will have to trim my ear hairs, too!
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Old 07-15-21, 07:58 AM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by Koyote View Post
Take it with a grain of salt. Aerodynamic drag grows as the square of speed. In other words, if you are doing the 40k tt at a high speed, yeah, you might realize some real gains from shaving. At mere mortal speeds, you'll get smaller gains.

For context, this guy set a world record in the 4k Pursuit, and did it without shaving off that 'stache:

A stache of that magnitude obviously makes you much faster. It is very aero and the wind gods recognize awesomeness !!
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Old 07-15-21, 07:59 AM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
I get the reasoning, I think it's dubious. If I'm capping out at 15 mph, it's less likely that it's wind resistance that's holding me back. I have no idea what speed OP is traveling at,

BTW, I think this is usually a bang for the buck argument because the aero versions of things tend to be much more expensive. In this instance, shaving is pretty much free, so even if the benefit is actually small proportionately, it might be worth the time to do it..
Read some of the links or not, you are wrong.

"According to Ballard: “Aerodynamic drag becomes the largest resistance a rider must overcome from 15kph onwards.”"

"“Aero matters even more to amateur riders at modest speeds, because although their speed and drag is less in absolute terms they will save more time because they are slower and on the course longer.”"

https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/l...-weight-316952
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Old 07-15-21, 08:00 AM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by Bowie Beattie View Post
do we really talk about shaving here
You bet! It's one of the most hotly contested arguments in road cycling.
It's always amusing when the shavers start quoting pseudo-scientific data to justify their habit (cyclists in general are experts in scientific data). I still feel the shavers simply enjoy shaving their legs and use all kinds of data and anecdotal reasoning to back it up. Seems like a colossal effort to try to gain 1 second of speed (if you believe it improves aerodynamics), or to make it slightly easier to apply sunscreen or to remove dirt. I can understand if you are an exceptionally hairy person that all that hair might be uncomfortable under bibs, so I'll grant that one...but again, if you are that hairy I can't imagine how difficult and time-consuming it would be to shave all the way up to your taint. I shave my chest, so who am I to criticize? I'm not particularly hairy, so it's very easy to do a couple times a week and the wife likes it that way.
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Old 07-15-21, 08:07 AM
  #59  
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I didn't read all the replies cuz it seems like some folks were getting butthurt, so I'll just add my .02

I epilate my legs because I like it. Everything is smooth, it's easy to wipe off grime and since I also mountain bike, easier to clean scrapes and cuts. I like the looks too as my leg hair grows in all weird so removing it all is favorable. Speed? Well I'm not that fast to be worried about that little bit of time.
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Old 07-15-21, 08:11 AM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by GhostRider62 View Post
I am not making that point, sitting still isn't very fast.

Think of it this way, you get your biggest bang (time savings for energy output) when the forces are linear against you.

When you are going very fast, it takes a massive effort to go just a little bit faster. The gains are harder and harder to achieve as the speed increases. When you are going slower, it is easier to make improvements resulting in shorter times or alternatively, you can ride just the same speed with lower power levels. If you are going 5 mph, a 10% increase in power will get you 10% increase in speed. At 30 mph, that same 10% increase in power will only yield about 3% increase in speed. Where aero losses really mount depends on the rider/bike combination but it is lower than many assume....maybe 15 mph
That smaller proportional impact of aero gains at higher speeds is precisely because aero drag increases exponentially with speed. Hmm.

I'm gonna go for a ride and try to wrap my head around this.
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Old 07-15-21, 08:13 AM
  #61  
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Originally Posted by bowie beattie View Post
do we really respond to trolls here?

fify
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Old 07-15-21, 08:34 AM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by pgjackson View Post
It's stupid. Don't do it. There is no reason to do it despite what some people here say. Never had a problem applying sunscreen to my hairy legs, or got overly dirty on a ride...and it certainly didn't add one second to any ride. It's nonsense.
Yeah, well, you know, that's just like, your opinion, man.
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Old 07-15-21, 08:36 AM
  #63  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
Yeah, well, you know, that's just like, your opinion, man.
Yep. That is what the OP asked for.
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Old 07-15-21, 08:40 AM
  #64  
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Originally Posted by Koyote View Post
You shave your ass? Or do you have your manservant do it for you? 😁
If you are seeking a job application, you should probably move it to the commerce section of the forum.
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Old 07-15-21, 08:41 AM
  #65  
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Originally Posted by Koyote View Post
Take it with a grain of salt. Aerodynamic drag grows as the square of speed. In other words, if you are doing the 40k tt at a high speed, yeah, you might realize some real gains from shaving. At mere mortal speeds, you'll get smaller gains.

