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"HOLE!" Don't be that guy

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"HOLE!" Don't be that guy

Old 07-19-21, 06:20 AM
  #1  
Zaskar
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"HOLE!" Don't be that guy

Calling out holes in a group is a good thing. But doing so without pointing is close to useless. A hand signal - even silent (but combo is ideal) - works so much better. The point, the gravel sign, move left, etc. just so much more helpful. When I hear "HOLE!" without any L/R indication, I hear "Get ready to bunnyhop" (which I avoid at all costs, that royally screws the riders behind me).
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Old 07-19-21, 06:24 AM
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Ride up front.... where it's safer.
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Old 07-19-21, 06:29 AM
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How big was your group and how experienced were the riders in it? We don't ''yell'' things when we're group riding unless it's an imminent danger. We just point and make signs that everyone understands.
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Old 07-19-21, 07:31 AM
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Is someone doing this consistently or just once in a blue moon? I can see someone calling out a hazard, without hand gestures to communicate location, if they've been caught off guard and they need both hands on the bars to maneuver around it, themselves.
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Old 07-19-21, 07:37 AM
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Originally Posted by eduskator View Post
How big was your group and how experienced were the riders in it? We don't ''yell'' things when we're group riding unless it's an imminent danger. We just point and make signs that everyone understands.
Proper! Too much yelling anymore.
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Old 07-19-21, 07:44 AM
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If you are ever riding in a position where you can't easily see and avoid road hazards on your own maybe that's not all that safe to begin with.
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Old 07-19-21, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
Is someone doing this consistently or just once in a blue moon? I can see someone calling out a hazard, without hand gestures to communicate location, if they've been caught off guard and they need both hands on the bars to maneuver around it, themselves.
I've done that, just yell out because there is no time to point.
It also sucks when a rider ahead hits a rock and it is rolling around when I get there.
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Old 07-19-21, 08:41 AM
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Next time, hit the hole one-handed so you can point at it with your other hand while remaining silent.. or we're going to yell at you!
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Old 07-19-21, 09:04 AM
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If one is riding in a reasonably sized group, voice is important because the people 5-6 wheels back aren't going to see your hand signal and the people who see the hand signal may not have time to signal by hand either because the hazard is coming by too fast or because they need both their hands to handle their bikes as they and the group move around the hazard.

You do what you can do, but the whole group will hear what you call out, whereas only 2-4 will see your hand signal.
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Old 07-19-21, 09:07 AM
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Agreed. I've ranted about this before.

Most do OK pointing and avoiding hazards, but the few seem committed to the blood-curdling yell.
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Old 07-19-21, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
If you are ever riding in a position where you can't easily see and avoid road hazards on your own maybe that's not all that safe to begin with.
well yes, group rides are inherently dangerous. It's not a "safe" sport but you can do things to make it safer like acting predictable. Screaming hole isn't predictable but I've been guilty of it lol.
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Old 07-19-21, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by woodcraft View Post
Agreed. I've ranted about this before.

Most do OK pointing and avoiding hazards, but the few seem committed to the blood-curdling yell.
How about the blood curdling "car back" for EVERY car that comes by? There are times when it's appropriate, of course.
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Old 07-19-21, 09:29 AM
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What’s the deal with bunny hops? It’s just a z-axis swerve. Sometimes necessary, it shouldn’t cause any issues for riders around you.
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Old 07-19-21, 09:32 AM
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Sorry, I don't get it. And what's your hand signal for when there is a sudden unexpected stop? You don't like it when people yell out then, either?

The other day in a fast pace line, somebody had a sudden mechanical and it sent a shockwave through the line. Everybody managed to brake or swerve -fortunately, there was no curb and a grassy shoulder - and nobody went down. Although most of the "saves" were just people being aware and knowing how to handle their bikes, several loud calls of "slowing!" surely helped.

I do agree that on a bad road where there is pothole after pothole, there's no need to call out all of them. Once everybody knows that the road is crap, they can be on the lookout.
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Old 07-19-21, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by caloso View Post
What’s the deal with bunny hops? It’s just a z-axis swerve. Sometimes necessary, it shouldn’t cause any issues for riders around you.
It's hard to imagine a bunny hop that doesn't produce a momentary slowing unless you were already putting negligible power to the pedals. Usually not a big deal I admit, but it can affect other riders.
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Old 07-19-21, 09:38 AM
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At a recent "Ride Leader's" meeting of my club, people argued for 30 minutes about whether you should point out a hole or yell it out, or both, or neither. There was no way everyone was going to agree.

Like most situations, the best answer is "it depends on many variables, and use your best judgement."

Sometimes you can't take your hands off the bar to point, based on what the road conditions. I agree yelling out is sometimes quite disruptive but realize that people in back may not see the pointing.
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Old 07-19-21, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
Sorry, I don't get it. And what's your hand signal for when there is a sudden unexpected stop? You don't like it when people yell out then, either?

The other day in a fast pace line, somebody had a sudden mechanical and it sent a shockwave through the line. Everybody managed to brake or swerve -fortunately, there was no curb and a grassy shoulder - and nobody went down. Although most of the "saves" were just people being aware and knowing how to handle their bikes, several loud calls of "slowing!" surely helped.

I do agree that on a bad road where there is pothole after pothole, there's no need to call out all of them. Once everybody knows that the road is crap, they can be on the lookout.

The difference is that when calling out slowing or stopping, it's pretty clear what to do, whereas "hole" tells you nothing about what to do, except maybe brace for a damaged rim.
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Old 07-19-21, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by woodcraft View Post
The difference is that when calling out slowing or stopping, it's pretty clear what to do, whereas "hole" tells you nothing about what to do, except maybe brace for a damaged rim.
I agree that pointing gives more info than yelling "hole", but as already noted, not everybody sees the hand gesture and what the voice call does is get people to look down and ahead, when they might not otherwise be at that moment. Don't tell me that in a good group everybody has all of their attention on the road in front of them 100% of the time. That's not true.

Also, the reaction time is slower for a hand gesture than for vocalizing.

The two are not mutually exclusive and as I said earlier, you do what you can do.

Last edited by MinnMan; 07-19-21 at 11:05 AM.
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Old 07-19-21, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
I agree that pointing gives more info than yelling "hole", but as already noted, not everybody sees the hand gesture and what the voice call does is get people to look down and ahead, when they might not otherwise be at that moment. Don't tell me that in a good group everybody has all of their attention on the road in front of them 100% of the time. That's not true.

Also, the reaction time is slower for a hand gesture than for vocalizing.

And as already noted, the hand gesture isn't that effective in big groups.

The two are not mutually exclusive and as I said earlier, you do what you can do.



I agree with this. I am much quicker to jam my head down into neck, tighten grip on bars, & randomly swerve when someone yells "HOLE", than

when someone points.
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Old 07-19-21, 12:39 PM
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If I'm trying to shake a guy that is riding in my draft, I might want him to hit the hole and crack a wheel.
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Old 07-19-21, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by datlas View Post
At a recent "Ride Leader's" meeting of my club, people argued for 30 minutes about whether you should point out a hole or yell it out, or both, or neither. There was no way everyone was going to agree.
We found it's most effective to yell at the hole.

On edit: Sorry, I thought you meant @holes.
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Old 07-19-21, 01:06 PM
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if you hit the hole hard enough, not only will your MPH will instantly drop to signal as a warning, your now faulty equipment will also serve as a warning to others behind you. Take one for the TEAM!
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Old 07-19-21, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by datlas View Post
At a recent "Ride Leader's" meeting of my club, people argued for 30 minutes...
Oh dear Lord. I bike to escape stuff like this.
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Old 07-19-21, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by goose70 View Post
Oh dear Lord. I bike to escape stuff like this.
ikr

I love my club but it's too big for its britches and it may be time to take my rides private.
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Old 07-19-21, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by datlas View Post
ikr

I love my club but it's too big for its britches and it may be time to take my rides private.
That really should be your signature.

When I first saw it, I was like
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