For context, this guy set a world record in the 4k Pursuit, and did it without shaving off that 'stache:

The same series of Specialized videos that proved there was an aero benefit to shaved legs also proved that there's no aero benefit to shaved facial hair.

Also Ashton and literally every track cyclist shave their legs.

To the OP -- do it or don't do it because you want to. Aero benefits are probably trivial at the amateur level but if you want to do it because it looks and feels good that's perfectly valid, despite what some easily triggered insecure people on this thread seem to believe.
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Old 07-15-21, 08:45 AM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by Koyote View Post
That smaller proportional impact of aero gains at higher speeds is precisely because aero drag increases exponentially with speed. Hmm.

I'm gonna go for a ride and try to wrap my head around this.
Conversely, the larger time impact is at slower speeds, which is opposite of what many incorrectly believe.

Who needs a clean chain, it isn't noticeable. Who needs fast tires, it isn't noticeable. Who need tight clothing, it isn't noticeable. Who needs aero wheels, it isn't noticeable. Frame. Helmet. And, shaved legs. Are they all marginal gains? Collectively, no. Individually, some would be difficult to measure but not impossible.

I have to admit the extent of time saving for shaven legs is a bit surprising.

Enjoy your ride, I am waiting for the heat to go out
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Old 07-15-21, 08:46 AM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
Yeah, well, you know, that's just like, your opinion, man.
Originally Posted by pgjackson View Post
Yep. That is what the OP asked for.
You're out of your element!
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Old 07-15-21, 08:48 AM
  #68  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
You're out of your element!
Not sure what that means. I'm an avid road cyclist and chose to not shave. My opinion is just as valid as yours.
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Old 07-15-21, 09:00 AM
  #69  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
You're out of your element!
Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
Yeah, well, you know, that's just like, your opinion, man.
​​​​​
Originally Posted by pgjackson View Post
Not sure what that means. I'm an avid road cyclist and chose to not shave. My opinion is just as valid as yours.
References to a classic and hilarious movie, the Big Lebowski:


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Old 07-15-21, 09:03 AM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by ksryder View Post
The same series of Specialized videos that proved there was an aero benefit to shaved legs also proved that there's no aero benefit to shaved facial hair.
Yup, legs churn in the wind, unlike your face, and have a less aerodynamic shape as a whole, so shaving them is much, much more beneficial.

Plus my legs look damn sexy when smooth.
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Old 07-15-21, 09:09 AM
  #71  
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Aero gains are Proportionately greater for slower riders because much smaller gains are applied for longer amounts of time.

They also means less for most slower riders because the gains are so microscopically small. I have heard between 15-18 mph where aero completely dominates weight and tire drag and all that ..... So with my current average being below 15 mph, and the idea that I could save 0.00000000017 seconds over four hours ...... (Note I said "most" slower riders. If you are the exception, I have accepted you. Calm down.)

It's like the "Every microgram matters" debate. Yes, mathematically, every microgram reduction results in less energy needed for every speed but when the gains are too small to measure anywhere outside a laboratory ....... I am not going to shave the inside of my water bottles to lighten them.

Of course, shaving started way before cyclists started testing in wind tunnels ....

You know what's funny (as I watch Stage 18 .... ) it seems most riders don't bother to wear the most aerodynamic sunglasses. And when they climb HC mountains on hot days they open their jerseys. Horrors!!!! The massive aero drag!!!!!!!

I hope they all shave their chests.
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Old 07-15-21, 09:15 AM
  #72  
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Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
"Are you feeling grungy...punk?"
"Does it have five blades, or six?"
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Old 07-15-21, 09:17 AM
  #73  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs View Post
And when they climb HC mountains on hot days they open their jerseys. Horrors!!!! The massive aero drag!!!!!!!
It's obviously less of an issue at slower speeds, like when climbing and/or when the need to dissipate heat is greater, but yes, open and unzipped jerseys are a massive aero drag. IIRC, once RChung measured the drag of his partially unzipped jersey, he made a point of no longer partially unzipping his jersey.
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Old 07-15-21, 09:22 AM
  #74  
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Odd to me when amateur's shave. I totally get it with the pros but if you aren't a pro cyclist?? weird
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Old 07-15-21, 09:24 AM
  #75  
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Originally Posted by seypat View Post
Looking at his stache, he might have another career that requires performing in his birthday suit. He probably shaves his legs for that reason.
****. i want that jersey
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